Singapore Night GP 2008
now that was entertaining
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Fernando Alonso has claimed the first ever night Grand Prix. Thanks to a lucky safety car procedure, the Renault driver was able to move up from 15th on the grid and continued calmly to win the race. Nico Rosberg ended second, Lewis Hamilton is 3rd. Neither of the Ferraris managed to get into the points.
Man, you ar living in a wold of myths. Fact is that the regulations say that a certain tyre dimension is the upper limit of width. It nowhere says that the dimensions can be exceeded before or after the race. Michelin exploited a loop hole in terms of taking advantage of a particular scrutineering method. When their creative interpretation was discovered the loop hole got closed. thats pritty natural. the rule wasn't changed. it was only enforced. you need to learn to read a rule. if it is 30 cm, than you have to have no more than 30 cm at all times.gcdugas wrote: ....My dates are correct. Michelin-gate was not Indy 2005, it was pre-Monza 2003 when the FIA decided that tires which were legal since 1998 were no longer legal as they changed measuring methods at the behest of Ferrari. Yes the Monty Indy DQ was in 2003 when he and Rubens got into a tussle...
WhiteBlue wrote:now Massa is fuelled for the finish. look out for a crash by Reikkonen.
- hats off to you - 100% on the money. he deserves a second season for his self sacrifice!! They will LOSE the championships rather than McLaren winning it at this rate!
Well good God! What was he supposed to do, sit there and let Sutil or someone else pile into him? Massa was doing the right thing and getting the hell out of the way. Sutil came into the corner completely unsighted, and to avoid Massa he hit the barrier. I see absolutely nothing wrong with Felipe getting out of the way and doing so as quickly as possible to avoid being sideways to oncoming traffic in a blind corner.myurr wrote:
Just watched it again, and although the camera angle doesn't let you see what was happening with Sutil into the corner it shows clearly that if Sutil hadn't have crashed into the wall he would have hit Massa. So I think that he must have taken avoiding action. But a better camera angle would be needed to clarify.
When I saw that incident I immediately thought: if that was a McLaren there would be an investigation for causing an on-track incidentRay wrote:Well good God! What was he supposed to do, sit there and let Sutil or someone else pile into him? Massa was doing the right thing and getting the hell out of the way. Sutil came into the corner completely unsighted...
. After the replays I wasn't so sure.. hard call to make. Rob Smedley(Massa's race engineer) wrote:... Today we were useless....
Off topic I know but i have been challenged as to myths.WhiteBlue wrote:Man, you ar living in a wold of myths. Fact is that the regulations say that a certain tyre dimension is the upper limit of width. It nowhere says that the dimensions can be exceeded before or after the race. Michelin exploited a loop hole in terms of taking advantage of a particular scrutineering method. When their creative interpretation was discovered the loop hole got closed. thats pritty natural. the rule wasn't changed. it was only enforced. you need to learn to read a rule. if it is 30 cm, than you have to have no more than 30 cm at all times.
That's exactly what he should have done - sit there and wait until he could safely rejoin the track.Ray wrote: Well good God! What was he supposed to do, sit there and let Sutil or someone else pile into him? Massa was doing the right thing and getting the hell out of the way. Sutil came into the corner completely unsighted, and to avoid Massa he hit the barrier. I see absolutely nothing wrong with Felipe getting out of the way and doing so as quickly as possible to avoid being sideways to oncoming traffic in a blind corner.
WhiteBlue wrote:Alonso makes big profit from his team mates crash. I would not put it behind Briatore to engineer something like this.
It's quite obvious you can't see a very dangerous situation when it's presented to you. Massa was sitting perpindicular to oncoming traffic, at the end of a braking zone, around what is effectively a pretty blind corner, and there were cars coming even after Sutil. So you are saying that he should have presented the broad side of his car to the dangers of someone coming into that corner too hot and spearing his cockpit from the side with another cars nosecone. How in the hell does it make sense to do that?myurr wrote:
That's exactly what he should have done - sit there and wait until he could safely rejoin the track.
One or other driver should be at fault as I believe there were waved yellows at that corner at the time. So either Sutil came in there too fast and dangerously, or Massa pulled into his path. Sutil suggested the latter in his race comments.
Frankly I think that Massa still has mind management issues when dealing with disappointment and setbacks - understandably so, he's human, and he's by no means the only driver. So before you accuse me of all kinds of evil bias I also think that Hamilton shows occasional signs, as does Alonso.
I think that he was so frustrated with dropping the car at that point that he wasn't even particularly looking, or misjudged the gap to Sutil, and pulled out in front of him.
Either way the next time you grumble about a Hamilton overtake or some such, and say he should be black flagged, remember this avoidable accident and remember that it's gone unpunished.
For a broadside accident Sutil would have had to had lost complete control of his car, if he'd just run a bit wide then at worst he would have taken Massa's nose off. Such an accident should have been impossible as it was under waved yellows so all drivers passing through that section should have been running slower and more cautiously than usual.Ray wrote: It's quite obvious you can't see a very dangerous situation when it's presented to you. Massa was sitting perpindicular to oncoming traffic, at the end of a braking zone, around what is effectively a pretty blind corner, and there were cars coming even after Sutil. So you are saying that he should have presented the broad side of his car to the dangers of someone coming into that corner too hot and spearing his cockpit from the side with another cars nosecone. How in the hell does it make sense to do that?
I don't see how you can want punishment for a guy that prevented a more dangerous situation by sitting still in a blind corner with the front of his car in the racing line. You obviously have some sort of bias because you can't objectively observe the circumstances. I haven't said anything about Hmailtons conduct, which he did a fantastic job today staying out of trouble and just riding the race out like he should, so I don't know why you brought that up. Take a step back and look at the orientation that Massa was in, and put yourself in his shoes and think about what you'd do.
