Ferrari F1-75

[Emag]

According to Motorsport Italy (from Maranello sources) Ferrari believes that their unique sidepod design makes 7% more downforce at the back of the car, than a more conventional tighter sidepod design. It will be up to the track to confirm these data.

Like the Aston Martin, Ferrari tries to dissipate the warm but already processed air generated during the cooling of the power unit. Judging by the design of the gills, they don't necessarily try to direct it to the top of the diffuser, but to the rear wing and above the diffuser. The latter theory is also indicated by the fact that the opening of the swingarms of the rear suspension was cleverly shaped by Ferrari as a miniature spoiler.

This is certainly the distinguishing mark of a project that was deliberated after a long and careful study: the project coordinator, Enrico Cardile, and the aerodynamic leader, David Sanchez, had the opportunity to work with plenty of time on the ground-effect single-seater project, discriminating the different solutions to converge on the double bottom concept with the variants created in Maranello.

+%7 DF is great number. But what is going to cost at the straights? I mean we know that engine is not weak as back in 2020 but… being sitting duck at straights was painful enough after 2019.

The 7% reference is misleading. That's +7% over a conventional tight sidepod design which Ferrari have tested. We don't know if that +7% stands even for the design that Mercedes has come up with. In that regard it could be the same, just a bit better, or even just a bit worse.

So I wouldn't read too much on that number.

[cokata]

According to Motorsport Italy (from Maranello sources) Ferrari believes that their unique sidepod design makes 7% more downforce at the back of the car, than a more conventional tighter sidepod design. It will be up to the track to confirm these data.

Like the Aston Martin, Ferrari tries to dissipate the warm but already processed air generated during the cooling of the power unit. Judging by the design of the gills, they don't necessarily try to direct it to the top of the diffuser, but to the rear wing and above the diffuser. The latter theory is also indicated by the fact that the opening of the swingarms of the rear suspension was cleverly shaped by Ferrari as a miniature spoiler.

This is certainly the distinguishing mark of a project that was deliberated after a long and careful study: the project coordinator, Enrico Cardile, and the aerodynamic leader, David Sanchez, had the opportunity to work with plenty of time on the ground-effect single-seater project, discriminating the different solutions to converge on the double bottom concept with the variants created in Maranello.

+%7 DF is great number. But what is going to cost at the straights? I mean we know that engine is not weak as back in 2020 but… being sitting duck at straights was painful enough after 2019.

Why do you assume that is draggier? Most other cars have much bigger airboxes which increase drag over what Ferrari are doing.

[Henri]

This thread will blow up when we get lap times in Barcelona

[JPBD1990]

Genuinely can’t wait for lap times.

Also I want to point out that I’m not trying to be negative, so I want to stress that I don’t need the ‘Ferrari are very competent and have tested every concept’ speech. I know that. We all know that. The purpose of my speculating is to try and understand the Ferrari better, yes, and understand it relative to the competition. The ‘relative to the competition’ part is the most important thing in competition, right?

To that end the Kyle.engineers video on the Mercedes’ suggests the front and rear wings are among the most cranked of the cars we’ve seen, suggesting they are trying to generate a lot of downforce from those regions. Could that be because they’re not generating as much as say, the Ferrari with quite backed off wings, elsewhere on the car?

Interesting

[pantherxxx]

According to Motorsport Italy (from Maranello sources) Ferrari believes that their unique sidepod design makes 7% more downforce at the back of the car, than a more conventional tighter sidepod design. It will be up to the track to confirm these data.

Like the Aston Martin, Ferrari tries to dissipate the warm but already processed air generated during the cooling of the power unit. Judging by the design of the gills, they don't necessarily try to direct it to the top of the diffuser, but to the rear wing and above the diffuser. The latter theory is also indicated by the fact that the opening of the swingarms of the rear suspension was cleverly shaped by Ferrari as a miniature spoiler.

This is certainly the distinguishing mark of a project that was deliberated after a long and careful study: the project coordinator, Enrico Cardile, and the aerodynamic leader, David Sanchez, had the opportunity to work with plenty of time on the ground-effect single-seater project, discriminating the different solutions to converge on the double bottom concept with the variants created in Maranello.

