2021 Mclaren F1 Team

[diffuser]

I'd have thought that the car enthusiast market would still be strong - there's just something satisfying about driving a car fast and being in control.

Not sure how far off this is but at some point cars will move to a hive mind technology. Where the vehicles willl use open software to communicate with each other and move as one. They'll move much fsster and everyone will know who's slotting in where. They'll move like smart traincars. When we get there, driving yourself will have to be on a circuit.

That's a long way off. How would you build the infrastructure? How would you cope with old cars that are not self-driving? Not everyone can afford a new car. What about those of us who do not trust technology enough to go self-driving? (Hell, my top of the range Audi e tron can't even recognize the correct speed limit on a sign post!!) How do you account for emergency vehicles, foreign vehicles, etc etc etc. I think it will be decade's at least before we see self driving cars become anything other than a rarity, or at best reserved for use on motorways where you'd just tell it what junction you need to get off at.

Why does a self driving car need a Street sigh? That's for humans. You'd put the speed in a database along with the street name or GPS coordinates. Foreign Vehicles ? All cars will eventually have this. You're still thinking shorty term but yeah it's more than 10 years out but it's coming.

Here hoping that I get a self driving car BEFORE they take my driver's license away cause I'm too old to drive.

[McG]

This is just pure speculation, in my opinion. They’re just making assumptions based on McLaren’s current financial situation. But there have been stronger links between VAG and Red Bull.

Exactly, plenty of uncertainty and journo's love to live in that space, plenty of room to do what they want. Nobody apart from those in the group, really know where the team are with the financials. But given that they have closed over half a billion in deals for incoming cash injections, I'm not sure there is too much real financial uncertainty right now.

Obviously, they still need to sell a ton of cars but who knows where they are at with that.

People are piping in on the Sale of McLaren thing. Some for some against.... What would selling McLaren look like ? What does it mean to people ?

McLaren is owned by the "The McLaren Group"

The McLaren Group's current shareholding is:
Mumtalakat Holding Company 56.4%,
TAG Group Limited 14.32%,
Nidala (BVI) Limited (Michael Latifi) 9.84%,
Favorita Limited 5.78%,
Perlman Investments Limited 5.77%,
McKal Holdings Ltd 5.24%,
Acanitt Limited 2.65%.


Pretty sure McLaren wouldn't have anything to do with the sale of the McLaren group. If VW walked over to Mumtalakat Holding and offered them $1.2 Billion for 56.4%, and Mumtalakat accepted. It would be a done deal. Nothing would even change come Monday morning. I doubt they would even change the PU deal unless They decided to build one themselves but that wouldn't be till 2026 at the earliest. Zak would stay on, cause right now he's doing a good job. So I guess I don't understand why anyone cares?

That's what I said. It won't matter where the funding is coming from be it VAG or Saudi money. But I get the feeling that some changes might filter down even in the short term if VAG completely took over funding. Old egotistical rich man syndrome would dictate that VAG spending that much on something means someone somewhere at the top would want to leave their mark.

Anyhoo... This has opened up a hypothetical can of worms from some random website. Best to put it to bed and see what the future brings.

[Manoah2u]

It's just investments. Mclaren obviously is doing good, and with VAG shifting far more to fully electric, and Mclaren likely to stay at least hybrid with supercars, then there is ever so much more the demand for gasoline powered cars by people with money to burn before the world -supposedly- is fully switching to electric. So if some VAG exec with money to burn - or hell, VAG themselves - read it as a smart investment, then they can buy in now relatively 'cheap', see Mclaren improve in both F1 and in the street, make money out of it (that will be hundreds of millions over a 5 to 10 year span), then sell the stake again for even bigger profit, and essentially they made 'money for nothing'.

I would argue this is the moment to invest in companies like Aston Martin, Mclaren, Alpine, etc. as they're guaranteed to gain interest and revenue. Porsche and Ferrari are different stories, Lamborghini aswell. There is not so much growth to be obtained there relatively to AM, Mcl and ALP.

And even then, it's not a bad idea for VAG to 'partner up' Mclaren. RedBull has a good history with VW, but Mclaren is a far more historic name and RBR have been mentioning more than once they might stop if circumstances don't favor them. Likewise, i don't think either Horner or Newey are endlessly going to stay in F1, and for that matter, Marko neither. Offcourse this opens the possibility for VAG to buy the RBR team and do a Brawn, but at the same time, if you lose all the 'capacity' then you start essentially from scratch.

