2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

[etusch]

If you were the Merc boss, would you give a competitor your engine to mount in one of their chassis before they sign an exit agreement with their current engine supplier? I think the for is too low on substance to be believed. Not saying McLaren won't run a Mercedes PU next year, just that this role seems like click bait to me

Sent from my SM-T815 using Tapatalk

And merc was the team declare concern about mclaren could give info about their engine to Honda, when Honda & mclaren deal done

[Facts Only]

The only Merc engines Mclaren will have at testing this year will be the ones in the trucks used to bring the team to the track.

Mclaren might have worked on B chassis to acomodate Mercedes PU since winter testing...who knows.

Its not just a case of making a car, gettin the engine is whats not going to happen.

[McL-H]

McLaren should stick to Honda. Keep improving the partnership and results will come. Other engines are reliable because they have sticked to the same engine and have been developing it for years. Honda changed the entire concept of this years PU, making them run against reliability issues. Now that these issues have been solved, they can turn up the engine more and develop it towards Renault (who are sitting still). 30 BHP on the A1 Ring, another 30 BHP in Spa, this should help McLaren close the gap to RBR. For the first time, I feel Honda is able to make a competitive engine. Castrol can still make big gains in fuel, as they are a new player as well. For 2018, this new Honda concept could fall into place, and McLaren COULD fight for the championship again. One thing is for sure, with a Mercedes customer engine they definitely won't. Maybe win a few races, but that's it. You need factory status in the current era to fight for championships.

[HPD]

Eric Boullier interview (06/24/2017) Baku
(Sorry for the translation errors, the page is in spanish.)

- What happened this year Eric? Why this disaster? Last season it seemed that things were better ...

Eric: You ask me a question that is difficult because ... Problems with the car come from two things, the chassis and the engine, as we know. I think, in terms of engine performance, I do not think we had the set-up we were supposed to have, or we were promised. That is all. So that's why we seem to have gone back.

- In this grand prize, Honda brings an evolution, is it going to serve anything?

Eric: It seems to give us a little more performance.

- In terms of power? How many improvement horses, ten, twenty?

Eric: I could not say exactly, a little more.

- Can not you tell us more?

Eric: Ask Honda, not me.

- Still relying on McLaren in Honda?

Eric: Yes, we trust Honda because they have many resources and the will to do so. What I'm not sure, is the time when Honda will arrive. 'Timing' is the key. Is different. Honda is very committed to the sport, with McLaren, with the project, it is only at the moment that I am not sure. That is to say, I trust Honda, but not so much in its evolution.

- Will McLaren continue with Honda in 2018?

Eric: We have a contract.

- I mean ...

Eric: Yes, we can change your 'timing'. We can do things differently, but this is a different debate.

- You told me that with Mercedes engine would win races already in preseason. Does it hold it?

Eric: If we had a Mercedes engine? Yes. But with 'yes', I would be world champion every year.

From: http://motor.as.com/motor/2017/06/23/fo ... 39747.html

[coco-bun]

http://members.f1-life.net/report/55333/

Here is the rumor.

yeah, realiable and trustworthy source
anybody can make a website.

FYI - He's not just a random interweb user. He actually flies around the world with the F1 circus (see his twitter) and has been tweeting quotes from Hasegawa and gang at the track. He also writes for a huge Japanese publisher and I believe was the one that broke about Sauber-Honda.

So while I would take this article with a grain of salt, especially since it's behind a paywall and the entire article isn't visible to all, I wouldn't completely write him off. Also, the article doesn't mention anything about a crash test (at least from what's visible to non-paying viewers). Here's a quick translation:

一部ではマクラーレンが一時的にホンダ以外のパワーユニットを搭載するのではないか噂されているという報道がなされているが、マクラーレンはハンガリーGP後の2日間のテストにメルセデスAMG製パワーユニットを搭載したテスト車両を持ち込み走らせることを検討しているようだ。

There are reports that there are speculations that McLaren may use a power unit other than a Honda, and McLaren may be considering testing a Mercedes AMG power unit equipped car for the scheduled 2 days of testing after the Hungarian GP.

レギュレーション上、今シーズン中のパワーユニット変更は不可能だが、マクラーレン側は例外措置を使って全チームの承諾を取り付けてシーズン後半戦に“一時的に”メルセデスAMG製PUを搭載して戦い、今シーズンのランキング最下位をなんとか阻止しようと考えているようだ。

Although the regulation prohibits change of power units, but McLaren may seek for an exception by gaining unanimous consent from all teams and race with a Mercedes AMG power unit for the latter half of the season in order to prevent being last in the WCC.

