Red Bull Racing have announced an agreement with Honda Motor Co Ltd to race with the Japanese manufacturer’s power units for the 2019 and 2020 Formula 1 seasons. The team therefore joins sister team Toro Rosso after their switch to Honda ahead of the 2018 season.
If you think a driver of Ricciardo's caliber would have a contract that allows him to be demoted to STR without legal consequences , it's your delusion, not mineZynerji wrote: ↑07 Aug 2018, 13:43You apparently have zero understanding of how Redbull operates...It's almost childlike.
I think the delusion is in your belief that you can speak of a confidential document with any certainty.flmkane wrote: ↑08 Aug 2018, 00:17If you think a driver of Ricciardo's caliber would have a contract that allows him to be demoted to STR without legal consequences , it's your delusion, not mine
There is every possiblity that it's not mentioned in his contract. Whenever he signed the last deal it might not have crossed his mind that it was even a possibilityflmkane wrote: ↑08 Aug 2018, 00:17If you think a driver of Ricciardo's caliber would have a contract that allows him to be demoted to STR without legal consequences , it's your delusion, not mine
If such a possibility never crossed his mind then he should fire his agent immediately.marmer wrote: ↑08 Aug 2018, 06:22There is every possiblity that it's not mentioned in his contract. Whenever he signed the last deal it might not have crossed his mind that it was even a possibility
You as well are using imagination. Neither of you know what is in the document. You're both extrapolating from observations and experience. I wouldn't say either of you is delusional, just making best guesses. To which both seem plausible.Zynerji wrote: ↑08 Aug 2018, 05:12I think the delusion is in your belief that you can speak of a confidential document with any certainty.
My speculation is based upon historic contracts at RBR. Yours is based upon nothing but your imagination.
Sorry.. dignity over competitiveness? He mishandled his team, got into trouble for that, and as a result went to Renault as they are prepared to pay him 35 MMUSD/year. He's not taking time off or making a 'Lewis' move, Renault is not Mercedes. He's cashing in. There, I said it.roon wrote: ↑07 Aug 2018, 20:29It will be difficult to unseat Merc and Ferrari. And the best chassis and aero on the grid looks to be getting a better engine. I think Ric just wants different teammates. Who knows if he'll see podiums again. Maybe he's choosing dignity over competitiveness.Just_a_fan wrote: ↑07 Aug 2018, 19:21Maybe he just doesn't want to be the next Mark Webber at RedBull with Max taking the Vettel role. Can't say I blame him for that.
It could also be a "Lewis moment" - go to a team that is looking like it's getting better in the hope that there's enough there to mould the team around himself. Let's face it, if Renault do find something in the next year or two, he'll be well placed to benefit from it. If they don't, he's no worse off than he is now anyway.
Only in the sense of: if he felt he was becoming the second driver and/or was facing a potential demotion (as some others here speculate).
Agreed roon. He mishandled the team in my opinion by openly preferring a Ferrari or Mercedes seat. He miscalculated by thinking both these teams would want him, and when he got a reality check and lost his bargaining position, still went for a single-year contract, again basically saying: "I want to leave this team". So my guess is he left for the money as I don't think RB would have offered him much after that.
He said this?
Sorry for the basic question: 2018 was a single year contract with RB?TwanV wrote: ↑08 Aug 2018, 09:58He miscalculated by thinking both these teams would want him, and when he got a reality check and lost his bargaining position, still went for a single-year contract, again basically saying: "I want to leave this team". So my guess is he left for the money as I don't think RB would have offered him much after that.
You are wrong, RedBull themselves have confirmed they offered Dan complete contact parity right down to salary and bonuses.TwanV wrote: ↑08 Aug 2018, 09:58Agreed roon. He mishandled the team in my opinion by openly preferring a Ferrari or Mercedes seat. He miscalculated by thinking both these teams would want him, and when he got a reality check and lost his bargaining position, still went for a single-year contract, again basically saying: "I want to leave this team". So my guess is he left for the money as I don't think RB would have offered him much after that.
Roon: https://www.news.com.au/sport/motorspor ... 34bf2c0ce9roon wrote: ↑08 Aug 2018, 10:07He said this?
Sorry for the basic question: 2018 was a single year contract with RB?TwanV wrote: ↑08 Aug 2018, 09:58He miscalculated by thinking both these teams would want him, and when he got a reality check and lost his bargaining position, still went for a single-year contract, again basically saying: "I want to leave this team". So my guess is he left for the money as I don't think RB would have offered him much after that.
Max has done just that over 20 times I would guestimate (overtake Ricci on track) over their time together whilst Ricci has only ever accomplished that in Baku (with a tow and DRS in headwind that was neigh on imposssible to fend off) this year (or at a start melee when Kimi pushed Max into the astro turf at Hungary last year). Just from memory. The first year together their qualy battle was still close (in the begin Ric had the overhand, only when Max started to go for his own set-up he turned it around). Every race where they are on similar set-ups we see max being that bit faster. The B strategy (or shall we say the alternative option) is not per definition the worse one (like we saw in spain 2016, where Ric blamed it all on having the poor strategy, but his tires exploded even after having an extra pitstop and both Vettel and Him were on the A strategy (Kimi and Max on B) and Max took his much older tires to the finish. I might have misinterpret (becuae being able to start in front indeed is a major advantage) but you make it sound like it is a done deal only due to circumstances but I feel Max just is better, not only over 1 lap. The reason that Ric outscored Max is that he is a great driver in his own right and he is always looking to maximize the points whilst Max is looking to fight for a win if he can (as long as WDC is out of sight). This year f.e. Max clashed with Hamilton in both Bahrein and China (costing him the win) Ricci would have never done that. In China he only took a gamble for the win with Bottas, but with Hamilton he just waited until he could blow by. That is also something Max still has to learn, eventhough he was already at the tail of Hamilton (and all over him with thee fresh tires) just wait until the unstoppable opportunity Is there. Max then just goes for it sometimes still too soon. I hope Ricci will finish this season with RBR (Jake Dennis is making an announcement tomorrow according to his twitter acount) and them both can battle it out and see who gets the most points.alexx_88 wrote: ↑08 Aug 2018, 10:39You can easily rationalize Dan's logic on this, even without a pay difference from Renault.
On average, do we all agree that Max is faster over one lap? I think statistics show this to be the case. Now imagine RB is the fastest car of the field, even by a small margin. Statistics say Dan would start behind Max more often than not. Max would get first choice in strategy which usually translates into finishing ahead of his teammate. Ric's only chance would be to either be much faster on used tires than Max is on new tires or to overtake him on track.
As I said more than once, I'm a big Ric fan, but this formula, when it comes to racing against teammates, qualifying is the way to finish ahead and Dan lacks that extra tenth against Max. For all we know, Max could have an extra tenth over everyone in the field, but seeing Ric against Hulk should provide at least some answers in that direction.
