Silly season 2024-2025

[Jurgen von Diaz]

3 years back only Verstappen almost cried against Hamilton. Give him a car capable of fighting and he will take fight any day to Verstappen or anyone.

Okay, so now it is about the car? Last 3 years Verstappen has crushed everything, Hamilton not even his teammate. Firstly Hamilton should be dominating Russell before we can even discuss Verstappen vs Hamilton. People are pretending that Hamilton would be still in his prime. It's quite clear that you don't beat Verstappen if you are not in your prime.

Belittling Hamilton’s achievements doesn’t elevate Max’s. The usual trope is that anyone could’ve done what Hamilton did in that Merc but Verstappen’s car is a 3 wheeled shed and he’s a driving god. In identical machinery Max lost to RIC.

If you look at Nico Rosberg now he talks of Hamilton as the no.1 driver ever. Why? Because it elevates his single championship win. The reality is that unless there is a car on the grid that can match the RB and Hamilton is in it, we’ll never know how they’d match up.

Yes, Max lost Ric when Max was young, but do you think Max is the same driver he was seven years ago? Verstappen used to be a crasher, but now he is the most reliable driver on the grid. Max took his first win at the age of 18. At that age, Hamilton was driving in junior series for many years and made his debut at the age of 22.

Today is today, and the past is the past, so why are we talking about what Hamilton and Verstappen have done in the past? Is it because Hamilton is struggling with Russell, while Verstappen is not struggling with his teammates?

[Tiny73]

Okay, so now it is about the car? Last 3 years Verstappen has crushed everything, Hamilton not even his teammate. Firstly Hamilton should be dominating Russell before we can even discuss Verstappen vs Hamilton. People are pretending that Hamilton would be still in his prime. It's quite clear that you don't beat Verstappen if you are not in your prime.

Belittling Hamilton’s achievements doesn’t elevate Max’s. The usual trope is that anyone could’ve done what Hamilton did in that Merc but Verstappen’s car is a 3 wheeled shed and he’s a driving god. In identical machinery Max lost to RIC.

If you look at Nico Rosberg now he talks of Hamilton as the no.1 driver ever. Why? Because it elevates his single championship win. The reality is that unless there is a car on the grid that can match the RB and Hamilton is in it, we’ll never know how they’d match up.

Yes, Max lost Ric when Max was young, but do you think Max is the same driver he was seven years ago? Verstappen used to be a crasher, but now he is the most reliable driver on the grid. Max took his first win at the age of 18. At that age, Hamilton was driving in junior series for many years and made his debut at the age of 22.

Today is today, and the past is the past, so why are we talking about what Hamilton and Verstappen have done in the past? Is it because Hamilton is struggling with Russell, while Verstappen is not struggling with his teammates?

Yes, and HAM lost RUS when he was younger. See how this works? Like I say, until they’re in identical machinery there’s no comparison to be made.

[Jurgen von Diaz]

Belittling Hamilton’s achievements doesn’t elevate Max’s. The usual trope is that anyone could’ve done what Hamilton did in that Merc but Verstappen’s car is a 3 wheeled shed and he’s a driving god. In identical machinery Max lost to RIC.

If you look at Nico Rosberg now he talks of Hamilton as the no.1 driver ever. Why? Because it elevates his single championship win. The reality is that unless there is a car on the grid that can match the RB and Hamilton is in it, we’ll never know how they’d match up.

Yes, Max lost Ric when Max was young, but do you think Max is the same driver he was seven years ago? Verstappen used to be a crasher, but now he is the most reliable driver on the grid. Max took his first win at the age of 18. At that age, Hamilton was driving in junior series for many years and made his debut at the age of 22.

Today is today, and the past is the past, so why are we talking about what Hamilton and Verstappen have done in the past? Is it because Hamilton is struggling with Russell, while Verstappen is not struggling with his teammates?

Yes, and HAM lost RUS when he was younger. See how this works? Like I say, until they’re in identical machinery there’s no comparison to be made.

Maybe you're right. To be the best, you have to beat the best, or at least your teammate.

[Just_a_fan]

Yes, Max lost Ric when Max was young, but do you think Max is the same driver he was seven years ago? Verstappen used to be a crasher, but now he is the most reliable driver on the grid. Max took his first win at the age of 18. At that age, Hamilton was driving in junior series for many years and made his debut at the age of 22.

