2016 Red Bull Racing team - TAG Heuer

[Chuckjr]

While I agree many race weekends are needed to know if Max is the real deal, I don't feel it will hurt either team. Neither team is expected to win this year. If RB did it would be amazing so now is the perfect time to asses Max. It does not matter a lot if he does beach it because expectation is low. Furthermore, the less pressure of this moment by driving a car that cannot win - without other cars dropping out - is the perfect setting for the kid to render his skill set. It's as low a pressure situation as he will face in any top team likely ever again. It also secures him if he is a phenom.

If he blows and can't take what little pressure there is, no problem 2017 is unaffected and they can start another driver without losing a season with a driver that couldn't handle a top seat. No lost time with this decision.

Finally, did anybody really think KVY was a legit future title contender considering the current talent and what is coming up? Not seriously no. So what does it matter what happens with him or what he thinks? He's a paid driver. The team owes him nothing. Like Frank Williams said, drivers are just light bulbs. You simply screw in another when you finish with one. KVY was a placeholder and everybody knows it. That's why Matchizits (can never remember how to spell his name) treated him like he did. I don't blame him. He was not a future title contender.

TR is irrelevant to the championship aspirations of the RB enterprise other than being a driver providing machine, so it does not matter what that team thinks. They are there only to keep the jockeys coming. End of story. It's laughable they would be relevant to this decision or "what they think." This is a business.

The more I think about this move the more I like it. All the way around. Great job Red Bull.

Edit: KVY should give MAG a call because he is about to experience the same fate imo. Welcome to being an F1 driver.

[knabbel]

This is a pretty interesting analysis. Because I had always thought that Max was faster on qualy due to his explosive driving style and character. While Carlos should be faster on long runs, because of his calmer character and ability to find the correct balance.

But this season and even in 2015 Carlos was as fast as Max on Saturdays, and perhaps also on Sundays, but the has had more problems with set-up and tyre degradation during some races, which is surprising IMO.

Small warning as a Dutchman i'm biased a bit.

Max has a more fluent driving style than Carlos, Max brakes earlier but has a slower pressure build up. That is why he can outbreak a lot of people without locking up.

His setup approach is also different than Carlos'. Carlos alters the base setup bit by bit, while Max does a few big changes and then on Saturday morning he chooses a midpoint between those setups. That's why on Friday Carlos was faster, but on Saturday, it was Max who was slightly faster.

I still don't understand why people cal Max a spoiled brat, because if you see the the interviews (and there are a lot of interviews on dutch TV) he is far from spoiled. Yes he is confident, and if things are not OK he is outspoken, but that is not spoiled but just really typical Dutch. I work in a company in the Netherlands with a lot of colleagues from all over the world and they are all shocked the first weeks when they start working in a Dutch company. Most of them are not used at all about the open en honest communication that is typical Dutch

Max is also not in F1 to make friends, since he started racing with karts he is focused on one and only one thing, becoming F1 world champion.
But as far I can tell there was no fight between Carlos and Max, but it was more between the engineers of both drivers, and also between Tost and Xevi Pujolar. There was also no fight between Tost and (Jos) Verstappen, Tost was pissed off about a few decisions of Xevi and he said that in public to Jos

[Vasconia]

I can image how Dutch people are, we are too quite straightforward people but at times he sounds quite pretentious, but ok, he is very young so I can understand it. What I didnt like about him was his attitude during some races when he started to complain heavily because he couldnt overtake Carlos. Apart from this, I find great to have such an spectacular driver.

Carlos must improve little things for the races because he has proved that he can be as fast as Max. The only aspect where Max is clearly better is overtaking. Though he takes sometimes big risks to overtake.

[Andres125sx]

Time will only tell, because Verstappen has been clumsy as well last season and at the very beginning of this season.
- That shunt at Monaco, I thought he could have dealt with it a lot better than that
- The first lap at Silverstone, where he just spun off at the turn 1.
- Melbourne '16. Colliding with your teammate and nearly taking both off.

