Sauber F1 Team 2015

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Moxie
Moxie
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Joined: 06 Oct 2013, 20:58

Re: Sauber F1 Team 2015

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Manoah2u wrote:
because he wasn't expecting any media attention nor asking for it by making things public in the first place :roll:

and above all, he stated in his twitters and media attention before he was carrying his helmet and overalls because he was 'definately' going to race on sunday. instead, he did not wear his overalls from the year before, he took those of ericsson.
that's disrespect right there. he had his 2014 overall, and could/should and according to his own words, did have it in his suitcase. to then wear ericssons overall and not his own for a seat fitting, is as obvious as it gets.
Sponsorship deals being what they are, it probably would have been another contractual violation if VDG had appeared in last years coveralls.

KeiKo403
KeiKo403
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Joined: 18 Feb 2011, 00:16

Re: Sauber F1 Team 2015

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I really don't know what to say other than, he was contracted (in a fashion) as an employee of sauber who has a big/main sponsor as banco de Brazil from Nasr. Any sponsors that the team lost from last year can't be displayed on the race suit of a teams driver so he can't possibly wear his 2014 one in public anyway. Let alone the 2015 sponsors wouldn't be very happy to see the team have a driver of theirs parading around without their companies brand all over them.

Please let me apply some common sense here! GvdG wanted to make his point and claim what is rightfully his. To do this he had to get a seat fitting in a drivers suit. I'm sure he didn't kidnap Ericsson strip him down and wonder around the paddock putting on a Swedish accent! I'd assume that he was given a spare suit of Ericssons as it more closely matched his size and was instructed to go off get changed and come back! To be honest Sauber wasn't very accommodating as when I saw GvdG in Ericssons suit he was also carrying his jeans and top, sauber didn't seem to provide a locker or any where for him to store his personal clothes.

Maybe a better suggestion could be that as Top Gear had been taken off air that maybe the stig would go to Aus to beat up Riciardo and GvdG could make use of the stigs plain white unbranded Fire resistant race suit?

Please someone tell me I'm not the only one getting bored of all this "it was disrespectful" balls!
And for the record I don't care if this results in down votes so cry and thumbs down all you want!

Manoah2u
Manoah2u
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Joined: 24 Feb 2013, 14:07

Re: Sauber F1 Team 2015

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news reports state that Bernie called last friday with Mr. Boekhoorn (whom probably was the driving force behind this entire thing). The report stats Bernie had enough of the entire sharade and made some financial guarantees to Sauber where sauber had to pay for a 15m+ sum to GvdG's business. It states with this any F1 prospects of GvdG are now history, and Boekhoorn has not bought into the team. The money had to be on GvdG's account on monday, otherwise Sauber would have to give Ericsson's seat to GvdG starting @ Malaysia. The money arrived and things are now closed.

In other words, finally, this entire thing is now over. =D> =D> =D>

So thankfully, all the boekhoorn, gvdg, colin kolles speculation can be put to a rest now. =D> 8)
"Explain the ending to F1 in football terms"
"Hamilton was beating Verstappen 7-0, then the ref decided F%$& rules, next goal wins
while also sending off 4 Hamilton players to make it more interesting"

Manoah2u
Manoah2u
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Joined: 24 Feb 2013, 14:07

Re: Sauber F1 Team 2015

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bill shoe wrote:Incredible as it seems, everything that's happened so far is only half of the Sauber fiasco. Conspicuous silence so far regarding the other half, a Mr. Adrian Sutil.
Or there is simply not a thing going on at all with mr Sutil and their issues or situation has been resolved ages ago.
If not, it could be mr. Sutil is actually doing it the right, gentleman's, way and not making a media circus out of it,
because dispite not running in F1 this year, Sutil actually still has a racing career, unlike mr. VdG whom just thrown
everything in the garbage bin. So instead of ending any prospect on continuing his F1 career, AND at the same time
not being dependant of a rich sugar-stepdaddy to cover your tracks and lay your paths, Sutil probably is thinking
about career outside of F1.
Like every other F1 driver that in the post got 'left in the cold' when pushed aside for more money: resolving things
internally [which does not mean there has not been court cases going on in the background]

anyway......let's not drag this court bs even further.