Today is today, and the past is the past, so why are we talking about what Hamilton and Verstappen have done in the past? Is it because Hamilton is struggling with Russell, while Verstappen is not struggling with his teammates?

Yes, and HAM lost RUS when he was younger. See how this works? Like I say, until they’re in identical machinery there’s no comparison to be made.

Maybe you're right. To be the best, you have to beat the best, or at least your teammate.

Driver ying-yang never ends well. For example, one can point out that Rosberg beat the great Michael Schumacher 3 seasons in the row before losing to Hamilton 3 seasons in a row before finally scratching a title and retiring. Does this prove that Lewis is better than Nico who is better than Michael and thus Lewis was way better than Michael? Of course not. And that's a rabbit hole argument that we don't need to follow, isn't it?

The greatest F1 driver ever is Fangio. Modern drivers don't compare to the stuff he did in the death traps of the day.

[RonMexico]

Agreed. Max is certainly top tier, but he's not doing anything Vettel didn't do before him. Does that put Vettel in the same league as Max?

Max, Lewis and Alonso all occupy the very top tier.

Hamilton is having hard times with Russell and Merc, Alonso is just old and past his prime also. If you put those guys in to the fastest car, so it would be Red Bull. Max is known for his ability to adapt very sharpy and oversteer car, so Hamilton and Alonso would have even harder times against Verstappen. If Hamilton can't match Russell's speed at the moment, how the hell he would be doing that in the Red Bull against Max?

Have you been following since last year? Hamilton beat Alonso in his prime. Hamilton competed against Schumacher in his dominant Ferrari. Button and Rosberg are both world champions that he easily dispatched.

For now what we know about Max is that he was about even against Sainz in the Toro Rosso. Sainz a bit better in quali and definitely more unlucky in the race reliability-wise. Other than that Max hasn’t had any really good teammates for considerable time.

When did Hamilton race against Ferrari era Schumacher?

[dialtone]

Hamilton is having hard times with Russell and Merc, Alonso is just old and past his prime also. If you put those guys in to the fastest car, so it would be Red Bull. Max is known for his ability to adapt very sharpy and oversteer car, so Hamilton and Alonso would have even harder times against Verstappen. If Hamilton can't match Russell's speed at the moment, how the hell he would be doing that in the Red Bull against Max?

Have you been following since last year? Hamilton beat Alonso in his prime. Hamilton competed against Schumacher in his dominant Ferrari. Button and Rosberg are both world champions that he easily dispatched.

For now what we know about Max is that he was about even against Sainz in the Toro Rosso. Sainz a bit better in quali and definitely more unlucky in the race reliability-wise. Other than that Max hasn’t had any really good teammates for considerable time.

When did Hamilton race against Ferrari era Schumacher?

I just meant that dominant Ferrari.

[Big Gun]

There is no indication this is true in any way.

Max is a fenomenal driver but it’s too early to say he’s in his own tier, and definitely hard to evaluate that with the car and teammate he has.

EDIT: just to preempt some replies: Hamilton straight up beat some world champion teammates of the caliber of Alonso and Button, and is certainly giving Russell a run for his money.

Agreed. Max is certainly top tier, but he's not doing anything Vettel didn't do before him. Does that put Vettel in the same league as Max?

Max, Lewis and Alonso all occupy the very top tier.

Hamilton is having hard times with Russell and Merc, Alonso is just old and past his prime also. If you put those guys in to the fastest car, so it would be Red Bull. Max is known for his ability to adapt very sharpy and oversteer car, so Hamilton and Alonso would have even harder times against Verstappen. If Hamilton can't match Russell's speed at the moment, how the hell he would be doing that in the Red Bull against Max?

What makes you think Alonso is just old and passed his prime? Last year he was voted the 2nd best driver...
Hamilton was 3rd best driver last season and of late has always had a hard time at the start of the season, I expect him to start beating Russell.

Max and the old boys are still the best 3.

[Jurgen von Diaz]

Agreed. Max is certainly top tier, but he's not doing anything Vettel didn't do before him. Does that put Vettel in the same league as Max?

Max, Lewis and Alonso all occupy the very top tier.

Hamilton is having hard times with Russell and Merc, Alonso is just old and past his prime also. If you put those guys in to the fastest car, so it would be Red Bull. Max is known for his ability to adapt very sharpy and oversteer car, so Hamilton and Alonso would have even harder times against Verstappen. If Hamilton can't match Russell's speed at the moment, how the hell he would be doing that in the Red Bull against Max?

