Run-Off Area Alternatives

[autogyro]

Cost was the problem with the system I offered to Charley Whiting.
A flexible friction surface that would crease up to decelerate non down force cars and motor cycles and be sucked up to contact the floor of the faster F1 down force cars.
Neat, effective no blocked vision for the public and an new area for advertising.
I had an F3 operation willing to supply me with cars to fire at the concept.
Interested Ciro?

[krisfx]

If punishment is what you want you can use strips made of high tech sandpaper: they can damage your tyres (blue ones) or blow them (red ones). These are at Paul Ricard, patented by no one less than the owner of the track, our beloved Mr. Ecclestone
https://sites.google.com/site/ciropabon ... tripes.png

There seems to be a common myth about these stripes damaging the tyres if you run over them but I've never seen any credible source confirming it.

If you run over them with locked tyres I can believe it but if you just run wide and cross them they don't seem to do anything from what I have seen from the GT3 races there.

Do you know anything more Ciro?

I always thought these strips had a tungsten base to increase the grip available to slow the car down, as opposed to blowing the tyres to bits.

From the web: "The track is known for its distinctive black and blue runoff areas known as the Blue Zone. The runoff surface consists of a mixture of asphalt and tungsten, used instead of gravel traps, as common at other circuits.[2] A second, deeper run-off area is the Red Zone, with a more abrasive surface designed to maximise tyre grip and hence minimise braking distance, although at the cost of intense tyre wear. The final safeguard consists of Tecpro barriers, a modern improvement on tyre barriers."

[Tim.Wright]

That same quote from the official site is the only authoritative voice I've heard on the issue.

On various forums, including this one, there seems to be a myth that these stripes destroy the tyres if you run over them and could therefore be used to stop driver cutting corners or running wide on exit.

However that above quote doesn't imply anything of the sort. It clarifies that the red zone works under braking and will wear the tyres more - but if you run over them without any braking or cornering forces there's no reason that it should damage the tyres.

[proteus]

How about 2 metres wide belt of sandtrap right next to the track (on those big and wide runoff areas), than normal tarmac like now, and 2 metres before the barriers syntetic pylons made of soft sillicone, to help stop the car.

[Tim.Wright]

I'd rather retain the tarmac runn off but put tyre barriers put right on the track edge to smash the cars to bits if the drivers get too greedy.

[Andres125sx]

Tarmac all around from the track to the barriers, but with a band of 1-2m of grass next to the kerbs, safe and none will go too wide

[Ciro Pabón]

... If you run over them with locked tyres I can believe it but if you just run wide and cross them they don't seem to do anything from what I have seen from the GT3 races there.

Do you know anything more Ciro?

No, Tim, I don't. However, when you cross over them you're not coasting, as a minimum you're turning.

I understand that the amount of abbrassive (tungsten, as krisfx says) is enough for those turning or braking forces to erode or damage tyres.

Of course, if you simply move over without exerting any forces, well, you will continue as if nothing happened. It's not like they puncture tyres, they simply provide a surface with more friction.

They are there primarily for diminishing the size of the runoff areas.

This track also has buzzers at the

[langwadt]

https://youtu.be/n8FNR8BryR0

[Andres125sx]

That´s to avoid anyone scaping, but it does not reduce braking distance

It was developed in military field, and now it´s being considered for police checkpoints

[browney]

While tarmac run off makes the track look less exciting, if it increases safety, then it is necessary in some places.

What I don't understand is why running off the track can't just be dealt with in sporting regulations. I also don't understand why there are only one or two corners per track that the FIA care about the drivers running off at.

Why not police it at every corner and penalise the driver by a rule like loosing DRS and ERS for 30 seconds after all four wheels are off the trac (or 5 seconds to their pit time, there are many options).

That way the FIA can do whatever they want for safety (which is very important) but the sport isn't compromised.

[Mui]

Maybe a compound that makes things sticky that can be applied to runfoffs would be a good solution. If the goal is to make grandstands closer to the track, actually helping the car stop more efficiently rather than relying on car destroying barriers to fear monger the drivers be a better solution

I know it sounds counter intuitive, run offs being stickier than the actual race track itself?? Blasphemy! let the stewards hand out penalties if they cross the white line.

[krisfx]

While tarmac run off makes the track look less exciting, if it increases safety, then it is necessary in some places.

What I don't understand is why running off the track can't just be dealt with in sporting regulations. I also don't understand why there are only one or two corners per track that the FIA care about the drivers running off at.

Why not police it at every corner and penalise the driver by a rule like loosing DRS and ERS for 30 seconds after all four wheels are off the trac (or 5 seconds to their pit time, there are many options).

That way the FIA can do whatever they want for safety (which is very important) but the sport isn't compromised.

I don't think tarmac does necessarily make the circuit safer. Yes as opposed to gravel it stops the cars from dangerously flipping, but tarmac can be pretty dangerous.

For example, when a car loses a wheel or more, the car skates on the plank and seemingly increases in speed until impact, which is a lot more dangerous than being beached in a gravel trap.

[andylaurence]

Want to punish a driver for going off the track? Just put a cone on the kerb. https://youtu.be/3oxeAnbml3I

[Just_a_fan]

seemingly increases in speed until impact, which is a lot more dangerous than being beached in a gravel trap.

Glad you put "seemingly" there because the one thing the car won't do is accelerate even when running on the plank. The plank will generate a fair amount of friction and act as a brake, although not as effectively as running it in to a gravel trap.

[aral]

[quote="Ciro Pabón"]
If punishment is what you want you can use strips made of high tech sandpaper: they can damage your tyres (blue ones) or blow them (red ones). These are at Paul Ricard, patented by no one less than the owner of the track, our beloved Mr. Ecclestone
https://sites.google.com/site/ciropabon ... tripes.png

These stripes are certainly a good deterrent. A car that runs onto the blue striping will wear its tyres out to a certain degree due to being abrasive. This will shorten the life of the tyres and whereas can be factored in to a GT style race, it would have more serious repercussions for an F1 race. The red striping is even more abrasive and should a car spin on these, the tyres will be severly abraded requiring immediate replacement. ruinous in an F1 race. I am not sure if it is the actual coloured part that is abrasive, or the black tarmac in between the stripes.