Image
Image

so, what if RedBull decides to step back from F1 as a team? could they choose to return to Sauber as a sponsor?
"Explain the ending to F1 in football terms"
"Hamilton was beating Verstappen 7-0, then the ref decided F%$& rules, next goal wins
while also sending off 4 Hamilton players to make it more interesting"

Moxie
Moxie
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Joined: 06 Oct 2013, 20:58

Re: Sauber F1 Team 2015

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KeiKo403 wrote:
Please someone tell me I'm not the only one getting bored of all this "it was disrespectful" balls!
And for the record I don't care if this results in down votes so cry and thumbs down all you want!
=D> =D> =D> =D> =D>

Fanboys love to give thumbs down out of spite around the forum. You will have to get used to it. To some, reason just doesn't matter.

Manoah2u
Manoah2u
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Joined: 24 Feb 2013, 14:07

Re: Sauber F1 Team 2015

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Moxie wrote:
KeiKo403 wrote:
Please someone tell me I'm not the only one getting bored of all this "it was disrespectful" balls!
And for the record I don't care if this results in down votes so cry and thumbs down all you want!
=D> =D> =D> =D> =D>

Fanboys love to give thumbs down out of spite around the forum. You will have to get used to it. To some, reason just doesn't matter.
yep, just because there's a red-white-blue flag associated here, any critisim gets downvotes from those who can't distinguish between red-white-blue and any form of criticism. just look at the post above #-o :-({|=
nothing new though, anything critical of redbull gets treated the same, as with ferrari, vettel, alonso, hamilton, etc.
"Explain the ending to F1 in football terms"
"Hamilton was beating Verstappen 7-0, then the ref decided F%$& rules, next goal wins
while also sending off 4 Hamilton players to make it more interesting"

nokivasara
nokivasara
2
Joined: 27 Nov 2014, 20:53

Re: Sauber F1 Team 2015

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I'm glad it's settled but not really the way I'd hoped, not with Bernie stepping in to sort things out.
It's always all about the money when big boys play. VDG is the big loser here, I guess they should have taken it slow and not force a decission (spl?) before the first race.

Good thing it's over though so we can go back to racing, that's what brings us here in the first place :)

KeiKo403
KeiKo403
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Joined: 18 Feb 2011, 00:16

Re: Sauber F1 Team 2015

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Manoah2u wrote:yep, just because there's a red-white-blue flag associated here, any critisim gets downvotes from those who can't distinguish between red-white-blue and any form of criticism. just look at the post above #-o :-({|=
nothing new though, anything critical of redbull gets treated the same, as with ferrari, vettel, alonso, hamilton, etc.
If you're refering to the down vote of your last post I imagine the downvote was because of this.
Manoah2u wrote:If not, it could be mr. Sutil is actually doing it the right, gentleman's, way and not making a media circus out of it,
I'm not gonna downvote it myself, but I still think you're wrong! That can be for dicussion though, which is what forums are for after all right? Discussions are what I've seen you do on here before so respect to you for that! (seriously, not sarcasm!)

I fear it was Sauber which made the circus out of it. Turning up to court with something which displayed a very low threshold of the word "defence". Yes GvdG took them to court, at that point they could've looked at it and said, we are in the wrong, lets try and work something out. But no, instead he was sacked in the hope he'd go away and forget about the money he'd lost and forget about the presitige that goes along being ranked in the top 20 drivers in the world!

GvdG did the right thing.

I'd go as far as to say that GvdG is a hero of all up-and-coming pay drivers which inevitably get screwed over by teams who get screwed over by Bernie!

