2026 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

[AR3-GP]

Tom Hart should take over the driver engineering for Verstappen for the rest of the season. To prepare for 2027.

[lh13]

I have no problem whatsoever with Max being the best driver of our generation. Probably by some margin.

But I find it funny how people time and time again continue to view things in skewed perspectives to make him look like a physics-bending entity.

And would you look at that. First posts are in :

As long as you or anyone thinks that Kimi was slower than Max today, you cannot be taken seriously.

Where the hell did I say Kimi was slower than Max? I linked the post because it popped on my feed and it was related about the average of Max not being more than 2 tenths behind the fastest average today, which I admit, I said while being a little extreme on the other direction. Also I dont know how TrackSims calculates the averages. This one is far more believable :



And based on what I said that initiated the debate :

The gap is at least 4 tenths to Mercedes and at least 6 tenths to Mclaren here.

Cut those in half and then I agree with you.

I don't think I am the one who is playing hyperboles towards anyone's favor.

Also, when applied to an appropriately filtered dataset, the arithmetic mean is not inherently biased. It provides a measure of central tendency across the full distribution. In F1 terms, a driver with greater lap-time variance can still record a lower mean if the distribution is sufficiently weighted toward faster laps, while a more consistent but systematically slower driver may have a higher average. Just because Kimi is 1 second a lap faster on the extremes, that doesn't make him 1 second per lap faster than Max on absolute terms.

You literally posted a chart that shows Kimi as slower than Max. You cannot be serious...

All that you need to see the cars' actual pace, see how Lando caught up to Max, and how Kimi pulled away from Max. There's your answer. Stop wasting your time with meaningless charts when most of the time the fastest drivers were stuck behind someone else, driving to a delta.

[f1isgood]

As long as you or anyone thinks that Kimi was slower than Max today, you cannot be taken seriously.

Where the hell did I say Kimi was slower than Max? I linked the post because it popped on my feed and it was related about the average of Max not being more than 2 tenths behind the fastest average today, which I admit, I said while being a little extreme on the other direction. Also I dont know how TrackSims calculates the averages. This one is far more believable :



And based on what I said that initiated the debate :

Cut those in half and then I agree with you.

I don't think I am the one who is playing hyperboles towards anyone's favor.

Also, when applied to an appropriately filtered dataset, the arithmetic mean is not inherently biased. It provides a measure of central tendency across the full distribution. In F1 terms, a driver with greater lap-time variance can still record a lower mean if the distribution is sufficiently weighted toward faster laps, while a more consistent but systematically slower driver may have a higher average. Just because Kimi is 1 second a lap faster on the extremes, that doesn't make him 1 second per lap faster than Max on absolute terms.

You literally posted a chart that shows Kimi as slower than Max. You cannot be serious...

All that you need to see the cars' actual pace, see how Lando caught up to Max, and how Kimi pulled away from Max. There's your answer. Stop wasting your time with meaningless charts when most of the time the fastest drivers were stuck behind someone else, driving to a delta.

But I am objective and reasonable and I have learnt from my mistakes in the past! - "someone".

People often tend to overthink as they think they have data and data is all you need. Some degree of context and understanding is also part of all you need.

[basti313]

No further action. Nice.

Its just all so meh though. A toothless P2. He cannot fight with this RB22.

Im waiting for a confirmation from red bull that the FIA instructed them to give the position back. If not I believe it was the race losing decision potentially. We saw drivers getting away with far more blatant T1 lap track limit violation. Take Leclerc Mexico last year as an example.

Yes. I also think they fumbled the win here:
- Once Ver let Ant and Ham by, Ham was already 4 sec behind. So he lost nearly 5sec with this.
- The penalty would never be more than 5sec for that first lap infringement and with what we saw on the initial pace he would have had the chance to even make this up against Ant with an early stop. Ham had obviously no pace.
- Ham was out one lap later. With that no one would have given a penalty.

[avantman]

Its just all so meh though. A toothless P2. He cannot fight with this RB22.

Im waiting for a confirmation from red bull that the FIA instructed them to give the position back. If not I believe it was the race losing decision potentially. We saw drivers getting away with far more blatant T1 lap track limit violation. Take Leclerc Mexico last year as an example.

