2018 Williams F1 Racing - Mercedes

[Manoah2u]

I thought wesley was right. I was under the impression Felipe wanted to retire in 2016. And only came back because of Rosberg/Bottas move.

Then when he was enjoying 2017 , he wanted to stay for 2018 but was dropped.

He did not want to retire in 2016, he had to make way for Stroll

Exactly. To keep honor to himself, he decided it was time to retire and not face not getting a seat for 2017 as all the spots were shut except for some career-disgraceful backmarker spots. Then Williams faced Bottas taking a hike to replace Rosberg and they found themselves in a unwanted situation and called Massa back. Now he didnt again want to leave but it's the same story again.

Massa's plan last year nor this year was to retire.

Apart from that, Williams wasn't all that happy with his performance as let's face it, it's not like he completely destroyed Stroll. Matter of fact, there's only a 3 points difference between a rookie that essentially paid for his seat and one of the most experienced drivers on the grid.

[Schuttelberg]

I thought wesley was right. I was under the impression Felipe wanted to retire in 2016. And only came back because of Rosberg/Bottas move.

Then when he was enjoying 2017 , he wanted to stay for 2018 but was dropped.

He did not want to retire in 2016, he had to make way for Stroll

Massa's plan last year nor this year was to retire.

This is an absolute fact.

In fact, had he been offered a 3 year extension, he would have signed that as well. Massa was a good driver, a tremendous sportsman spirit surrounded him and on his day (pre-accident) in a car suited to him pretty much as good as they came.

However, after his accident and Ferrari stint he came across as defeated, bitter and self pitying to abnormal lengths. He kept saying that he didn't want to hang around in Formula 1 but his Williams years are exactly that specially 2016 & 17. Everybody knew that neither him, nor Williams were going to compete for the title and considering his career trajectory, it was the only thing left for him to achieve other than bank in the dollars while he could.

[Manoah2u]

He did not want to retire in 2016, he had to make way for Stroll

Massa's plan last year nor this year was to retire.

This is an absolute fact.

In fact, had he been offered a 3 year extension, he would have signed that as well. Massa was a good driver, a tremendous sportsman spirit surrounded him and on his day (pre-accident) in a car suited to him pretty much as good as they came.

However, after his accident and Ferrari stint he came across as defeated, bitter and self pitying to abnormal lengths. He kept saying that he didn't want to hang around in Formula 1 but his Williams years are exactly that specially 2016 & 17. Everybody knew that neither him, nor Williams were going to compete for the title and considering his career trajectory, it was the only thing left for him to achieve other than bank in the dollars while he could.

definately.
Massa was supremely fast, and had a certain amount of relentlessness to him, not in a form of agression but in dedication. Indeed, after his 2009 crash that completely disappeared. I do think the loss of the WDC gave a mental hit too, as it just wasn't enough. Still, the 2009 crash altered him. Can't really blame him for that though. After that, he contineously got into silly contact battles with Hamilton and started being whiny. Then he played second fiddle and lap dog for Alonso, which obviously was a mental blow to him. He stayed way too long at Ferrari and should have moved to Mclaren imho before, or perhaps Mercedes if he had that chance.
2014 Williams was a great year and great moment but somehow it disappeared just as easy. Shame really.

[NathanOlder]

I think 2008 took a huge amount out of him also. Remembering that final showdown in his home country was also his last ever win. I think the 2 events, Brazil 08 and Hungary 09 both had completely different effects on him, but both contributed massively to Massa losing his "edge"

[RonDennis]

Sirotkin's budget is twice as high as that of Kubica according to Robert Doornbos. He also said that Sirotkin performed better in Abu Dhabi.

[Raleigh]

Wasn't just 2014, Massa drove well in 2015, only last year did he really start to drop away from Valteri's performance.

Call it loss of motivation, not enjoying the traction limited cars, Williams' own falling performance, not to mention everyone knew Lance was being lined up to replace him.

And then he came back strong in 2017. Drove well, got some good points, showed he still knew how to fight wheel-to-wheel. Could have had a 2nd place or perhaps even a win barring the mechanical failure in Baku (I know, there was a lot of luck for Williams to be even on the podium that race, but it could have happened). Right to the end of the season still driving well, maybe he got passed by Alonso on cold tires in coming out of the pits in Abu Dhabi but anyone remember that race-long fight with Alonso in Brazil where Massa came out ahead?