[Singabule]

http://members.f1-life.net/report/55333/

Here is the rumor.

yeah, realiable and trustworthy source
anybody can make a website.

There's also news that the new update will bring 30 HP for Mclaren, and it won't end there.
30 HP may not seem THAT much, but then again, it DOES if you calculate where they must compromise without,
and it probably also means that they will have a more reliable engine, too.

Which would mean they can

A) up the wick [ less reliability issues ]
B) use their aero to it's full potential [ they make a compromise now to deal with the power defecit ]
C) have a more powerful engine [ thus essentially upping the wick twice ]

which could result in a massive difference in results. it won't get them on the podium, but it COULD take them
away from DNF's and the backfield into the midfield. Didn't Alonso get that Mclaren between p5 and p8 regularly in qually when they didnt have A) bad luck and B) technical issues ? That means solid midfield to connection with the front IF, and it's a big IF, Honda finally solves it's demons.

To return to that crashtest-mercy engine rumour;

The new crashtest with a new chassis rumour COULD be true - Mclaren themselves might have focused so much on the car, and knowing their windtunnel, computer simulation, and real life correlation is amazing and 95%+, they could have found even more improvement on the car. After all, there was mention that the car was really, really basic. they could have postponed this because of the bad Honda engine that wouldn't justify the effort to implement it.

that could mean there's positive news coming up, especially seeming how not-negative Alonso was.

It could very well also be not at all a mercedes engine they are going to fit, but a brand new Honda engine that demands a new layout - PERHAPS they have made a safety net for themselves to protect them from more disappointment - who can blame them - and demanded Honda builds the new engine in such a way that the connection to the monocoque is exactly the same so that they CAN mount a mercedes engine without any setbacks or time consuming measurements to deal with that, which THEN got translated into - and taken out of context in putting a clicbait headline;

MCL crashtests new monocoque, mounts MERC engine.

while in fact it is;

MCL crashtests new monocoque, mounts new Honda engine that has same implementation possibilities as MERC engine.

So the New monocoque for the larger and heavier engine instead, to cure vibration problem. If lotus can mount renault on merc chasis, mount merc engine on honda chasis is far easier task indeed. I dont know if spec 3 engine perform better than honda claimed on media, MCL still want to split to merc, but surely it is not a big task to them

[Squid]

I wonder how they would go around getting consent from all the teams whose championship standings might be downgraded thanks to a McLaren with a Mercedes engine.

[etusch]

McLaren should stick to Honda. Keep improving the partnership and results will come. Other engines are reliable because they have sticked to the same engine and have been developing it for years. Honda changed the entire concept of this years PU, making them run against reliability issues. Now that these issues have been solved, they can turn up the engine more and develop it towards Renault (who are sitting still). 30 BHP on the A1 Ring, another 30 BHP in Spa, this should help McLaren close the gap to RBR. For the first time, I feel Honda is able to make a competitive engine. Castrol can still make big gains in fuel, as they are a new player as well. For 2018, this new Honda concept could fall into place, and McLaren COULD fight for the championship again. One thing is for sure, with a Mercedes customer engine they definitely won't. Maybe win a few races, but that's it. You need factory status in the current era to fight for championships.

I think the PU named spec 3 is 30 hp more power then previous one but not that much more than PU used Baku. Of course I am wrong if update brings that power independent of new fuel and new Turbo.
#
I think RBR make a step forward. And developing very fast. I don't think McLaren can fight with them but could be close and this is enough for us for this season.
#
After Baku Mclaren mileage better than RBR. So RBR had more problem than mclaren Honda. Just a small difference, they are fast when working

[GhostF1]

McLaren should stick to Honda. Keep improving the partnership and results will come. Other engines are reliable because they have sticked to the same engine and have been developing it for years. Honda changed the entire concept of this years PU, making them run against reliability issues. Now that these issues have been solved, they can turn up the engine more and develop it towards Renault (who are sitting still). 30 BHP on the A1 Ring, another 30 BHP in Spa, this should help McLaren close the gap to RBR. For the first time, I feel Honda is able to make a competitive engine. Castrol can still make big gains in fuel, as they are a new player as well. For 2018, this new Honda concept could fall into place, and McLaren COULD fight for the championship again. One thing is for sure, with a Mercedes customer engine they definitely won't. Maybe win a few races, but that's it. You need factory status in the current era to fight for championships.