Yes. I also think they fumbled the win here:
- Once Ver let Ant and Ham by, Ham was already 4 sec behind. So he lost nearly 5sec with this.
- The penalty would never be more than 5sec for that first lap infringement and with what we saw on the initial pace he would have had the chance to even make this up against Ant with an early stop. Ham had obviously no pace.
- Ham was out one lap later. With that no one would have given a penalty.

Also, people who say it was the right call ignore the fact that Hamilton gave the position back to Max almost immediately due to the car failure. Otherwise, Max would’ve been stuck behind him and finished the race behind Hamilton at best. There’s no way he would have been able to overtake the faster, upgraded Ferrari of Hamilton on equal tyres, whereas Kimi in a Merc wasn’t even close to overtaking the slower Ferrari of Leclerc, fitted with an older, less powerful engine, despite having a significant tyre advantage.

I’m frankly baffled to see so many people defending that utterly horrible call.

Also, what people miss when they say Hamilton didn’t have to give Max space is that it wasn’t just about a single corner in isolation. Max attempted the move into T2 rather than T1. Hamilton was indeed ahead at the apex of T1, but approaching the second corner, Max was clearly at least alongside him. It was never as black and white as some fans make it out to be. Unlike with a single corner, there’s more room for interpretation when it comes to chicanes.




There’s plenty of evidence that Max would have been able to make T2 easily and stay on track, but Hamilton jumping over the kerb and losing control for a moment forced Max to avoid a potential accident. There was certainly a significant chance that the stewards would have decided that no further action was warranted. Anyway, it was certainly worth the try, given hpw slow the car is, especially on a circuit like that where track position means everything.
Full video:
https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/s/1vD32E8CMG
Hamilton’s mistake is on full display here. It’s easy to see that neither Norris ahead of him nor Leclerc behind took the same line or made the same mistake. Both retained full control of their cars and maintained a smooth, predictable line all the way through the corner, unlike Lewis.

[aMessageToCharlie]

Im waiting for a confirmation from red bull that the FIA instructed them to give the position back. If not I believe it was the race losing decision potentially. We saw drivers getting away with far more blatant T1 lap track limit violation. Take Leclerc Mexico last year as an example.

Yes. I also think they fumbled the win here:
- Once Ver let Ant and Ham by, Ham was already 4 sec behind. So he lost nearly 5sec with this.
- The penalty would never be more than 5sec for that first lap infringement and with what we saw on the initial pace he would have had the chance to even make this up against Ant with an early stop. Ham had obviously no pace.
- Ham was out one lap later. With that no one would have given a penalty.

Also, people who say it was the right call ignore the fact that Hamilton gave the position back to Max almost immediately due to the car failure. Otherwise, Max would’ve been stuck behind him and finished the race behind Hamilton at best. There’s no way he would have been able to overtake the faster, upgraded Ferrari of Hamilton on equal tyres, whereas Kimi in a Merc wasn’t even close to overtaking the slower Ferrari of Leclerc, fitted with an older, less powerful engine, despite having a significant tyre advantage.

I’m frankly baffled to see so many people defending that utterly horrible call.

Also, what people miss when they say Hamilton didn’t have to give Max space is that it wasn’t just about a single corner in isolation. Max attempted the move into T2 rather than T1. Hamilton was indeed ahead at the apex of T1, but approaching the second corner, Max was clearly at least alongside him. It was never as black and white as some fans make it out to be. Unlike with a single corner, there’s more room for interpretation when it comes to chicanes.

https://ibb.co/HDZw5Wmd

https://ibb.co/mCLybjkT
There’s plenty of evidence that Max would have been able to make T2 easily and stay on track, but Hamilton jumping over the kerb and losing control for a moment forced Max to avoid a potential accident. There was certainly a significant chance that the stewards would have decided that no further action was warranted. Anyway, it was certainly worth the try, given hpw slow the car is, especially on a circuit like that where track position means everything.
Full video:
https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/s/1vD32E8CMG
Hamilton’s mistake is on full display here. It’s easy to see that neither Norris ahead of him nor Leclerc behind took the same line or made the same mistake. Both retained full control of their cars and maintained a smooth, predictable line all the way through the corner, unlike Lewis.

Yep, agreed. It was a dumb call and the race engineer should know better.

It was the same in Barcelona 2025 where GP asked him to give the position to RUS (leading to the whole collision saga) without any formal call from the race direction, losing them the WDC in hindsight.

[Emag]

Its funny how you can demand context to be applied on a selective manner and still claim the others are the ones who are being blinded by data. Somehow we are supposed to take for granted that a 10 lap sample is the one that needs to be considered entirely representative while the rest of the race is useless.

