2011 F1 car concepts

[donskar]

I don't like artifical stuff, I must admit. Formula 1 will lose a great deal of its identity and differentiation from other motorsports if this artificial rear wing nonsense is brought in. The regulations are either well thought out or they're not.

And . . . they're NOT.

This adjustable rear wing thingy. It has relevance to road cars in WHAT way? And it's "green" because . . .?

[Jersey Tom]

I know I've said it many times, and I hate to repeat myself, but I still think the whole green racing concept is a crock. Race cars have never been, and will never need to be relevant to passenger cars. The whole notion of making a road-relevant single seat, open-wheel vehicle.. seems a little silly.

I'd also argue that the majority of the time, racing is not the birthplace if innovative new technologies. These technologies (fuel injection, radial tires, aerodynamics, microhydraulics, etc) are birthed in the consumer and commercial industries, and only applied in novel ways to racecars. The R&D budgets for consumer and commercial markets puts any race team to shame. As of a few years ago I want to say Ford's R&D budget was on the order of $8 billion, and that's just one OEM.

In any event, if there's a driver-controlled rear wing thing.. sounds like a gimmick to me. Trying to slap a band-aid over a severed arm.

[creedbratton]

Lotus was running their adjustable rear wing on Sunday night.

[donskar]

I know I've said it many times, and I hate to repeat myself, but I still think the whole green racing concept is a crock. Race cars have never been, and will never need to be relevant to passenger cars. The whole notion of making a road-relevant single seat, open-wheel vehicle.. seems a little silly.

I'd also argue that the majority of the time, racing is not the birthplace if innovative new technologies. These technologies (fuel injection, radial tires, aerodynamics, microhydraulics, etc) are birthed in the consumer and commercial industries, and only applied in novel ways to racecars. The R&D budgets for consumer and commercial markets puts any race team to shame. As of a few years ago I want to say Ford's R&D budget was on the order of $8 billion, and that's just one OEM. . . .

+1. BTW: Toyota's R&D budget is $1 million per hour -- 24 X 365.

[vall]

I know I've said it many times, and I hate to repeat myself, but I still think the whole green racing concept is a crock. Race cars have never been, and will never need to be relevant to passenger cars. The whole notion of making a road-relevant single seat, open-wheel vehicle.. seems a little silly.

I'd also argue that the majority of the time, racing is not the birthplace if innovative new technologies. These technologies (fuel injection, radial tires, aerodynamics, microhydraulics, etc) are birthed in the consumer and commercial industries, and only applied in novel ways to racecars. The R&D budgets for consumer and commercial markets puts any race team to shame. As of a few years ago I want to say Ford's R&D budget was on the order of $8 billion, and that's just one OEM.

In any event, if there's a driver-controlled rear wing thing.. sounds like a gimmick to me. Trying to slap a band-aid over a severed arm.

Indeed, that road relevance, green F1 is a plain PR BS. It just can't be, but hey, that is politically correct message

[CHT]

I am expecting RBR and Merc or Renault to be title contender for the first part of 2011 season.

Ferrari : Unlikely to produce a championship winning car at the start of the season due to track testing restriction.

Mclaren : I am expecting their resources will be stretch in 2011 when their road car project kick into high gear.

[Rosewood]

With a properly developed wing, maybe we will see drivers "slingshot"-ing from midfield up to lead pack. Say a driver in sixth pulls up on the drivers in fifth, fourth, and third, all closely packed; in theory, he could slip past them on the same straight, or consecutively, if there are two consecutive straights.

[wesley123]

Mclaren : I am expecting their resources will be stretch in 2011 when their road car project kick into high gear.

Rubbish, The McLaren road cars division has nothing to do with the formula 1 team. So even if they had a line up of a million different cars, it wouldnt hurt the f1 team

[CHT]

Mclaren : I am expecting their resources will be stretch in 2011 when their road car project kick into high gear.

Rubbish, The McLaren road cars division has nothing to do with the formula 1 team. So even if they had a line up of a million different cars, it wouldnt hurt the f1 team

Mclaren Automotive is under the Mclaren Group which includes Mclaren Racing. Beside these 2 they have 4 others smaller business unit such as marketing and food catering services. I am not sure how profitable are the other business units, but AFAIK, Mclaren main income still comes from Mclaren Racing.

The MP4-12 is very ambitious project taken by Mclaren to take on supercar makers like Ferrari, Lambo and Porsche, all of which have big financial backing and technology sharing resources from parent companies. For Mclaren to really make a dent in the super car market, they will ultimately have to divert some resources from within the group to fund this project.