What makes you think Alonso is just old and passed his prime? Last year he was voted the 2nd best driver...
Hamilton was 3rd best driver last season and of late has always had a hard time at the start of the season, I expect him to start beating Russell.

Max and the old boys are still the best 3.

Verstappen, Hamilton and Alonso in the same category? It's a yoke. Alonso drove good season yes.

Every team would hire Verstappen if they could, can't say same about Hamilton and Alonso.

Plus, if Alonso or Hamilton would come to the fastest car which means Verstappen's home stadium Red Bull. How much money you would be betting for Alonso or Hamilton against Verstappen?

[Cs98]

Agreed. Max is certainly top tier, but he's not doing anything Vettel didn't do before him. Does that put Vettel in the same league as Max?

Max, Lewis and Alonso all occupy the very top tier.

Hamilton is having hard times with Russell and Merc, Alonso is just old and past his prime also. If you put those guys in to the fastest car, so it would be Red Bull. Max is known for his ability to adapt very sharpy and oversteer car, so Hamilton and Alonso would have even harder times against Verstappen. If Hamilton can't match Russell's speed at the moment, how the hell he would be doing that in the Red Bull against Max?

Have you been following since last year? Hamilton beat Alonso in his prime. Hamilton competed against Schumacher in his dominant Ferrari. Button and Rosberg are both world champions that he easily dispatched.

For now what we know about Max is that he was about even against Sainz in the Toro Rosso. Sainz a bit better in quali and definitely more unlucky in the race reliability-wise. Other than that Max hasn’t had any really good teammates for considerable time.

Have you been following since last year followed by you thinking Ham competed against Schumi in a Ferrari... Self-own.

[dialtone]

Hamilton is having hard times with Russell and Merc, Alonso is just old and past his prime also. If you put those guys in to the fastest car, so it would be Red Bull. Max is known for his ability to adapt very sharpy and oversteer car, so Hamilton and Alonso would have even harder times against Verstappen. If Hamilton can't match Russell's speed at the moment, how the hell he would be doing that in the Red Bull against Max?

Have you been following since last year? Hamilton beat Alonso in his prime. Hamilton competed against Schumacher in his dominant Ferrari. Button and Rosberg are both world champions that he easily dispatched.

For now what we know about Max is that he was about even against Sainz in the Toro Rosso. Sainz a bit better in quali and definitely more unlucky in the race reliability-wise. Other than that Max hasn’t had any really good teammates for considerable time.

Have you been following since last year followed by you thinking Ham competed against Schumi in a Ferrari... Self-own.

Lol. Yeah that was wrong. But that was his Ferrari in 2007-8 if it wasn’t for Montezemolo.

[TeamKoolGreen]

Could it really be a deal breaker for Sainz going to Red Bull because Jos and Senior hate each other ? Red Bull is trying to win titles. It doesn't seem right that they will pass over the best driver lineup they can get for this reason.

[CHT]

Sainz going back to RB is highly possible because of his talent and maturity and the opportunity for RB to unsettle Ferrari if Sainz can beat LH and CL in a RB21 next year.

Looking at the pace of Merc, I think RB main target now is Ferrari for 2025.

[Big Gun]

Sainz going back to RB is highly possible because of his talent and maturity and the opportunity for RB to unsettle Ferrari if Sainz can beat LH and CL in a RB21 next year.

Looking at the pace of Merc, I think RB main target now is Ferrari for 2025.

One reason I think RBR would choose Sainz over Alonso is because IMO Alonso has much better race pace compared to Sainz, So even if Sainz Qualies ahead of Max I expect Max's race pace to take over and pass Sainz, where as Alonso is a beast on Sundays with his race pace and tyre management could create some dramas....

[chrisc90]

Key will be someone who likes a front end similar to Max. We’ve seen how Perez drops back once the front end sharpness increases

[JordanMugen]

Key will be someone who likes a front end similar to Max. We’ve seen how Perez drops back once the front end sharpness increases

Mr. Leclerc! But Red Bull are not going to pay $60m p/a for a second driver (more than Mr. Verstappen), and Leclerc seems to prefer the prestige and atmosphere at Ferrari anyway even if Red Bull have offered the same $60m p/a salary for 2025, so what can you do?