Is Alonso this fast or Räikkönen that slow?

[BanMeToo]

Additionally, as mentioned before, the "adaptability" from Alonso comes from his throwing driving style. It was most obvious during his Renault days, where he triggered understeer on corner entry.

I had always understood that was just the way he needed to drive that particular car, which had a very rearward weight distribution.

[Pierce89]

Additionally, as mentioned before, the "adaptability" from Alonso comes from his throwing driving style. It was most obvious during his Renault days, where he triggered understeer on corner entry.

I had always understood that was just the way he needed to drive that particular car, which had a very rearward weight distribution.

You understood correctly, then. His modern on boards look nothing like ones from 05-06.

[Jeffsvilleusa]

I don't think Raikkonen lacks motivation, that is a very abstract accusation to throw at a driver, and it's generally only hurled at Raikkonen probably because he is openly bored during press events. None of us see his work habits, his participation in driver meetings and things like that. He always said as soon as he is unmotivated he will leave the sport, and I take him at that word.

As far as the gap to Alonso, he has been getting back into the team and learning the car when Alonso is well settled at Ferrari and operating at a very elite level. I think Raikkonen can produce, but both drivers agree the car is a problem.

[Kiril Varbanov]

That's a complex question, really.
To answer the main topic - yes, in my opinion, Alonso is that fast. That's the opinion throughout the paddock, as well as the drivers. Alonso himself regards Hamilton as the fastest driver, having something which he labels as 'raw speed'.

Kimi lost motivation and that's undeniable. From both human and sports psychology point of view, it's one thing to fight for podiums and wins, and totally different to struggle in the middle. Just how much motivation is lost? No one can tell. Don't expect to hear from Kimi admittance that he lost motivation. I think he's pushing as much as the situation allows him to, but Alonso just has this extra rush.

And again, the root cause is the car itself. Had RAI had F14T wheel to wheel with HAM, we would have seen another picture "for sure" - to end this with drivers' favorite parasite phrase.

[xpensive]

To my mind, if anyone would ask me, Alonso's remarkable talent was obvious already in 2005, a kind of Nelson Piquet shine,
the same raw speed and sometimes brutal panache. But he should have stayed with Briatore, he's not very good on his own.

[Ciro Pabón]

"Yes, xVirginia, Alonso is fast. That's why he drives in F1, little one".

[xpensive]

You are a funny guy!

[Ciro Pabón]

Thanks, X, missing you around, btw, my friend.

[GitanesBlondes]

This whole thing with Alonso this year makes it all the more lamentable Ferrari has designed so many poor cars, and then got the engine so wrong for 2014.

But it also highlights my biggest gripe if you will with Raikkonen's need for a setup that perfectly suits his preferences, and his legendary lack of motivation. The greats know how to perform without that "perfect" setup. They still need the car to win, but you can see their skills at work no matter the car.

[xpensive]

This man was legendary for not even being able to tell if the car was over- or understeering, he just drove the wheels off it.

Nigel Roebuck on Ronnie;
In fact, that was just as well, because in all truth he was a hopeless test driver, and admitted as much. “Ronnie was amazing in that respect,” Colin Chapman once told me. “You could change a car really quite fundamentally – and he’d still turn in the same sort of times! So you’d ask him how it felt different from before, and he’d say, ‘Ummm, slides a bit more…’ Where? At the front, the back, both ends? And he’d say he wasn’t really sure! Made me tear my hair out. Then, of course, he’d go and put the thing on pole, so you couldn’t really get too mad with him…”

[Andres125sx]

This whole thing with Alonso this year makes it all the more lamentable Ferrari has designed so many poor cars, and then got the engine so wrong for 2014.

But it also highlights my biggest gripe if you will with Raikkonen's need for a setup that perfectly suits his preferences, and his legendary lack of motivation. The greats know how to perform without that "perfect" setup. They still need the car to win, but you can see their skills at work no matter the car.

+1

[Andres125sx]

This man was legendary for not being able to tell if the car was over- or understeering, he just drove the wheels off it;

In fact, that was just as well, because in all truth he was a hopeless test driver, and admitted as much. “Ronnie was amazing in that respect,” Colin Chapman once told me. “You could change a car really quite fundamentally – and he’d still turn in the same sort of times! So you’d ask him how it felt different from before, and he’d say, ‘Ummm, slides a bit more…’ Where? At the front, the back, both ends? And he’d say he wasn’t really sure! Made me tear my hair out. Then, of course, he’d go and put the thing on pole, so you couldn’t really get too mad with him…”

http://www.motorsportmagazine.com/wp-co ... P60FIN.jpg

Nice quote, but that´s a completely different subject. He couldn´t tell if over or understeering, but he was fast anycase

[xpensive]

Thanks, X, missing you around, btw, my friend.

Yourself leaving as moderator was this fine forum's biggest loss, not replaceable I'm afraid.

[xpensive]

...
Nice quote, but that´s a completely different subject. He couldn´t tell if over or understeering, but he was fast anycase

No, that is xactly the point, as Gitanes wrote, a great driver will perform regardless of car, not just waiting for the perfect setup.

Senna and Villeneuve Sr was other drivers of the same kind and it seems to me that Alonso is as well.

Just look at Vettel this year when the rear is looser, he's nowhere, outclassed by a rookie in the same car.

[Andres125sx]

...
Nice quote, but that´s a completely different subject. He couldn´t tell if over or understeering, but he was fast anycase

No, that is xactly the point, as Gitanes wrote, a great driver will perform regardless of car, not just waiting for the perfect setup.

Senna and Villeneuve Sr was other drivers of the same kind and it seems to me that Alonso is as well.

Just look at Vettel this year when the rear is looser, he's nowhere, outclassed by a rookie in the same car.

Ok didn´t get it at first. Then we agree