[Martin Keene]

I don't like artifical stuff, I must admit. Formula 1 will lose a great deal of its identity and differentiation from other motorsports if this artificial rear wing nonsense is brought in. The regulations are either well thought out or they're not.

And . . . they're NOT.

This adjustable rear wing thingy. It has relevance to road cars in WHAT way? And it's "green" because . . .?

I don't understand why people have a problem with the adjustable rear wing, what's the difference between it and an f duct?

[Mandrake]

I guess they will have to simply blow over the diffuser, rather than through the slots that were created using the "hole that is not a hole" loophole that is being closed to ban the DDD.

Unless someone gets creative with their exhaust venting, it is doubtful we will see anything near the complexity of the 2010 EBD.

I wonder, is it forbidden to route the exhaust into the diffusor directly? F1 cars of old days had their exhaust placed in there as well, giving great fireworks under braking and downshifting.

From what I've read so far, the problem always was the changing DF-levels with changing engine load. This season, teams have overcome this with the retarded ignition, does that mean we could see the return of direct diffusor-feeding exhausts?

[wesley123]

Mclaren : I am expecting their resources will be stretch in 2011 when their road car project kick into high gear.

Rubbish, The McLaren road cars division has nothing to do with the formula 1 team. So even if they had a line up of a million different cars, it wouldnt hurt the f1 team

Mclaren Automotive is under the Mclaren Group which includes Mclaren Racing. Beside these 2 they have 4 others smaller business unit such as marketing and food catering services. I am not sure how profitable are the other business units, but AFAIK, Mclaren main income still comes from Mclaren Racing.

The MP4-12 is very ambitious project taken by Mclaren to take on supercar makers like Ferrari, Lambo and Porsche, all of which have big financial backing and technology sharing resources from parent companies. For Mclaren to really make a dent in the super car market, they will ultimately have to divert some resources from within the group to fund this project.

No, because every part o this group has their own funds, management etc. They are just housed under one building and under a single name, McLaren.

[myurr]

I don't understand why people have a problem with the adjustable rear wing, what's the difference between it and an f duct?

Because the F-Duct is freely available to all to use however they see fit. The adjustable rear wing is only activated when a driver is within 1 second of the car in front, giving them an artificial speed boost and taking away some of the skill required to overtake.

Instead of fixing the problem of cars being unable to overtake on track (tyres that are too grippy and consistent, cars that are too stable and aero dependent making, brakes that are too powerful thus reducing braking distances, etc.) they have chosen this artificial bandage to try and cover up for the fact that the current regulations are processional racing.

[scuderiafan]

I don't understand why people have a problem with the adjustable rear wing, what's the difference between it and an f duct?

Like myurr said, the F-Duct was available to use whenever the driver chose to do so. Plus, the new RW is too gimmicky. This is Formula One, not Formula HotWheelNeedForSpeed.

[CHT]

No, because every part o this group has their own funds, management etc. They are just housed under one building and under a single name, McLaren.

Thats not true.

1) Mclaren Racing, the only cash cow in Mclaren group has been indirectly funding the automotive project since 2 years ago when Mclaren started the P11 road car project.

Quote : "Racing has been the cash cow in our portfolio, Group has been loaning money to Automotive. We separated Automotive out, and Automotive had to pay money back into the group to balance that, so it was an accounting process"

http://formula-one.speedtv.com/article/ ... it-in-2009

2) In the same article, it was also mentioned that as of Jan. 1 2010, Daimler 40% shareholding in Mclaren Group was reduced to 16%. Come next years, the remaining shareholders of Mclaren Group will have to raise or set aside more money to buy out Daimler 16% shareholding.


3) Mclaren Group has recently taken a GBP40m loan from HSBC to fund its share in the automotive project (1st time in the last 5 years). The loan is secured on McLaren's intellectual property, cash in the bank, and its land and buildings, which had a book value of £193.8m at the end of 2008. On top of that, Mclaren is also seeking to raise GBP340m from private investors for 49% stake in the company to fund the automotive project. Which also mean that the Mclaren Group will have to contribute the other 51% worth of resources and IP to fund this project.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/busin ... 40508.html


4) Since the establishment of the MP-12C road car projects, Martin Whitmarsh has also been appointed deputy chairmain of Mclaren automotive division on top his CEO position at Mclaren Group.

Beside Martin, Mclaren Group chairman Ron Dennis, CFO Andy Myers, legal counsel Tim Mumane and shareholders Mansour Ojjeh and Sheikh Mohammed Bin Essa al-Khalifa, are also on the board of the newly set up Automotive division.(Another example of spliting resources)