That's my 2 cents anyway....keep the change!! :o

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cristobal
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Joined: 25 Feb 2006, 17:31
Location: Lucerne (Switzerland)

Re: Sauber F1 Team 2015

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Official Statement from Giedo van der Garde:

Giedo van der Garde statement
‘We have reached a settlement with Sauber and my driver contract with the team has been ended by mutual consent. As a passionate race driver, I feel sad and am very disappointed. I have worked very hard my entire career, ever since starting with go-karts at the age of eight, to live my dream and become a successful Formula One driver. I had hoped at last to be able to show what I am capable of, driving a car for a respected midfield team in the 2015 season. This dream has been taken away from me and I know that my future in Formula One is probably over.
I had a valid driver contract for the entire 2015 season and enforceable rights to it. I pushed very hard until last Saturday in Melbourne to get the drive that I was entitled to. This legal process started in 2014 and has taken a great deal of effort. It was never a last minute thing, but it only became public in the last week when we tried to force the team to accept the rulings of a succession of legal authorities and courts.
I am a race driver and all I want is to race. However, the team principal was adamant not to let me drive, notwithstanding my legal rights to do so and a series of rulings and court orders in my favour and despite my race driving abilities. I will never understand this. I could have persisted, but the team principal had taken a decision contrary to my contract that she would not work with me and this became painfully clear in the paddock in Melbourne. To push on against this determination might have brought down the team, it would most certainly have wrecked the opening Grand Prix in Melbourne because the team´s cars would have been seized by the court, it may have ruined the careers of two young drivers Marcus Ericsson and Felipe Nasr. Possibly the team´s directors would even be taken into custody. I decided I did not want to live with that idea, even though it was only the team’s management that was responsible for the bizarre situation I found myself in.
I am very grateful to my fans and many friends in Formula One who have given me a lot of support during the last couple of months. This period has been very difficult for me especially since I could not talk to anybody about the pending proceedings. Last week, many drivers on the grid gave me their support and several of them did so openly in the media as well. The same goes for several leading figures in the paddock who include team bosses and reputable former Formula One drivers. I thank them as well.
My future in motorsport has not finished: on the contrary, I see this as a new beginning. I will sit down with my management in the coming weeks to discuss my future plans. I would love to take part in the WEC and the Le Mans 24 Hours in an LMP1 car. Former Formula One drivers do very well in this series. We also have our eye on other series such as the DTM in 2016 and beyond.
There has been a lot of speculation in the media over the past week, so I want to set out clearly that my sponsors paid the sponsorship fee related to the 2015 season in its entirety to Sauber in the first half of 2014. This was simply in good faith and to help the team deal with its cash problems at the time. Effectively, it was my sponsor’s advanced payments that helped the team survive in 2014.
Sauber’s financial decision-making in this case is bizarre and makes no sense to me. I am not at liberty to discuss details, but Sauber paid significant compensation to avoid honouring the contract they had with me. Only in that respect can I be satisfied that my rights have finally been recognised and that at least some justice has been done.
I want to thank McGregor for sponsoring me from the time I won the Formula Renault 3.5 Ltr. Series in 2008. I hope we can continue to build on this as my motorsport career goes forward in other series.
I want to thank my family, my father Gerrit and my wife Denise in particular, for their tireless support throughout the years that I have been chasing my Formula One dream. The last couple of months have been especially hard for me but they have always stood by me. Of course, I also want to thank my father-in-law, Marcel Boekhoorn, who has been a great supporter during my entire career through the motorsport ranks. Without him, I would not have got this far.
I also thank Jeroen Schothorst and Jan Paul ten Hoopen for managing my career and business affairs since 2008 and in particular for their unconditional support during these last four and a half months. I also extend thanks to my legal advisor Gijs Rooijens and the law firms, Druces, Blackstone Chambers and King & Wood Mallesons (Australia), that worked very hard and enthusiastically – sometimes literally day and night and during weekends – to fight for my rights.
Finally, I would like to direct a few words to the teams, drivers, future drivers, their managers and the Formula One governing bodies. I sincerely hope that what has happened to me will start a movement aimed at setting new standards and bringing about new regulations to help protect the rights of drivers. I would like to think that the values and business ethics that apply in any other business should be equally applicable in Formula One. I am lucky to have had Marcel and Jeroen on my side. Both of them have extensive backgrounds in business and bring a lot of expertise to the table when it comes to resolving complicated business affairs. Without them, I would have remained empty-handed in the wake of this extraordinary affair. There are numerous examples of talented drivers with good intentions but without the sort of professional support that I have had, who have been broken by Formula One and who have seen their careers destroyed. I therefore hope that my unprecedented case which was heard last week by the Supreme Court of Victoria at Melbourne will serve as an example to illustrate what should change, and that new regulations will be implemented to help protect driver rights.’
For more information and questions, please send an e-mail to: joost@9024international.com