If you think RedBull really had a 4-5 tenth deficit to Kimi and more than that to Lando here then that’s up to your interpretation. Those numbers dont pop anywhere unless you deliberately dismiss 90% of the available data, but that’s an individual’s choice on what they think matters or not.

[Badger]

It would have been a guaranteed 10s penalty, no ifs and buts about it. Max came from too far back on the outside, he wasn't entitled to space according to the driving guidelines. It doesn't matter if he would have made the corner or not without Lewis there, because Lewis was there and had every right to squeeze him.

As for waiting for "FIA instruction", they don't give instructions anymore. They will leave it to the teams to make a decision on handing the place back, and if the team gets it wrong there is a minimum 10s penalty coming from the stewards.

So no, they didn't hand over a win by giving the place back, they saved a P2 by avoiding a 10 second penalty. And the relevant comparison isn't Spain 2025, it's Saudi 2025. Almost a carbon copy at the first corner.

[Badger]

Its funny how you can demand context to be applied on a selective manner and still claim the others are the ones who are being blinded by data. Somehow we are supposed to take for granted that a 10 lap sample is the one that needs to be considered entirely representative while the rest of the race is useless.

If you think RedBull really had a 4-5 tenth deficit to Kimi and more than that to Lando here then that’s up to your interpretation. Those numbers dont pop anywhere unless you deliberately dismiss 90% of the available data, but that’s an individual’s choice on what they think matters or not.

The joke is on you for thinking 100% of the lap times are relevant for judging pace when most of the race was spent in traffic. Absolutely nothing can be learned by watching Lando drive 20 laps within one second of Max except to say that he was quicker but stuck. Yet those are the kind of laps you want to bring into the sample instead of simply looking at the parts of the race when they were in free air and pushing. That is you being unreasonable and a bad data analyst, not us being biased.

[Valeo]

Red Bull's car is still degrading

The mysterious 'car degradation' problems afflicting Red Bull this season aren't going away, based on both Max Verstappen and team principal Laurent Mekies' comments in Madrid.

Red Bull is still not offering any insight on precisely what the problem is, but Mekies admitted it's still there, has been for a long time, and will be for the rest of the season.

"There is an element of car performance degradation that is happening through a session and through a race," said Mekies.

"He's [Verstappen is] right in saying it's not a new issue. We are not sleeping on it. We have been trying to tackle that in different ways.

"Obviously, I consider it a complex issue, otherwise we would get to the bottom of it. But everyone is very constructive about it and tries to make small steps at the time to be able to get to the bottom of it eventually.

"We had a couple of positive steps in that regard this weekend. It will never be the full picture, but we certainly have - through pain - made progress in our understanding.

"We don't have all the solutions yet in the car, but I trust that we are on the right way. It will not be fast, so it's something that will probably take us through next year."

https://www.the-race.com/formula-1/ever ... x-madring/

[basti313]

Yep, agreed. It was a dumb call and the race engineer should know better.

It was the same in Barcelona 2025 where GP asked him to give the position to RUS (leading to the whole collision saga) without any formal call from the race direction, losing them the WDC in hindsight.

Interesting....I did not look at this in this way, but I fear you are right. Not giving it back there would have been the better end result as well.

It would have been a guaranteed 10s penalty, no ifs and buts about it.
............
And the relevant comparison isn't Spain 2025, it's Saudi 2025. Almost a carbon copy at the first corner.

What? Your claim is 10sec and your precedent, Saudi, was a 5sec penalty?

[venkyhere]

Its funny how you can demand context to be applied on a selective manner and still claim the others are the ones who are being blinded by data. Somehow we are supposed to take for granted that a 10 lap sample is the one that needs to be considered entirely representative while the rest of the race is useless.

If you think RedBull really had a 4-5 tenth deficit to Kimi and more than that to Lando here then that’s up to your interpretation. Those numbers dont pop anywhere unless you deliberately dismiss 90% of the available data, but that’s an individual’s choice on what they think matters or not.