If you could have swapped any driver on the grid into that Williams for 2017 perhaps only 2-3 would have done significantly better than Massa.

My concerns with him leading the team were not about the here-and-now performance (he was doing as well as the car deserved), rather that given the choice of Massa for another year (perhaps 2) before his inevitable retirement or Kubica for 3-4 years leading and building up the team Kubica seemed like the obvious choice because Kubica is younger and hungrier.

Not necessarily faster, just younger, still with a lot of ambition and more likely to be around longer.

[Nickel]

If you could have swapped any driver on the grid into that Williams for 2017 perhaps only 2-3 would have done significantly better than Massa.

Such discussions will always be a matter of opinion but I disagree with this. I think many would have outperformed him. Given the choice of anyone on the grid, there are at least 8 drivers, probably 10 who would have easily had the better of Massa this year.

[marmer]

While still not perfect i think it's reasonable to say he is slower than kimi,bottas and Alonso who all did better jobs when at the same team. Only Alonso regularly beats his teammate so vettal and Hamilton are also faster than massa. So this puts him a maximum 5th fastest. Riccardo has beaten vettel over a season so perhaps he is faster than massa and vestapen has beaten Riccardo so that makes Massa 7th But actually saying he is slower than anyone else is hard to prove in the last ten years he has only had those 3 teammates.

[Manoah2u]

If i have to make a wild guess, i'd think (daddy) Stroll doesn't want Massa for another year outperforming (even though it was by a margin and the points difference is mostly due to Stroll coming in 2nd in Baku whereas Massa would have won that GP if his car didn't break down, DannyRic never would have catched him) Lance, and despite Massa not being as good as he once was, he still is consistant. Hiring Sirotkin or Palmer could happen still, and would be guaranteed to have them finish behind Stroll. The money isn't needed. Sure, every million is a benefit, but it's not as like they're in such dire need. I think Wehrlein would be too much of a danger in beating Stroll, and additionally because Wehrlein is a diva, and finally being a Mercedes protegé will keep vital information to himself to form an edge over his teammate which won't be taken lightly. Rumours are that is what happened at Sauber and i can see it happening (in this case tires, in a williams case it could be both tires and engine due to the Mercedes link). Had Stroll not been there, i'm 100% sure Wehrlein would have been there alongside Massa.

[NathanOlder]

I bet daddy Stroll wishes he had another son to put in the other car

[continuum16]

I think Williams deserves the benefit of the doubt in regards to their reasons for choosing Stroll's teammate. Yes, it is very easy to say it will go to the highest bidder, but I believe Paddy doesn't think like that. Personally, they should have put Stroll as reserve this year and given him more time to mature. He has shown flashes of brilliance, most notably in that qualifying session in Monza; where he was quicker than Massa, the Ferraris, Bottas, and Force Indias. However, he was a bit rushed into the sport and needs to improve his quali speed. 2017 Williams should have initially intended to continue with Massa/Bottas and then sign Wehrlein in place of Bottas.

Next year they have the ability to pick anyone in the world with a superlicense and I think they will take their time. I personally think that nobody is off the table in terms of consideration, and would not be surprised if they drop an absolute bombshell, because they are playing their cards very close to their chest and rightly so. That said, I subjectively don't want it it be Sirotkin because I don't think he's really a known quantity, but this is most likely the case and there is potential. I'd like to see them just pull an absolute shocker, but sadly those days are over.

[NathanOlder]

Kubica apparently offering Williams 7mill for 7 races as a trial. If he sucks they can replace him, if he's good he can stay.

Sounds like win win for williams and us fans.

[dren]

Now that's an interesting proposition. Yes, a big win win. The marketing they'll get out of Kubica will be great.

[kptaylor]

Good deal if true! If Sirotkin's backers don't mind a wait Williams should take that deal so they could get all the money. If Kubica proves himself fit then no harm except to Sirotkin unless they sign him as a reserve driver and still get his money.

[FrukostScones]

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/13360 ... for-stroll

So only fast when the car driven in cruise mode. What does it tell us. Anybody that has seen the pace difference of 2017 qualy laps and race pace laps with his own eyes at the track knows how he would do in a refueling Formula.
Means, In qualy the car is just too fast for his talent.