2022 Oracle | Red Bull Racing F1 Team

[Sieper]

I expect so from this wording. And likely in the test livery too?

[Wouter]

https://f1-insider.com/formel-1-red-bul ... 022-41108/

Red Bull doesn't show everything at the presentation [RB18]

Motorsport boss Helmut Marko (78) makes it clear: "The presentation, which is important for fans and sponsors, does not show any special details on the car," says the Grazer to F1 insiders.
Marko continues: “The new car will only be ready shortly before the start of testing in Barcelona on February 23rd. From then on it will be further developed and will receive another update for the first race of the season on March 20th in Bahrain.” [...]

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Does that suggest that they might just do what is, in effect, a livery reveal?
Maybe the car they officially present will be just the FIA show car.

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Most teams will do only a livery reveal. In Bahrein we will see the real cars.

[Wouter]

I expect so from this wording. And likely in the test livery too?

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They only will have a test livery when they show the real car, but they don't as Marko says.
This will be the new livery especialy for the sponsors and fans.

[Sieper]

Yeah, that makes sense. Just show the general “new” (tweaked) livery on the likely mock up, or even digital only cat and then perhaps camo in the first test week.

[Curbstone]

I doubt any team will only do just a livery reveal, as in the FIA concept with their own livery on it.
Most teams will present their concept design / basic interpretation of the new rules. But of course specific details will remain hidden or not even bolted on the car, (probably not even finalized in production).
I also reckon showing only the FIA concept with this year's livery is not a great move for marketing, as it gives the impression you haven't designed anything yet or are way behind schedule.

[Sieper]

Haas indeed have done what you said.

[Tizz]

https://f1-insider.com/formel-1-red-bul ... 022-41108/

Red Bull doesn't show everything at the presentation [RB18]

Motorsport boss Helmut Marko (78) makes it clear: "The presentation, which is important for fans and sponsors, does not show any special details on the car," says the Grazer to F1 insiders.
Marko continues: “The new car will only be ready shortly before the start of testing in Barcelona on February 23rd. From then on it will be further developed and will receive another update for the first race of the season on March 20th in Bahrain.”

This has been the case every year as long as I have watched F1. For all the teams.

[Ryar]

Does anyone else share the same thought that, Red Bull should plan the season to use 5 sets of PU components, instead of 3 and have strategic plan to incur penalties at the right venues. As the last season showed, there will invariably be some things that would force the hand to move in that direction. Although, RB used 4 sets, Mercedes, despite using 5 sets still were there right in it. Planning this would allow them to run the PU harder from early on. It would allow the drivers to race harder and push the competitors too.

[Wouter]

Finally. It's been reported that Honda/RBR have recovered performance from the E10 fuel.

For the second part of the plan, the help of Honda was enlisted. Newey wanted an even narrower rear end and for that he asked the Japanese for an even more compact package than what was driven with last season. According to La Gazzetto dello Sport, Honda succeeded and moreover they have found a solution together with fuel supplier ExxonMobil to recover the horsepower lost with the introduction of the E10 fuel.

Clarification for those that may have thought their oil partner was a product and brand of motor oil off the shelf

You are posting this information as being facts. This message/information comes from La Gazetta dello Sport.
As if RBR is already going to give all their information to that sports newspaper/site.
Let's wait and see what RBR/Newey/Honda/ExxonMobil themself will say about it.

[Big Tea]

Does anyone else share the same thought that, Red Bull should plan the season to use 5 sets of PU components, instead of 3 and have strategic plan to incur penalties at the right venues. As the last season showed, there will invariably be some things that would force the hand to move in that direction. Although, RB used 4 sets, Mercedes, despite using 5 sets still were there right in it. Planning this would allow them to run the PU harder from early on. It would allow the drivers to race harder and push the competitors too.

They have to prepare for the engine freeze, so it would be a balancing act of preparation and results.
I suppose a lot depends on where they find themselves in the pecking order early season

[AeroDynamic]

Finally. It's been reported that Honda/RBR have recovered performance from the E10 fuel.

For the second part of the plan, the help of Honda was enlisted. Newey wanted an even narrower rear end and for that he asked the Japanese for an even more compact package than what was driven with last season. According to La Gazzetto dello Sport, Honda succeeded and moreover they have found a solution together with fuel supplier ExxonMobil to recover the horsepower lost with the introduction of the E10 fuel.

Clarification for those that may have thought their oil partner was a product and brand of motor oil off the shelf

You are posting this information as being facts. This message/information comes from La Gazetta dello Sport.
As if RBR is already going to give all their information to that sports newspaper/site.
Let's wait and see what RBR/Newey/Honda/ExxonMobil themself will say about it.

I struggle to see where in my post, someone would take the interpretation that I qualified the quotes as facts. It's quite clearly a media report that infers an inside source and not a direct announcement from anyone with authority on the matter.

Wouter, I'm a little perplexed now. Has your position changed? because I recall you had said before that the truth was contrary to the report quoting Helmut Marko saying Honda had not recovered the lost bhp from the new spec of E10 fuel (Which you called into question). You are doubting this report that the difference has been reportedly recovered as well?