I think the PU named spec 3 is 30 hp more power then previous one but not that much more than PU used Baku. Of course I am wrong if update brings that power independent of new fuel and new Turbo.
#
I think RBR make a step forward. And developing very fast. I don't think McLaren can fight with them but could be close and this is enough for us for this season.
#
After Baku Mclaren mileage better than RBR. So RBR had more problem than mclaren Honda. Just a small difference, they are fast when working

The PU used in Baku FP3, quali and the race, was the same physical ICE unit they've had since Barcelona (where the intake system update was introduced). The major difference though was the redesigned MGU-H/Turbo that both Alonso and Vandoorne took penalties for. Honda claims this was a major reliability fix as it has been the MGU-H causing all these issues (stoppages, no charging, turbo lockups). Alonso's failure in Canada was the first combustion engine physical failure encountered this whole season, so Honda's reliability run there seems quite sound. If they have indeed sorted their MGU-H issues out in Baku with this new unit, it's quite possible that from Austria forward, their reliability will improve dramatically.

The "Spec 3" Hasegawa mentions that will be introduced for both drivers in Austria will pair this new MGU-H/Turbo design from Baku with an updated fuel injection system, a new BP fuel and a couple other updates that he did not go into detail on. So it'll be the first GP with a genuine reliability increase and a solid power update. So where they stand will be extremely interesting to see, it won't be mind blowing, but a good step forward would be encouraging. I'm just curious to see what happens. Which is a welcome first after the string of disappointment and shock I've had so far.

[Vasconia]

The "Spec 3" Hasegawa mentions that will be introduced for both drivers in Austria will pair this new MGU-H/Turbo design from Baku with an updated fuel injection system, a new BP fuel and a couple other updates that he did not go into detail on. So it'll be the first GP with a genuine reliability increase and a solid power update. So where they stand will be extremely interesting to see, it won't be mind blowing, but a good step forward would be encouraging. I'm just curious to see what happens. Which is a welcome first after the string of disappointment and shock I've had so far.

Both cars need to finish the race and with a clear improvement if they want to retain Alonso. If they can finish on the points in such a PU demanding track those would be awesome news.

[marvin78]

Why should the main goal be to retain Alonso? The main goal should be to be competitive and to work to that goal in peace. If that goal can be reached with Alonso: good. If not than let hin go and hire another good driver who want's to reach that goal with the team. I think it's highly dangerous to only think about Alonso.

[Manoah2u]

Mcl doesn't focus only on Alonso.

Mcl needs good results. Wins and a shot at the WCC.
with that, you need:

- a good chassis : CHECK
- a good engine : NEGATIVE
- a good driver : CHECK

they've got 2 out of 3.

they 'just' need to fix 1 part; the engine.

the issue offcourse here is that they 'need' a good driver to get results. so, they more or less DO need to retain Alonso.
to retain Alonso however, you must be able to win.
With the current engine, you can't win. you need a better engine.
so the main goal is a good engine.
have a good engine, keep alonso, win races.

not have a good engine, lose alonso, lose races.
have a good engine, lose alonso, lose races.

right now, the math is this:

MCL chassis + MERC engine + Alonso = Win races.
MCL chassis + HONDA engine + Alonso = Lose races.

the difference is the Honda engine obviously.

the thing is, for Alonso , the math is also easy

MERC chassis + MER engine + Alonso = Win races + WDC.

so how they're gonna keep him @ MCL RIGHT NOW, is well.....nearly impossible

[Singabule]

Maybe im wrong but I like Vettel work ethic much more than Alonso. But off course Ferrari is much more interesting than MCL, so the only option is alonso.

[marvin78]

But you could put another good driver in these equations. So. I would not focus on Alonso so much (if I were McLaren fan). I would hope that the partnership with Honda works out in 2 years and that championchips will be won after that. I think Mercedes is not the key to achieve that. With or without Alonso. And there are other brilliant drivers out there. Not that I don't think that Alonso is the right one but if he doesn't want, don't waste time with him, move on.

[Singabule]

But you could put another good driver in these equations. So. I would not focus on Alonso so much (if I were McLaren fan). I would hope that the partnership with Honda works out in 2 years and that championchips will be won after that. I think Mercedes is not the key to achieve that. With or without Alonso. And there are other brilliant drivers out there. Not that I don't think that Alonso is the right one but if he doesn't want, don't waste time with him, move on.

Rosberg? Button? They've done already. Lewis would only bring disaster on current MCL condition. Ricciardo is the best option out there