Italian GP 2006

DaveKillens · Post 09 Sep 2006, 21:56

Alonso had pitted to replace the blown tire, then pitted again a couple laps later. At that time, when he exited the pits, there was around 1:30 remaining in the session. Alonso had to hustle to circulate a lap before the clock expired, so that he could get one last qualifying lap in. Massa was never withing 30 meters of Alonso, until exiting the parabolica, where to be honest, downforce is the most important. I do believe that Massa being behind Alonso did affect his lap times. But There was no way Alonso could give way, in fact the closely following Massa didn't cross the finish line until after the clock had expired, while Alonso made it by the skin of his teeth, maybe a second or less.
Alonso was just out there trying to get a decent lap in, he should not have been penalized.

pRo · Post 09 Sep 2006, 21:57

wazojugs wrote:I had recorded the race as i was at santa pod watching the european drag racing, watching that final lap again and again and massa was nowhere near the rear of alosno

I also watched it again.

Massa might hope he's close, but he isn't. There's some 2 second gap between them. We've seen smaller gaps getting away without any penalty. Of course the car behind hasn't been red in those cases.

FLC · Post 09 Sep 2006, 22:01

Even Symonds' statement is weird. If Alonso was 100m away from Massa then we're talking about what? a lil bit more than a sec. in Monza's speeds? That maybe a lot for the cars but it's nothing for the drivers reflexes.

Couldnt Massa be quicker because he was with less fuel and with new tyres?

What kind of a mistake is for a driver to lift the thruttle in qualy? Isnt it the opposite usualy? Trying to push too hard?

Did he forget that in the past drivers had a lot more time to set their fastest laps? That they had a lot more of it to avoid traffic?

Why didnt Renault protest about the start of the race in Turkey? because back then they had their hand on top?

Ignis Fatuus · Post 09 Sep 2006, 22:04

manchild wrote: You're a sweetheart

Alonso was on his out lap and drove so fast because he had very little time to start his last flying lap. but it doesn't change a thing IMHO. Massa was not close enough.

pRo · Post 09 Sep 2006, 22:08

FLC wrote:Even Symonds' statement is weird. If Alonso was 100m away from Massa then we're talking about what? a lil bit more than a sec. in Monza's speeds?

You have to remember that the distance is shortest when the cars are driving slowest. That's in a corner, not at the end of the straight. Say they were going 200kmh when the distance was 100m and it means 1.8 seconds.

I'm not sure what the speeds are on the last corner. But surely nothing compared to "Monza's speeds" at the end of the straight.

West · Post 09 Sep 2006, 22:11

I didn't see today's qualifying, but the things the FIA has done to Renault are appalling.

When I heard about the mass-damper system being banned as an aerodynamic influence, I was wondering what the hell the FIA was smoking, because it probably was real good.

Then you had the race in Hungary, where MS still got a point after jumping the chicane twice. And he wasn't even penalized or anything.

Turkey: the carbon fiber rim covers AREN'T an aerodynamic device? Only a crackhead organization like the FIA is going to buy that.

Now, again I must state I didn't see qualy, but the fact that people are talking about the FIA, Ferrari, and Renault, IN A CONTRAVERSIAL matter, sickens me. Especially since Renault always ends up with the short end of the stick.

My interest in F1 has waned greatly this year due to lack of competition. Now you have retarded sh*t like this. It's pathetic. The sad part is that the FIA don't care what happens because it will profit from everything anyway.

I hope Renault wins both titles and shoves those trophies down Max's throat. Michelin and Renault can then release a press statement: "The FIA bastards tried locking us down, but we ended up on top, so here's a double middle finger to them"

wazojugs · Post 09 Sep 2006, 22:12

With alonso back in 10th i can see him being punted off at the first chicane and schumi winning

bringing it all down to the final fly away races, where i also predict.....

renault will be disqualified for leading race in china

wheels turning around on the car in the pit lane resulting to start from the pit lane in japan

trailer in paddock parked over the white in parking bay sending alonso 10 places back on the grid.

pRo · Post 09 Sep 2006, 22:14

wazojugs wrote:trailer in paddock parked over the white in parking bay sending alonso 10 places back on the grid.

