Bahrain testing 2025: lessons from the road

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Cs98
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Re: Bahrain testing 2025: lessons from the road

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Seanspeed wrote:
28 Feb 2025, 12:49
JPower wrote:
28 Feb 2025, 02:13
Antonelli's calling card is his race pace and consistency. I don't see why people are doubting his capabilities in a test environment.
Any professional racing driver can do consistent laps. I dont know why anybody would be impressed with that. And especially in a race sim situation where there's a lot of 'driving to a delta', it would be massively problematic if even a driver with nothing but F4 experience couldn't put a string of laps together with any kind of decent consistency in that situation.
Consistency yes, but not consistently fast. The first sign of a mediocre F1 driver is their inability to maintain a fast race pace due to dropping the tyres.

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organic
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Re: Bahrain testing 2025: lessons from the road

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Seanspeed wrote:
28 Feb 2025, 12:49
JPower wrote:
28 Feb 2025, 02:13
Antonelli's calling card is his race pace and consistency. I don't see why people are doubting his capabilities in a test environment.
Any professional racing driver can do consistent laps. I dont know why anybody would be impressed with that. And especially in a race sim situation where there's a lot of 'driving to a delta', it would be massively problematic if even a driver with nothing but F4 experience couldn't put a string of laps together with any kind of decent consistency in that situation.
And yet lots of rookies arrive and they are wildly inconsistent and can't manage the tyres when they first join F1

JPower
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Re: Bahrain testing 2025: lessons from the road

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Seanspeed wrote:
28 Feb 2025, 12:49
JPower wrote:
28 Feb 2025, 02:13
Antonelli's calling card is his race pace and consistency. I don't see why people are doubting his capabilities in a test environment.

Any professional racing driver can do consistent laps.
I dont know why anybody would be impressed with that. And especially in a race sim situation where there's a lot of 'driving to a delta', it would be massively problematic if even a driver with nothing but F4 experience couldn't put a string of laps together with any kind of decent consistency in that situation.
In an F1 car that requires an almost arcane feeling and knowledge of tires, no they can't. :lol:

We've watched Piastri struggle with tire management for two years now.

FittingMechanics
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Re: Bahrain testing 2025: lessons from the road

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organic wrote:
28 Feb 2025, 14:04
Seanspeed wrote:
28 Feb 2025, 12:49
JPower wrote:
28 Feb 2025, 02:13
Antonelli's calling card is his race pace and consistency. I don't see why people are doubting his capabilities in a test environment.
Any professional racing driver can do consistent laps. I dont know why anybody would be impressed with that. And especially in a race sim situation where there's a lot of 'driving to a delta', it would be massively problematic if even a driver with nothing but F4 experience couldn't put a string of laps together with any kind of decent consistency in that situation.
And yet lots of rookies arrive and they are wildly inconsistent and can't manage the tyres when they first join F1
It's always about the pace. Most who come to F1 can be consistent if he is not pushing 100%. But most of them have to push as hard as possible because their teammates are faster and this is where inconsistency starts to appear.

JPower
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Re: Bahrain testing 2025: lessons from the road

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Tire deg on the Williams seems well controlled. Albon did a 22 lap C3 run and dropped about a half second over the stint.

The car is looking very well rounded this test. Same with Alpine.

Seanspeed
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Re: Bahrain testing 2025: lessons from the road

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SB15 wrote:
28 Feb 2025, 12:57
Seanspeed wrote:
28 Feb 2025, 12:49
JPower wrote:
28 Feb 2025, 02:13
Antonelli's calling card is his race pace and consistency. I don't see why people are doubting his capabilities in a test environment.
Any professional racing driver can do consistent laps. I dont know why anybody would be impressed with that. And especially in a race sim situation where there's a lot of 'driving to a delta', it would be massively problematic if even a driver with nothing but F4 experience couldn't put a string of laps together with any kind of decent consistency in that situation.
Any professional driver can do consistent laps but not at the rate that Antonelli is doing. There is no doubt that he's a very fast driver especially when you consider his age at only 18. He's only going to get much better in the future similar to how Verstappen was.
We have very little clue how 'fast' his times actually are in relation to what the car can do.

I'm not saying anything negative about him, just that 'he can do consistent laps' in this instance doesn't really mean anything. Of course he can, he's a professional racing driver.

The difference between a good and a lousy F1 driver can be just like 3-4 tenths of general pace. So we'll have to see him in an actual competitive situation where these differences actually matter to see where he's at.

Seanspeed
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Re: Bahrain testing 2025: lessons from the road

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JPower wrote:
28 Feb 2025, 14:15
Seanspeed wrote:
28 Feb 2025, 12:49
JPower wrote:
28 Feb 2025, 02:13
Antonelli's calling card is his race pace and consistency. I don't see why people are doubting his capabilities in a test environment.

Any professional racing driver can do consistent laps.
I dont know why anybody would be impressed with that. And especially in a race sim situation where there's a lot of 'driving to a delta', it would be massively problematic if even a driver with nothing but F4 experience couldn't put a string of laps together with any kind of decent consistency in that situation.
In an F1 car that requires an almost arcane feeling and knowledge of tires, no they can't. :lol:

We've watched Piastri struggle with tire management for two years now.
I can go and look at race lap times for Piastri and see he's 100% capable of doing lengthy, consistent stints. It's not anything special.

Just a super quick example, like the very first I just quickly looked up:

https://en.mclarenf-1.com/2024/gp/s9273/lap_times

Being consistent is in and of itself pretty meaningless without knowing the actual competitiveness of the times in a competitive situation.

