2016 McLaren F1 Team - Honda

[ollandos]

i say about huge fuel save on first race ...and every other take me like person from other planet.....on normal pace mclaren gap from 1st place is 0.8-1.25 sec .....with fuel save another 0.5-0.8sec ....i think this problem hold back honda for power upgrades....

[McG]

It's just a terrible engine. Thought the fuel upgrade and turbo upgrade would sort it out but it didn't. Only thing keeping it from last place is that the engine is in a McLaren.

[Andres125sx]

I think part of it has to do with them just debuting the new turbo, fuel and some new chassis upgrades. They haven't really been able to maximize the potential of their new upgrades. Remember when Force India introduced their B-Spec update last year in Silverstone, it took them a few races to really get on top of their upgrades.

This.

Also, someone from Mobil stated their new fuel will bring more improvements with hardware changes, so it´s not just the fuel, the ICE must be adapted to it too, and they didn´t do it yet

[Andres125sx]

The biggest problem with Mclaren now is the team. They just have been second rate running the team during race weekends all season.This past race they took a gamble with a wet setup(high df/drag and soft springs) and only one stop.(the only team to do this) That cost Alonso a points finish.

The Car and PU is solid mid-field now.(should be scoring points every race )

Is it because...

1)they have the wrong people?
or
2)over thinking it?

Maybe they don´t care about scoring 1 or 2 points and they prefer a risky bet wich, if correct, might push them much further ahead?

Just a guess, but it would make sense I think

[fellowhoodlums]

I think the big token spend for Spa/Silverstone will exploit the Turbo and Fuel updates we've just seen in Canada.

After that it's all about software changes, mapping etc to exploit it to the max.

Disappointing Canada, no question, but with wet weather set up and long pit stop taken into consideration, not the backward step it looked on paper.

The question is where is the engine deficit? Is it the ICU or the turbo/MGU-H ? I think MGU-K is fine. If 2 tokens were spent on a new turbo then Honda thinking that's that sorted for the season or that's it ready for the ICU update and Canada used to prove reliability. Leaves the ICU as the issue and that pre-ignition technology being discussed.

Ferrari had a big big jump this in-season so why can't Honda?

[McG]

Honda need to come clean and scrap this engine and focus on next years engine with at least 2 cars going around Suzuka 24/7 or as much as they can. And they need to allow help from McLaren.

Unless they are absolutely sure that this years years upgrades will be helpfull for creating a beast next year, then the next few years will be a disappointment for McLaren.

[diffuser]

Considering where Honda started and the token system limitation they are doing a good job. Unfortunate we need to wait another year before they can just change whatever they feel they need when they feel they need.

[McG]

Considering where Honda started and the token system limitation they are doing a good job. Unfortunate we need to wait another year before they can just change whatever they feel they need when they feel they need.

I know. That's why I said they should be real world testing at home rather than using only limited tokens. They could slap together a test car no probs.

Maybe McLaren are quite happy that they can sustain their company while not winning races. Not that they would ever say that of course. Even if they would just admit they are on a 5 year plan or something it would make it easier for fans.

[CjC]

Mclaren surely are on a 5 year plan.
Every time a new team/partnership come to the sport it takes them 4 years to become competitve.

Mercedes.
Red bull.

Atleast next season honda can throw new engine designs into the back of the car willy nilly till they get one that works.
Don't hope for a title push next season guys. Just saying.....

[mrluke]

Last 5 laps Alonso did not save fuel....engine is the worst on the grid whit least power...but super poor effcienty is even more of a problem than pure power.

Good info and gave me an idea,

Here is a graph comparing the laptimes of Alonso and Kvyat, now i'll admit I didn't pay a huge amount of attention to Kvyat during the race so if there is some fundamental reason this a bad comparison then please speak up.



If somebody could highlight the laps where Alonso was suffering more from fuel saving than Kvyat that would be appreciated because I cannot see them. I do not doubt that Mclaren had to manage a lot of fuel saving but is that unique to Honda? Even Rosberg stated he was well into the red and thought he was going to run out of fuel before the end of the race.