.

1. Before the crash he was driving like a champ (have you seen his race before the crash???? )
2. Rookie mistake
3. Sainz was slow at that point, but he should actually overtake by himself.

1. IMHO driving like a champ does not include colliding. It doesn´t matter how well you did it if you don´t see the checkered flag because you crashed. To finish first, you first need to finish.
2. Agree
3. Sainz was slow at that point... because he was stuck behind traffic. Max complained (as usual) trying to obtain one of those frequent presents from the wall (Carlos, let Max pass), but since he didn´t get it, he tried to overtake by himself, and almost ruin the race for the whole team when he crashed with his team mate

Anycase I think these are normal mistakes for someone that young. Including his arrogance. The problem becomes more serious when the team does not stop him and even promote it. Because disobeying TOs and the team doing nothing is exactly that, specially when his team mate let him pass several times before he was asked to do the same.

The message is crystal clear: you can do whatever you want, even disobeying those who pay your salary. I don´t think that´s the best approach to manage an almost adolescent character.

IMHO these kind of approach is very risky, specially for the driver. If he really is as good as some think then teams will cope with that problematic character, but if he´s not then his F1 career could be really short, because no F1 team will cope with someone who disobey TOs if he´s not one of the fastest F1 drivers out there.

For RBR that´s not a problem tough, as they only want winners and if you´re not they have lots of drivers to replace you. Max and Jos should keep this in mind before doing in RBR what they did in STR.

[ringo]

To me both are very equal drivers but Max takes more chances. This gives him that X factor that you see with most champions. He is more fearless than Carlos. Carlos, being older, is more methodical about his work and seems to be looking on long term career and he avoids making blunders which would somewhat tarnish his reputation. I don't see much difference between them talent wise. Max just has a knack for grasping the opportunities without second guessing.
There is a risk of his career being burning out quicker than Carlos'.

As for Daniil, i think this guy is going to transform into a beast back at torro rosso. I'm going to bet that he makes it on the podium another time before Ricciardo and Max do.

[rscsr]

I absolutely think that Max Verstappen has to match Daniel Ricciardo from the first race onwards. Stoffel Vandourne did match Button and he hasn't even been driving a F1 car after january. So I think that if he can't achieve the same he might be the youngest F1 driver out of F1 again.

[Cold Fussion]

I absolutely think that Max Verstappen has to match Daniel Ricciardo from the first race onwards. Stoffel Vandourne did match Button and he hasn't even been driving a F1 car after january. So I think that if he can't achieve the same he might be the youngest F1 driver out of F1 again.

He drove in a race in April and scored points.

[GrayGreat]

I absolutely think that Max Verstappen has to match Daniel Ricciardo from the first race onwards. Stoffel Vandourne did match Button and he hasn't even been driving a F1 car after january. So I think that if he can't achieve the same he might be the youngest F1 driver out of F1 again.

He drove in a race in April and scored points.

I think he is saying that Stoffel drove for the first time after January and matched Button, so Max would have to match Ricciardo to be considered real deal.

[SR71]

I see it that way as well.
Ricciardo was on the outside of Seb, and we've all seen a Driver follow the guy making a pass to take advantage.
That's what he was trying to do I think, get past Daniel.
Daniil just got his braking wrong and the rest is history.

I didn't say he did it on purpose but F1 racers are notorious spoiled brats as many have pointed out on this thread. If you really feel that way then commit to a stance.

This demotion is essentially the end of DKs career for the moment unless he does something like put that TR on the podium. He would have known his RB drive was over before the lights turned off in Russia.

I think he knew it was his last chance and he over did it, seems pretty simple but he wasn't qualified to be in that car in the first place if that's how he handles pressure like that.

PS- gotta love how you guys missed the important part of my post - MV to RB deal was done in China, let that sink in.

You said you "suspect Kvyat intentionally made that mistake"

I'm intrigued to know how someone can do something intentionally, but not on purpose

I'm intrigued how someone could laugh at someone else when they've so blatantly misread and failed to comprehend the original statement.