Seanspeed
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Re: Bahrain testing 2025: lessons from the road

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organic wrote:
28 Feb 2025, 14:04
Seanspeed wrote:
28 Feb 2025, 12:49
JPower wrote:
28 Feb 2025, 02:13
Antonelli's calling card is his race pace and consistency. I don't see why people are doubting his capabilities in a test environment.
Any professional racing driver can do consistent laps. I dont know why anybody would be impressed with that. And especially in a race sim situation where there's a lot of 'driving to a delta', it would be massively problematic if even a driver with nothing but F4 experience couldn't put a string of laps together with any kind of decent consistency in that situation.
And yet lots of rookies arrive and they are wildly inconsistent and can't manage the tyres when they first join F1
In a race sim situation, any rookie can do a lengthy consistent stint, too. If they cant, they shouldn't have even gotten through F3, let alone gotten to F1.

Also, the car/setup/team matters massively when it comes to tire wear. Learning to maximize tires over a stint is certainly a skill, but again, we have no idea what the car is truly capable of to judge against in testing like this. We need to see this stuff in a competitive environment to see whether they're actually actually getting the most out of the car or whether they're just putting in mediocre, consistent times.

JPower
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Re: Bahrain testing 2025: lessons from the road

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Seanspeed wrote:
28 Feb 2025, 15:44


I can go and look at race lap times for Piastri and see he's 100% capable of doing lengthy, consistent stints. It's not anything special.

Just a super quick example, like the very first I just quickly looked up:

https://en.mclarenf-1.com/2024/gp/s9273/lap_times

Being consistent is in and of itself pretty meaningless without knowing the actual competitiveness of the times in a competitive situation.
I didn't say Piastri wasn't capable of it.

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langedweil
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Re: Bahrain testing 2025: lessons from the road

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Hmm, no rules in testing ofcourse, but still hmmm
HuggaWugga !

TeamKoolGreen
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Re: Bahrain testing 2025: lessons from the road

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Another Williams glory run or are they for real ? Williams are well clear of the lower half of the field

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vanburin
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Re: Bahrain testing 2025: lessons from the road

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TeamKoolGreen wrote:
28 Feb 2025, 16:49
Another Williams glory run or are they for real ? Williams are well clear of the lower half of the field
It really wouldn't be pre-season testing if there wasn't a Williams glory run, now would it!

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Re: Bahrain testing 2025: lessons from the road

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venkyhere
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Re: Bahrain testing 2025: lessons from the road

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It was impossible for me to watch the sessions live (waste of entire day) , I watched in 2-3 bursts of 10-15mins by using the time slider in the live broadcast, over most sessions.
Takeaways :
- laptimes dont mean anything, too many variables at play
- body language of the "big four" cars from the onboards and external cameras :
a) all of them were sandbagging with engine modes and fuel loads.
b) McLaren looks most stable and 'neutral' without over/understeer and good rotation in slow speed
c) Mercedes looked stable in the hands of Russel (expected) and was understeering in some slow corners (1,4,8), despite the impression I got that of these big four teams, Merc were running the least sandbagging.
d) Ferrari was fast, but didn't give the impression it was 'stable'. Commentators were having verbal diarrhoea about how well Hamilton has adapted to the car - I didn't find that to be the case from his onboards, especially when compared to LeClerc. He still has to learn the car.
e) Redbull looked like the kid who managed to finish his homework at the last minute. Never really had a proper long run, they were all burst stints. Plus, didn't find them running the harder C1/C2 compounds much at all. In the final 15-20mins of last session, car looked like rotating well in the slow corners (1,4,8) thus solving a fundamental problem with the car since 2022. Other than that, didn't look particularly well settled, Max was sawing at the wheel and was fighting the car (even on the 1.29.xxx laps) , which is the exact opposite of how comfortably Norris was driving the McLaren.

TeamKoolGreen
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Re: Bahrain testing 2025: lessons from the road

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venkyhere wrote:
28 Feb 2025, 19:53
It was impossible for me to watch the sessions live (waste of entire day) , I watched in 2-3 bursts of 10-15mins by using the time slider in the live broadcast, over most sessions.
Takeaways :
- laptimes dont mean anything, too many variables at play
- body language of the "big four" cars from the onboards and external cameras :
a) all of them were sandbagging with engine modes and fuel loads.
b) McLaren looks most stable and 'neutral' without over/understeer and good rotation in slow speed
c) Mercedes looked stable in the hands of Russel (expected) and was understeering in some slow corners (1,4,8), despite the impression I got that of these big four teams, Merc were running the least sandbagging.
d) Ferrari was fast, but didn't give the impression it was 'stable'. Commentators were having verbal diarrhoea about how well Hamilton has adapted to the car - I didn't find that to be the case from his onboards, especially when compared to LeClerc. He still has to learn the car.
e) Redbull looked like the kid who managed to finish his homework at the last minute. Never really had a proper long run, they were all burst stints. Plus, didn't find them running the harder C1/C2 compounds much at all. In the final 15-20mins of last session, car looked like rotating well in the slow corners (1,4,8) thus solving a fundamental problem with the car since 2022. Other than that, didn't look particularly well settled, Max was sawing at the wheel and was fighting the car (even on the 1.29.xxx laps) , which is the exact opposite of how comfortably Norris was driving the McLaren.
I pretty much agree with this. Since 2022, Red Bull has showed up at testing like the kid who's done their homework a week early. The trouble at the top after Dietric passed is being felt. And it isn't just about Newey leaving.