2013 Bahrain GP - Sakhir

[Gridlock]

Front row: RBR

Podium: RBR + A. N. Other (probably Alonso) in 3rd.

The first race that's on at a reasonable time of day and I worry that it will be a snorefest.

[Dragonfly]

The only issue I have is that the tyres are what they are. During re-fueling, the choice to how quick the car could lap the circuit was mainly in the teams and drivers hand. If they wanted quicker lap times, they would do shorter stints with less fuel - if they wanted a different strategy, they would do more fuel with longer stints. In that sense, it was easy to calculate what is mathematically the quickest way to complete the race, but not knowing what the other drivers do and where you would drop into traffic when you would pit, added a certain element of unpredictability as well.

That's not true. Just look at Vettel's last stint in China - with very little fuel and still they didn't risk more than 5 quick laps. And his times were already increasing.
I've seen this refueling explanation several times in different places but I don't accept it. True, there is difference in starting with a full tank, but this difference is not so huge to be a decisive factor. Tyres simply do not hold, so even bringing back refueling will not change much.

[Websta]

The only issue I have is that the tyres are what they are. During re-fueling, the choice to how quick the car could lap the circuit was mainly in the teams and drivers hand. If they wanted quicker lap times, they would do shorter stints with less fuel - if they wanted a different strategy, they would do more fuel with longer stints. In that sense, it was easy to calculate what is mathematically the quickest way to complete the race, but not knowing what the other drivers do and where you would drop into traffic when you would pit, added a certain element of unpredictability as well.

That's not true. Just look at Vettel's last stint in China - with very little fuel and still they didn't risk more than 5 quick laps. And his times were already increasing.
I've seen this refueling explanation several times in different places but I don't accept it. True, there is difference in starting with a full tank, but this difference is not so huge to be a decisive factor. Tyres simply do not hold, so even bringing back refueling will not change much.

I think you've missed Phil's point - I believe he is saying why he preferred the strategic elements and unpredictability that refuelling brought to F1 over the strategic elements and unpredictability that the Pirelli tyres bring. He is not advocating bringing refuelling back to help reduce the tyre wear.

[outer_bongolia]

I think you've missed Phil's point - I believe he is saying why he preferred the strategic elements and unpredictability that refuelling brought to F1 over the strategic elements and unpredictability that the Pirelli tyres bring. He is not advocating bringing refuelling back to help reduce the tyre wear.

The times with refueling was not that unpredictable.But I do not like the huge problems with these tires, either. When the pits tell you to not protect your position, it is no longer good racing.
I do not think there is a magic wand that will make the racing a good combination of strategy and challenge. But I believe the pendulum swung too far towards passing and the epic fights have disappeared. Before that, it was far on the other side and was just a procession. I kind of miss the late 80's, early 90's.
I hope the harder compounds in Bahrain will make the race a little more exciting.

[tpe]

2012 for Bahrain we have 3 pitstops.
With current trend, 3 pitstops is the minimum. Also, the Sakhir circuit will be very dusty. I don't believe that they can afford 4 with 2 super fast stints. Tyres are not good this year.

[Vasconia]

Well it wouldn't make much sense to bring the soft and super soft here as they wouldn't last more than two laps to 6 laps

I can understand this change taking into account how little the soft tyres lasted in the last race, but what they are going to do after Barcelona is a complete shame.

If Raikkonen gets a good position to start the race I think he will win the race, last years he had a bad Saturday but he finished second, Lotus will be incredibly fast on Sunday.

[dren]

Yes, I expect Lotus to be up there. I also expect Mercedes to be nipping at the bottom end of the podium. Alonso is always in the mix. It will be interesting to see how Ferrari go here in the warmer temps. I don't know if Red Bull will be in the mix or not. All the teams might have jumped them a bit after the 3 week break. We will see.

[raymondu999]

I love to speculate too, but I think the best course of action is probably to look at FP1 data and go from there.

[StrikeForceF1]

LOL hope this quote thingy works

Sorry have to disagree with you there

Lol no reason to be sorry mate - everyone has their own opinions and preferences.

with no pitstops and no overtaking I think racing will just become a snore fest as it was in the Schumi days

If all you did was watch the race highlights - yes. The BBC put it the best when in their hour-long 2011 season review, they gave an entire 4 seconds to the Valencia GP. It's just that I think F1 is more than the television show, and more than the on-track action. I probably spend 60% of my time during a GP staring at timing screens and working out strategies and calculating ahead to the race finish, and so I really don't mind. (I proudly correctly predicted Button to finish P5, and Vettel to be P4 and harassing P3 by the end of the race )

Thats correct.....I agree....F1 is more than a tv show it is more than the on-track action...thats why I love it...its also about the strategy...making the best of what you got and if you miles ahead of the competition than congratulations to you.

....with aero being the dependent factor that they are and have been for a while the cars would end where they started, given the reliability these days...

If they managed to build a car reliable enough to win the race - and at a greater speed than the others - then you've done the best job, in my opinion. You should be rewarded.

agreed

so than my question to you is why even have an F1 race when all you need is a 1 lap qualifying shoot out like we used to have(boring in my opinion) and award the points accordingly and decide the world championship that way.

Well it wouldn't be *as* grim, because race vs qualifying pace would probably still be different to each other.

Aaah now we getting somewhere, what good is that race pace if as you say "0 pitstops and 0 overtaking" ,I think you said , If you don'y qualify on poll than it is useless....If I qualify with a car that is lets say 0.5 s slower in race trim, you can run for a hundred laps but without overtaking would mean that I would still finish in front of you the same way we started and as such the race was just a parade and would serve no use as without overtaking everyone would finish the race in the same position they qualified in thus better to just issue points for qualifying because you will already know the outcome of the race. As things stand at the moment it is because of the variations that you can calculate and work out where the guys are going to finish but still the outcome can be different from the postions where the drivers qualified in.

It is absolutely pointless if you are going to have a race with no overtaking...

Tell that to the Olympics and the sprint races.

F1 should, IMO - be a competition, not a show. Or should we start giving Usain Bolt success ballast?

[/quote][/quote]

Agree fully and I think most people agree with you because if the competion gets better invariably the show gets better too but it is very difficult to get the recipe right in F1 and as I posted somewhere else on this site that F1 goes through phases and as Kimi said in an interview this weekend.....it is what it is, we have to make the best of what we got.

Edit* thats better but not perfect....Eish

[Mika1]

I love to speculate too, but I think the best course of action is probably to look at FP1 data and go from there.

I prefer FP2 data.

[raymondu999]

FP2 data of course is of a much better quality and accuracy than FP1 data - but as an alternative to speculation, FP1 data serves a lot better because it comes to us earlier

[Darknight]

Once again we have rain here today. Hope it rains during the race

[Maelstrom]

I personally love wet races... spices things up nicely.

[Mika1]

Once again we have rain here today. Hope it rains during the race

Do you think that would be possible?

[Neno]

Once again we have rain here today. Hope it rains during the race

Do you think that would be possible?

Nope, it's only possible if you gather all your friends and constantly peeing on track. I dont know how someone can expect rain, in middle of desert, when every drop of rain automatically dry on hot asphalt after few seconds on 40 celsius temperature

i expect going bellow -7 reputation after this comment