"If true one could suspect kvyat intentionally made that mistake"

Never said "I suspect" I was simply stating something that could be discussed given the new information.

If you don't know how to interpret that then I apologize English must not be your first language.

Apology accepted.

[SR71]

Time will only tell, because Verstappen has been clumsy as well last season and at the very beginning of this season.
- That shunt at Monaco, I thought he could have dealt with it a lot better than that
- The first lap at Silverstone, where he just spun off at the turn 1.
- Melbourne '16. Colliding with your teammate and nearly taking both off.

.

1. Before the crash he was driving like a champ (have you seen his race before the crash???? )
2. Rookie mistake
3. Sainz was slow at that point, but he should actually overtake by himself.

1. IMHO driving like a champ does not include colliding. It doesn´t matter how well you did it if you don´t see the checkered flag because you crashed. To finish first, you first need to finish.
2. Agree
3. Sainz was slow at that point... because he was stuck behind traffic. Max complained (as usual) trying to obtain one of those frequent presents from the wall (Carlos, let Max pass), but since he didn´t get it, he tried to overtake by himself, and almost ruin the race for the whole team when he crashed with his team mate

Anycase I think these are normal mistakes for someone that young. Including his arrogance. The problem becomes more serious when the team does not stop him and even promote it. Because disobeying TOs and the team doing nothing is exactly that, specially when his team mate let him pass several times before he was asked to do the same.

The message is crystal clear: you can do whatever you want, even disobeying those who pay your salary. I don´t think that´s the best approach to manage an almost adolescent character.

IMHO these kind of approach is very risky, specially for the driver. If he really is as good as some think then teams will cope with that problematic character, but if he´s not then his F1 career could be really short, because no F1 team will cope with someone who disobey TOs if he´s not one of the fastest F1 drivers out there.

For RBR that´s not a problem tough, as they only want winners and if you´re not they have lots of drivers to replace you. Max and Jos should keep this in mind before doing in RBR what they did in STR.

Max is being promoted for acting the way he has, he has nothing to be careful of.

From what I understand it was actually Carlos that has broken the interteam agreements first in both '15 and '16. What you hear on the radio has nothing to do with the confidential agreements both drivers have signed up for.

Max was actually in the right in Melbourne. They have made the switch because both sides of the TR garage are at an impass and there will be no peace between them unless 1 driver moves out. Max had not broken any official agreements so he got the promotion.

But hey let's keep arguing about 'press releases' the bastion of truth!

Edit: aww i was down voted for being a fanboy even though there wasn't a shred of fan boy evidence in my post, just new information.

Down voting is the equivalent of throwing your toys out so maybe the down voter will have held their mummy's hand and feels better now.

But I do agree with the down voter, Max has made every other F1 drivers career look average, especially grandpas like Seb, Lewis, and great grand dads like Alonso.

So anyone supporting Max in anyway will be immediately grouped into this massive and very real hype. So yes down voter, from your sad and bitter perspective I can see how me highlighting that Max did nothing wrong according to the team would seem like fanboyism. Did you get your toys back yet?

[A-Bap]

1. Before the crash he was driving like a champ (have you seen his race before the crash???? )
2. Rookie mistake
3. Sainz was slow at that point, but he should actually overtake by himself.

1. IMHO driving like a champ does not include colliding. It doesn´t matter how well you did it if you don´t see the checkered flag because you crashed. To finish first, you first need to finish.
2. Agree
3. Sainz was slow at that point... because he was stuck behind traffic. Max complained (as usual) trying to obtain one of those frequent presents from the wall (Carlos, let Max pass), but since he didn´t get it, he tried to overtake by himself, and almost ruin the race for the whole team when he crashed with his team mate

Anycase I think these are normal mistakes for someone that young. Including his arrogance. The problem becomes more serious when the team does not stop him and even promote it. Because disobeying TOs and the team doing nothing is exactly that, specially when his team mate let him pass several times before he was asked to do the same.