At least that would be a real reason.

vyselegend · Post 09 Sep 2006, 22:33

FLC wrote:Even Symonds' statement is weird. If Alonso was 100m away from Massa then we're talking about what? a lil bit more than a sec.

100m is a short gap in formula one, that's true. I agree it may lead to a downforce loss for Massa in Parabolica.
As well as an advantage in the preceding and following straights, as Pat Symonds points out.

What is unfair is that FA is punished for that while almost every cars should be penalised as well, because during the whole session I've never seen a driver backing off to let pass a faster car unless the faster car was at least 40m away. Show me a car that let pass a faster one when at this similar distance. Plus as wazojugs stated, even with no data evidence, we all know that a 100m gap in a turn can lead to a much biger gap in the straights.

wazojugs · Post 09 Sep 2006, 22:37

Martin brundle said in commentary on that lap that it was a shame massa wasn't closer to alonso coming out of parabolica as he would have got a tow over the start finish line.

janus · Post 09 Sep 2006, 22:37

Below is the full decision by the Italian Grand Prix stewards on the matter of Renault driver Fernando Alonso:

A report was received from the race director that stated that the driver of car No. 1, Fernando Alonso, had impeded another driver during qualifying, namely Felipe Massa, car No. 6.

The stewards after hearing the explanation of both the drivers, their team managers, and having seen video evidence and data supplied by Scuderia Ferrari Marlboro, find that:

1. Fernando Alonso was on his out-lap and, having been caught by Felipa Massa, did impede him;

2. To impede another driver during the qualifying practice session is an offence. (Article 116b of the 2006 Formula One Sporting Regulations);

3. Such actions may not have been deliberate.

The stewards determine that a breach of the regulations has occurred during qualifying practice and by virtue of the provisions of the 2006 Formula One Sporting Regulations Article 112 order that the best three laps set by Fernando Alonso in the third period of qualifying be deleted.

Signed by Tony Scott Andrews, Enzo Spano and Alessandro Tibiletti

boban-mk · Post 09 Sep 2006, 22:39

manchild wrote:If he wasn't on his fast lap why did he made his best sector times on that lap?

Whe obvously don't want to see things clearly. I see that you are a fan of Alonso, but i'm not fan of either Alonso, or MS, Massa. So again i'm asking. Did Alonso interfere Massa's quick lap? Also please all stop trying to explain what is 100m in F1, or it was 300m.

Go Kimi

wazojugs · Post 09 Sep 2006, 22:43

boban-mk wrote:
manchild wrote:If he wasn't on his fast lap why did he made his best sector times on that lap?
Whe obvously don't want to see things clearly. I see that you are a fan of Alonso, but i'm not fan of either Alonso, or MS, Massa. So again i'm asking. Did Alonso interfere Massa's quick lap? Also please all stop trying to explain what is 100m in F1, or it was 300m.

Go Kimi

Alonso didn't interfere at all with massa. massa was never closer than 10 car lengths, alonso didn't slow down on apex's or change lines

pRo · Post 09 Sep 2006, 23:00

If Alonso interfered with Massa with that gap, then every other driver is interfering in every qualification. Without being punished, I might add.

We mortals can't say whether Alonso affected Massa or not. But we can say the gap was huge compared to other cases, where drivers weren't punished in any way.

Where's the logic in that? Oh I know. It's the red car rule.

boban-mk · Post 09 Sep 2006, 23:13

pRo wrote:If Alonso interfered with Massa with that gap, then every other driver is interfering in every qualification.

I will go in Monday to doctor to check my eyes. Probably i didn't see well. I thougth i see that Alonso was realy close to Masa at Ascari so he even had to brake a little. Or maybe i watch FIA official TV signal, and not some other. If i watched Premiere probably i will see Schumi 90% of time. If i watch some Spain TV i will watch Alonso 90% of time. I had a problem that I watched TV signal that at exact moment was with Massa on board. Or maybe not.

Why there is not a crying emotions to put one.