It's also a big question what Mercedes will do in F1, and what their relationship with Mclaren will uphold. For now it's benefitting Mclaren, but given Aston Martin's 'investment' to win and become WDC/WCC, and the Mercedes ties between Aston likely are stronger, i would be expecting Mclaren to concider another engine manufacturer that grants them the WCC/WDC.VAG is a great potential there, and if there already is invested in them, that's going to be an interesting and easy entry.

as others have mentioned, it's likely to mean not much at all but simply somebody deciding it's a worthy investment, and nothing more.

it MIGHT also result in more, but quite frankly, for the short future, it doesn't mean anything, and it's really fine both ways.

[McG]

https://youtu.be/2ywyyScPB1E

Loved the one at United Autosports. This one will be awesome.

Edit: 25:00 into the video Can't believe I ever doubted this guy.

[adrianjordan]

Not sure how far off this is but at some point cars will move to a hive mind technology. Where the vehicles willl use open software to communicate with each other and move as one. They'll move much fsster and everyone will know who's slotting in where. They'll move like smart traincars. When we get there, driving yourself will have to be on a circuit.

That's a long way off. How would you build the infrastructure? How would you cope with old cars that are not self-driving? Not everyone can afford a new car. What about those of us who do not trust technology enough to go self-driving? (Hell, my top of the range Audi e tron can't even recognize the correct speed limit on a sign post!!) How do you account for emergency vehicles, foreign vehicles, etc etc etc. I think it will be decade's at least before we see self driving cars become anything other than a rarity, or at best reserved for use on motorways where you'd just tell it what junction you need to get off at.

Why does a self driving car need a Street sigh? That's for humans. You'd put the speed in a database along with the street name or GPS coordinates. Foreign Vehicles ? All cars will eventually have this. You're still thinking shorty term but yeah it's more than 10 years out but it's coming.

Here hoping that I get a self driving car BEFORE they take my driver's license away cause I'm too old to drive.

I wasn't saying that it did, but using the inability of my car to manage such a simple task as an example. Using a GPS database wouldn't work, because what if GPS went down, or there were temporary roadworks etc, data signal blacks pot in the middle of nowhere etc. These systems will have to have fail safe on top of redundancy on top of fail safe built in. It also raises the question of whether you'll have to have a driving licence to use one (assuming the final fail safe would be the human taking control).

It's a fascinating and yet also terrifying future that I hope I never live to see.

[mclaren111]

That's a long way off. How would you build the infrastructure? How would you cope with old cars that are not self-driving? Not everyone can afford a new car. What about those of us who do not trust technology enough to go self-driving? (Hell, my top of the range Audi e tron can't even recognize the correct speed limit on a sign post!!) How do you account for emergency vehicles, foreign vehicles, etc etc etc. I think it will be decade's at least before we see self driving cars become anything other than a rarity, or at best reserved for use on motorways where you'd just tell it what junction you need to get off at.

Why does a self driving car need a Street sigh? That's for humans. You'd put the speed in a database along with the street name or GPS coordinates. Foreign Vehicles ? All cars will eventually have this. You're still thinking shorty term but yeah it's more than 10 years out but it's coming.

Here hoping that I get a self driving car BEFORE they take my driver's license away cause I'm too old to drive.

I wasn't saying that it did, but using the inability of my car to manage such a simple task as an example. Using a GPS database wouldn't work, because what if GPS went down, or there were temporary roadworks etc, data signal blacks pot in the middle of nowhere etc. These systems will have to have fail safe on top of redundancy on top of fail safe built in. It also raises the question of whether you'll have to have a driving licence to use one (assuming the final fail safe would be the human taking control).

It's a fascinating and yet also terrifying future that I hope I never live to see.

Same here... Thank goodness I'll be gone before all of this nonsense materialize...

Sadly Greed will prevail over common sense and most people will be forced into things they don't want nor need...

[mclaren111]

Racefans:

Former Mercedes F1 CEO Nick Fry has joined technology company McLaren Applied. Until August, when it was sold to Greybull Capital, the company was part of the McLaren Group along with the F1 team. RaceFans understands McLaren Applied is planning a change of name.

Anyone know if they will stay at MTC ?

[Ground Effect]

This would be pretty cool! Must have been a special day for the young boy

[FittingMechanics]

Given Seidl history, I see Porsche wanting to be a works team with McLaren (like Mercedes was).

Zak mentions the new Wind Tunnel and Simulator in this video

It doesn't make sense for Porsche to partner up with McLaren. Both are in the supercar market and having McLaren Porsche on the grid would be really strange marketing.

McLaren Mercedes, Honda, Renault work because majority of cars those brands sell are not supercars, but McLaren Ferrari would suffer from the same issue.