The message is crystal clear: you can do whatever you want, even disobeying those who pay your salary. I don´t think that´s the best approach to manage an almost adolescent character.

IMHO these kind of approach is very risky, specially for the driver. If he really is as good as some think then teams will cope with that problematic character, but if he´s not then his F1 career could be really short, because no F1 team will cope with someone who disobey TOs if he´s not one of the fastest F1 drivers out there.

For RBR that´s not a problem tough, as they only want winners and if you´re not they have lots of drivers to replace you. Max and Jos should keep this in mind before doing in RBR what they did in STR.

Max is being promoted for acting the way he has, he has nothing to be careful of.

From what I understand it was actually Carlos that has broken the interteam agreements first in both '15 and '16. What you hear on the radio has nothing to do with the confidential agreements both drivers have signed up for.

Max was actually in the right in Melbourne. They have made the switch because both sides of the TR garage are at an impass and there will be no peace between them unless 1 driver moves out. Max had not broken any official agreements so he got the promotion.

But hey let's keep arguing about 'press releases' the bastion of truth!

Are there any current odds that Max will be involved in a race-ending incident this weekend? Factors:

- Max will be hopped up
- Max will be eager to show Danny and the rest of the field what he can do with a real car
- The others will likely be aware of this, and keep en extra eye on Max; they may employ extra efforts to ensure he does't get past them.

[NL_Fer]

Max didn't show any agressive starts this year. He's smart, will keep his head down and keep that RB in one piece. Ric is in his best form now, so finishing in his trail will be realy good.

I don't understend the focus on beating Ric. Perez and KMag showed Button some driving, but who is still driving McLaren this year.

It is al about what the telemetry data will show the team. The action on de track is just for our entertainment.

[Webber2011]

I didn't say he did it on purpose but F1 racers are notorious spoiled brats as many have pointed out on this thread. If you really feel that way then commit to a stance.

This demotion is essentially the end of DKs career for the moment unless he does something like put that TR on the podium. He would have known his RB drive was over before the lights turned off in Russia.

I think he knew it was his last chance and he over did it, seems pretty simple but he wasn't qualified to be in that car in the first place if that's how he handles pressure like that.

PS- gotta love how you guys missed the important part of my post - MV to RB deal was done in China, let that sink in.

You said you "suspect Kvyat intentionally made that mistake"

I'm intrigued to know how someone can do something intentionally, but not on purpose

I'm intrigued how someone could laugh at someone else when they've so blatantly misread and failed to comprehend the original statement.

"If true one could suspect kvyat intentionally made that mistake"

Never said "I suspect" I was simply stating something that could be discussed given the new information.

If you don't know how to interpret that then I apologize English must not be your first language.

Apology accepted.

I was laughing at "intentionally", and the way it was used in your post.
I found it contradicting and comical, and still do

And no, English is not my first language.

I'm 'Strayan mate

I'd suggest you check your wording and phrasing before coming down on others.

Anyhow, I've got better things to do than argue with you.

Cheers, have a good day

[SR71]

You said you "suspect Kvyat intentionally made that mistake"

I'm intrigued to know how someone can do something intentionally, but not on purpose

I'm intrigued how someone could laugh at someone else when they've so blatantly misread and failed to comprehend the original statement.

"If true one could suspect kvyat intentionally made that mistake"

Never said "I suspect" I was simply stating something that could be discussed given the new information.

If you don't know how to interpret that then I apologize English must not be your first language.

Apology accepted.

I was laughing at "intentionally", and the way it was used in your post.
I found it contradicting and comical, and still do

And no, English is not my first language.

I'm 'Strayan mate

I'd suggest you check your wording and phrasing before coming down on others.

Anyhow, I've got better things to do than argue with you.

Cheers, have a good day

cheers

[djos]

Max might want to get some sleep or he is going to have a very bad weekend!
https://twitter.com/NobleF1/status/729778563176615936