Now both drivers pitted on lap 17 but Kvyat took an extra stop on lap 44 meaning he didnt have to look after his tyres as much as Alonso. Still very difficult to separate their laptimes.

Now while I happily accept that the Honda PU is not as good as the Merc and is probably not as good as the Ferrari 2016 PU. I think it is quite comparable to the Renault and Ferrari 15 PUs. I think that Mclaren are competing with STR on merit although the STR aero / chassis appears to have an advantage at some circuits.

[Sonador]

I feel that Honda have the right people and recources in place to be succesfull.
They are humble and working flat out i believe.

Mclaren on the other hand realy need to put a sock in Boulliers mouth, and Ron Dennis (i like the guy) needs to eat a carrot or something, instead of making ridiculous statements in the press.

They are not performing, strategy wise not (yet), earodynamics not (yet) ..... ..... .... ...
I think they could be more humble, and just keep working at it, and be honest.
Maybe they will become the great F1 team again, i sincerly hope so.
They just like Honda, Mclaren are true legends!!!

[godlameroso]

Based on the tokens they have and what they need to improve, it's becoming clear that they're going to have to make a compromise. There's potentially two different paths they can take, I'm sure both are being investigated. Ideally you'd want to match the ICE to the turbo and the hybrid systems. The limited tokens force them to focus more on one than the other, so they improve combustion but with a weak MGU-H, you can't take advantage of the power because you don't have enough energy to drive the turbine to provide the correct fuel mixtures. Or you focus on the batteries and energy recovery at the expense of engine power. It's not an enviable position to be in, on the one hand, they can't afford to waste time by pursuing a direction that seems promising but will inevitably be a dead end. Yet, at the same time they want to introduce something that can give them benefit now. I think we'll see more token use by Hockenheim, and then once again around Singapore or Malaysia, Honda will want to have their latest and greatest update ready for Suzuka.

[GoranF1]

Based on the tokens they have and what they need to improve, it's becoming clear that they're going to have to make a compromise. There's potentially two different paths they can take, I'm sure both are being investigated. Ideally you'd want to match the ICE to the turbo and the hybrid systems. The limited tokens force them to focus more on one than the other, so they improve combustion but with a weak MGU-H, you can't take advantage of the power because you don't have enough energy to drive the turbine to provide the correct fuel mixtures. Or you focus on the batteries and energy recovery at the expense of engine power. It's not an enviable position to be in, on the one hand, they can't afford to waste time by pursuing a direction that seems promising but will inevitably be a dead end. Yet, at the same time they want to introduce something that can give them benefit now. I think we'll see more token use by Hockenheim, and then once again around Singapore or Malaysia, Honda will want to have their latest and greatest update ready for Suzuka.

should they call it "Suzuka Special" ?

[davidfroshanzen]

Based on the tokens they have and what they need to improve, it's becoming clear that they're going to have to make a compromise. There's potentially two different paths they can take, I'm sure both are being investigated. Ideally you'd want to match the ICE to the turbo and the hybrid systems. The limited tokens force them to focus more on one than the other, so they improve combustion but with a weak MGU-H, you can't take advantage of the power because you don't have enough energy to drive the turbine to provide the correct fuel mixtures. Or you focus on the batteries and energy recovery at the expense of engine power. It's not an enviable position to be in, on the one hand, they can't afford to waste time by pursuing a direction that seems promising but will inevitably be a dead end. Yet, at the same time they want to introduce something that can give them benefit now. I think we'll see more token use by Hockenheim, and then once again around Singapore or Malaysia, Honda will want to have their latest and greatest update ready for Suzuka.

upgrade in suzuka? The time was almost finished in the championship, not too many points that will be in reach. if they do that I worry about their preparations for 2017

[godlameroso]

There's still 5 races after Singapore.