[AeroDynamic]

Does anyone else share the same thought that, Red Bull should plan the season to use 5 sets of PU components, instead of 3 and have strategic plan to incur penalties at the right venues. As the last season showed, there will invariably be some things that would force the hand to move in that direction. Although, RB used 4 sets, Mercedes, despite using 5 sets still were there right in it. Planning this would allow them to run the PU harder from early on. It would allow the drivers to race harder and push the competitors too.

If they can then absolutely. But I don't believe the Honda ever reached the same level of efficiency-power dynamic as the Mercedes engine does, hence their disparity in qualifying modes in previous years that Mercedes could tap into last season because that ceiling of performance was there. I think last season the Honda was at its peak power capacity – or at least, peak power capacity without falling off a cliff with reliability. The Mercedes seemingly can go harder and faster without losing reliability but rather shortening its life-span.

If however, Honda come this season with an engine with that kind of parity of efficiency/power/reliability, then I expect this won't even be a consideration, it will be the thing they should and will do. The question will be reliability, as this was a hiccup in the old designs when running under the regs that allowed qualifying modes.

[Wouter]

Finally. It's been reported that Honda/RBR have recovered performance from the E10 fuel.

Quote: For the second part of the plan, the help of Honda was enlisted. Newey wanted an even narrower rear end and for that he asked the Japanese for an even more compact package than what was driven with last season. According to La Gazzetto dello Sport, Honda succeeded and moreover they have found a solution together with fuel supplier ExxonMobil to recover the horsepower lost with the introduction of the E10 fuel.

Clarification for those that may have thought their oil partner was a product and brand of motor oil off the shelf

.
You are posting this information as being facts. This message/information comes from La Gazetta dello Sport.
As if RBR is already going to give all their information to that sports newspaper/site.
Let's wait and see what RBR/Newey/Honda/ExxonMobil themself will say about it.

.
I struggle to see where in my post, someone would take the interpretation that I qualified the quotes as facts. It's quite clearly a media report that infers an inside source and not a direct announcement from anyone with authority on the matter.

Wouter, I'm a little perplexed now. Has your position changed? because I recall you had said before that the truth was contrary to the report quoting Helmut Marko saying Honda had not recovered the lost bhp from the new spec of E10 fuel. You are doubting this report that the difference has been in fact recovered?

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You must have read my message to you this morning about ExxonMobil, which I subsequently deleted. That's the reason I'm not going to argue with you anymore and I'm going to put you under the ignore button from now on.

[Jolle]

Does anyone else share the same thought that, Red Bull should plan the season to use 5 sets of PU components, instead of 3 and have strategic plan to incur penalties at the right venues. As the last season showed, there will invariably be some things that would force the hand to move in that direction. Although, RB used 4 sets, Mercedes, despite using 5 sets still were there right in it. Planning this would allow them to run the PU harder from early on. It would allow the drivers to race harder and push the competitors too.

If they can then absolutely. But I don't believe the Honda ever reached the same level of efficiency-power dynamic as the Mercedes engine does, hence their disparity in qualifying modes in previous years that Mercedes could tap into last season because that ceiling of performance was there. I think last season the Honda was at its peak power capacity – or at least, peak power capacity without falling off a cliff with reliability. The Mercedes seemingly can go harder and faster without losing reliability but rather shortening its life-span.

If however, Honda come this season with an engine with that kind of parity of efficiency/power/reliability, then I expect this won't even be a consideration, it will be the thing they should and will do. The question will be reliability, as this was a hiccup in the old designs when running under the regs that allowed qualifying modes.

It all depends how much the field is or isn’t bunched up. Last year, with the huge gap beween the front runners and the rest, worse case would be place four after penalties, which makes it relatively painless. If there are three teams up front, it’s place six, four teams, place eight, etc etc.

[mclaren111]

Does anyone else share the same thought that, Red Bull should plan the season to use 5 sets of PU components, instead of 3 and have strategic plan to incur penalties at the right venues. As the last season showed, there will invariably be some things that would force the hand to move in that direction. Although, RB used 4 sets, Mercedes, despite using 5 sets still were there right in it. Planning this would allow them to run the PU harder from early on. It would allow the drivers to race harder and push the competitors too.

If they can then absolutely. But I don't believe the Honda ever reached the same level of efficiency-power dynamic as the Mercedes engine does, hence their disparity in qualifying modes in previous years that Mercedes could tap into last season because that ceiling of performance was there. I think last season the Honda was at its peak power capacity – or at least, peak power capacity without falling off a cliff with reliability. The Mercedes seemingly can go harder and faster without losing reliability but rather shortening its life-span.

If however, Honda come this season with an engine with that kind of parity of efficiency/power/reliability, then I expect this won't even be a consideration, it will be the thing they should and will do. The question will be reliability, as this was a hiccup in the old designs when running under the regs that allowed qualifying modes.

Sounds like a Contradiction in Terms to me... The essence of reliability is for the PU's to do the required mileage...

Thus, 3 PU's for the season... If they can't they're not reliable...