Dare I say that you are missing the forest for the trees. A 10 lap sample on same age tyres, with same fuel load, driven 'without tyre management' , without having a 'cork-in-the-bottle' blocker in front, is far more representative of the true pace of a car, than 40 laps that were driven at possibly different management levels in different cars, to suit their 'estimated' tyre life by their engineering staff based on live-data'. When P1 driver is trying to scramble at the front, to keep the chasing P2 as far behind as possible, whilst the P2 driver is running at full tilt, to avoid being eaten by the P3 driver who is in a much faster car, we can be pretty sure that both P1 and P2 are properly pushing. That is a good 'tell' of the relative pace between the cars.

[Wouter]

[Emag]

Its funny how you can demand context to be applied on a selective manner and still claim the others are the ones who are being blinded by data. Somehow we are supposed to take for granted that a 10 lap sample is the one that needs to be considered entirely representative while the rest of the race is useless.

If you think RedBull really had a 4-5 tenth deficit to Kimi and more than that to Lando here then that’s up to your interpretation. Those numbers dont pop anywhere unless you deliberately dismiss 90% of the available data, but that’s an individual’s choice on what they think matters or not.

The joke is on you for thinking 100% of the lap times are relevant for judging pace when most of the race was spent in traffic. Absolutely nothing can be learned by watching Lando drive 20 laps within one second of Max except to say that he was quicker but stuck. Yet those are the kind of laps you want to bring into the sample instead of simply looking at the parts of the race when they were in free air and pushing. That is you being unreasonable and a bad data analyst, not us being biased.

You keep taking what I say out of context for your own benefits. You're not meant to consider 100% of the race. That's definitely not what I said. You are however, supposed to look at the whole thing and discard the obvious junk, or at least weigh it appropriately.

If there's any data analyst that looks at a cluster of data points with an obvious outlier cloud and decides to take that as the representative set, then I pay zero attention to whatever they have to say immediately, because statistically that doesn't make sense.

In any case, since I never actually defended my view, I will tell you where it comes from.

The only thing that bothers me, is the extrapolation based on the last 10 laps. There's far more representative sets within the race without looking at the middle which you don't want to consider. Even the first stint is way more representative than the last 10 laps. You can look at that and you wont see a gap of more than 0.5s to Lando and 0.3s to Kimi on the extremes with a - 0.150s on the averages.

In qualifying itself, it would have been 4 tenths to Lando (assuming he doesn't f*ck up the last corner) and 2 tenths to Kimi.

RedBull's biggest problem in the last two races (at least), has been the fact that they they dropped off the longer the stint went on. They had the same issue in Monza. Look at Max vs Kimi in the second stint in Monza. They are very close to each other while clearing cars. Then there's another 3-4 laps where Max keeps up with Kimi on pace and then he immediately drops off really hard. I personally read that as a car which has good pace potential, but possible balance problems which don't allow the driver to sustain it. Could be many reasons for that (thermal deg, over-reliance in one axis, difficult balance which makes it hard to stay consistent as the mechanical grip drops off etc ...)

Which is why I can't take those last 10 laps at face value, because they're taken at a point where Mercedes is arguably at their best against the others. If you see where Kimi was gaining the most in his fastest laps for example, it's pretty much all in the last sector. The slow, rear-tire/traction dependent one.

The car is not as bad as people here make it to be. No one is saying it's the best, but it's not a complete disaster either. It's unfortunate we didn't get a more representative pool with regards to Ferrari, but even then, at worst I would put them equal at this race. The car is inconsistent, nobody can argue that much. But if it is not in a disfavourable track, the biggest issue that I see is sustained pace in the race. In ultimate pace, with another upgrade, I don't think it's unreasonable to think Max might have been on pole here (only if we assume Lando f*cks up). But that's an hypothetical nobody can say with confidence. All I know is that he was close enough as it is.

And I wouldn't be surprised to see them as second force behind McLaren briefly if they bring an upgrade before Mercedes brings theirs.

[Badger]

Yep, agreed. It was a dumb call and the race engineer should know better.

It was the same in Barcelona 2025 where GP asked him to give the position to RUS (leading to the whole collision saga) without any formal call from the race direction, losing them the WDC in hindsight.

Interesting....I did not look at this in this way, but I fear you are right. Not giving it back there would have been the better end result as well.

It would have been a guaranteed 10s penalty, no ifs and buts about it.
............
And the relevant comparison isn't Spain 2025, it's Saudi 2025. Almost a carbon copy at the first corner.

What? Your claim is 10sec and your precedent, Saudi, was a 5sec penalty?

Which was subsequently clarified that it would always be a 10s in the future to deter that from happening again. If you gain a position off track and keep it it's 10s.