McLaren Audi or something might work but it's a strange match.

Even though I might get dinged for bring this up in this forum, I'm gonna bring it up anyways. I think that Norris not getting penalized for crossing the white line on pit entry (Russia with Love) is one of the problems with F1 rules. Something like that should not be open for interpretation. They've opened the door to, in the event that if Norris would have hit someone that was on the other side of the white line then the ruling would have been completely different. I mean, we all know Norris didn't cross the white line on purpose, he did it cause he was having a crazy time trying to control his car. It doesn't change the fact that he crossed the white line. It's no different to track limits (when they are enforced) here they chose not to enforce a track limit that isn't optional.

If the rule is you can't cross the line, then boom give out the penalty. Everyone can see he crossed the line.

Solution:
1 - write the rules to not require interpretation.
2 - Fore warn the Stewarts and ding them when they do.

I agree. I do understand the point that it might be unsafe to proceed without going back to the pits but next time someone could crash into a car that slides over.

I feel the same way with normal track limits. White line should be the track limit and it should be enforced.

[_cerber1]

It doesn't make sense for Porsche to partner up with McLaren. Both are in the supercar market and having McLaren Porsche on the grid would be really strange marketing.

This is a big misconception, Porsche sells more of its cars per week than McLaren in a whole year. And the various limited edition supercars in both companies will be sold out long before the first car in the series hits the tarmac. So, I don't see a conflict of interest here.

[mwillems]

It doesn't make sense for Porsche to partner up with McLaren. Both are in the supercar market and having McLaren Porsche on the grid would be really strange marketing.

This is a big misconception, Porsche sells more of its cars per week than McLaren in a whole year. And the various limited edition supercars in both companies will be sold out long before the first car in the series hits the tarmac. So, I don't see a conflict of interest here.

I think the real hurdles are the forthcoming engine regulations and also the fact that Red Bull would be a good match too. Their ability to consistently create a good car is unquestioned and if VAG feel they can get the engine to power them then it's a match too.

I think the "smoke" we can see is probably that VAG will likely be in talks with a few teams, and the FIA, exploring the possibility of partnerships and what they might look like. At this point I don't think too much should be read into it as the requirements are still being shaped, including VAG's own expectations of what they want to get out of a possible entry into F1. Maybe they will buy Sauber/Alfa Romeo and go all in, maybe they will deliver an engine and look for commercial tie ups with RB or Mclaren, or as is entirely possible, they may look at the idea of buying Mclaren.

They are a business and so they will explore all possibilities, even if they think it looks like not the best match at the outset, because they will do a complete process of due diligence.

Naturally us Mclaren fans get excited about the prospect of being a "Works team" as it seems to confer a special status. But to be honest, I like the Mercedes engine, I don't think that tie up will stop us from having a dominant car and I don't feel the kudos associated with works team status is entirely deserved any more. Not that it is without any merit, I just don't think it is quite as big a deal as it was.

[adrianjordan]

...

It doesn't make sense for Porsche to partner up with McLaren. Both are in the supercar market and having McLaren Porsche on the grid would be really strange marketing.

...

I'd agree except for one thing, VAG own 2 competing brands already in the form of Porsche and Lamborghini (did I spell that right? Looks right to me), so why not also tie up with McLaren in some way.

I'm not likely to ever be in the market for one, Euromillions win would be the only chance I'd have, but I always imagine that someone in the market for a luxury sports car isn't going to be shopping around looking at the differences between them.

I feel like those customers know what they want, they know whether they want a Porsche 911, an Aston DB11, a McLaren GT etc, etc before they ever actually get near one.

I feel like these brands don't compete in the same way that the likes of Merc, BMW and Audi compete with each other.

The competition is more around the ethos and image of the brand than anything else, so a parent company has far less risk by owning more than one of them.

[_cerber1]

How a change of mindset helped McLaren design an F1 winner
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/how- ... r/6686895/

[Macklaren]

Umm no. Any journalist in F1 is pretty much a random guy. Ask Zak Brown where he thinks McLaren will be in 2016 and beyond and even he probably doesn't even know. I don't know what makes anyone think journalists are special. They are reporters, a mouthpiece for whatever field they are in who just reiterate what they are told. They are even less special nowadays because we have so much direct easily accessible information available to us.

Not sure I agree with this. You're right that journalists reiterate what they are told...but that is exactly what they are supposed to do and some sources are more reliable than others. I know the media gets a pretty bad rap these days (a lot of which may be justified) but let's not write off all journalists

[Darth-Piekus]

Porsche and Mclaren have teamed up in the past again with the MP4-2 Tag Porsche Mclaren.