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FW17
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Re: Sauber F1 Team 2015

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Phil
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Re: Sauber F1 Team 2015

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bdr529 wrote:I do appreciate what you've said Phil, and I'm sure I'd be more inclined with your point of view if I hadn't been though this a few times already myself, as it stands I'm 4-1 and 2 of them went the other way from what I thought
Sadly, I've had my fair share of court cases too. What it has shown me is that it's not always necessarely about who is in the "right", but what can be proven and what not. Sometimes, court cases are so complex, that it's difficult to find a clear verdict. This is also nicely demonstrated by the fact that the same trial going through multiple instances can result in different verdicts. The first court might decide in one parties favour, the next higher one in the other.

While it's easy to say that 'right' is always ultimately what the court decides, people who have been in this position (you included) probably know better. And I'm not a sore loser by any means; I'm perfectly aware that this is the only way it will ever be and how a trial system can work.

This isn't to say Sauber is in the right by any means - I'm just voicing my opinion and experience on trials. And in that sense, that the first and only relevant case - the ruling by the Arbitration Court - was not yet a legal binding verdict and still a case in process as long as one party decides to appeal and is legally entitled to. Given how this case proceeded outside F1 and in a civil case, I wouldn't bet against the arbitration court not going into too much detail of the contract complexity. In any case, I'm certainly not blaming VdG for what he did; he had the first ruling on his side and this enabled him to go through the Australian justice system to enforce that verdict for the Australian GP. In light of his desire to race (again; looking past any alterior motive), it's the only option he had to enforce his right and the only cards he had to play. Fair play to him.


I'm glad that this whole case seems to be over. Following Sauber's struggles for a long time now (Hinwil and Sauber Motorsports AG are ~30 Minute drive from where I live), I'm really happy that they can now focus on driving and hopefully continueing on their form displayed in Australia. They might be benefiting from lots of midfield teams struggling and the Ferrari PU that has made great progress, so now is the time to get the points, which are as important as ever. Really happy about the Singapore sponsoring news - they can use all they can get, and Singapore Airlines is a prominent one, even if it's perhaps a rather small deal.
Not for nothing, Rosberg's Championship is the only thing that lends credibility to Hamilton's recent success. Otherwise, he'd just be the guy who's had the best car. — bhall II
#Team44 supporter

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Hail22
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Re: Sauber F1 Team 2015

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https://twitter.com/SauberF1Team/status ... 0109813760 Official tweet from Sauber F1, So I assume this partnership is includes free freight of equipment?
If someone said to me that you can have three wishes, my first would have been to get into racing, my second to be in Formula 1, my third to drive for Ferrari.

Gilles Villeneuve

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turbof1
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Re: Sauber F1 Team 2015

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cristobal wrote:Official Statement from Giedo van der Garde:
....
I'm feeling quite sad about Giedo vd Garde. Maybe he wasn't the best driver around there, but he had dreams which looked very realistic last year. Sauber just held the cookie in front of him but just when he had his mouth open to take a bite, sauber took it away.

I'm surely not the only one saying this, but I have lost my respect in Sauber. They should be quite lucky that Giedo atleast had empathy, because Sauber lacked every ounce of it.
#AeroFrodo

nokivasara
nokivasara
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Re: Sauber F1 Team 2015

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It's sad because VDG was just a puppet in this show. I don't like how in F1, no contracts are 100% waterproof, this is like the Ferrari buyout when Alonso took over Kimis seat only that VDG wanted to keep his, Kimi was fine with stepping aside. VDGs management went for the money, Bernies money.
I think Peter Sauber makes a mistake in keeping kalterborn, if the VDG statement is 100% true she should go.

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WaikeCU
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Re: Sauber F1 Team 2015

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Sad to see VdG leaving F1. I would really have liked to see how fast he really was and the ideal moment was with Sauber this season. I believe you can't prove your worth in a Caterham, because that team has been riding in the back of the field since the very beginning.