+%7 DF is great number. But what is going to cost at the straights? I mean we know that engine is not weak as back in 2020 but… being sitting duck at straights was painful enough after 2019.

The english translation said "downforce" but I looked at the Italian article and it says "efficiency" so maybe the 7% is supposed to be with the same drag? I took these numbers with a grain of salt anyways, but we will find out soon in March.

[LM10]

Genuinely can’t wait for lap times.

Also I want to point out that I’m not trying to be negative, so I want to stress that I don’t need the ‘Ferrari are very competent and have tested every concept’ speech. I know that. We all know that. The purpose of my speculating is to try and understand the Ferrari better, yes, and understand it relative to the competition. The ‘relative to the competition’ part is the most important thing in competition, right?

To that end the Kyle.engineers video on the Mercedes’ suggests the front and rear wings are among the most cranked of the cars we’ve seen, suggesting they are trying to generate a lot of downforce from those regions. Could that be because they’re not generating as much as say, the Ferrari with quite backed off wings, elsewhere on the car?

Interesting

That could very well be. Maybe tightest possible sidepod design isn’t the best possible concept for the new regs anymore.

[One and Only]

According to Motorsport Italy (from Maranello sources) Ferrari believes that their unique sidepod design makes 7% more downforce at the back of the car, than a more conventional tighter sidepod design. It will be up to the track to confirm these data.

Like the Aston Martin, Ferrari tries to dissipate the warm but already processed air generated during the cooling of the power unit. Judging by the design of the gills, they don't necessarily try to direct it to the top of the diffuser, but to the rear wing and above the diffuser. The latter theory is also indicated by the fact that the opening of the swingarms of the rear suspension was cleverly shaped by Ferrari as a miniature spoiler.

This is certainly the distinguishing mark of a project that was deliberated after a long and careful study: the project coordinator, Enrico Cardile, and the aerodynamic leader, David Sanchez, had the opportunity to work with plenty of time on the ground-effect single-seater project, discriminating the different solutions to converge on the double bottom concept with the variants created in Maranello.

+%7 DF is great number. But what is going to cost at the straights? I mean we know that engine is not weak as back in 2020 but… being sitting duck at straights was painful enough after 2019.

The 7% reference is misleading. That's +7% over a conventional tight sidepod design which Ferrari have tested. We don't know if that +7% stands even for the design that Mercedes has come up with. In that regard it could be the same, just a bit better, or even just a bit worse.

So I wouldn't read too much on that number.

It still confirms Ferrari chose correct concept. Given that rumor is correct which I doubt.

[pantherxxx]

Just found this on reddit from an aerodynamicist.

"Thinking about this more, I’m thinking this might be acting like a”top side diffuser “. In the old ground effect cars you’d use a skirt to seal the bottom to the track and then have a tallish entry to the diffuser at the front, neck down in the middle to speed the air up and reduce pressure to make the downforce, and then open it back up taller to get the air out.

This design might be the inverse. The curved high sides prevent leakage to free stream and tire wake interference. Think of the bird bath area as the anti-necking down off the old tunnel cars, thus having high pressure and producing downforce.

Previous gen cars needed the rear wing to produce the majority of the force so the last thing you wanted to do was have big side pods in the way to take energy out of the flow. Now the wing might be less important. Now the mid plane wing might be more of way to condition both “top” and bottom diffuser exits, thus accelerating the flow out of both.

CFD would be incredibly interesting"

[marcel171281]

+%7 DF is great number. But what is going to cost at the straights? I mean we know that engine is not weak as back in 2020 but… being sitting duck at straights was painful enough after 2019.

The 7% reference is misleading. That's +7% over a conventional tight sidepod design which Ferrari have tested. We don't know if that +7% stands even for the design that Mercedes has come up with. In that regard it could be the same, just a bit better, or even just a bit worse.

So I wouldn't read too much on that number.

It still confirms Ferrari chose correct concept. Given that rumor is correct which I doubt.

But could very well also mean, it was the concept Ferrari got the best out of. In other words Ferrari couldn't get the concept of others working on their car.

As long as teams compare their own things with their other own things, it doesn't say anything where they are in relation to the others.

[Emag]

The 7% reference is misleading. That's +7% over a conventional tight sidepod design which Ferrari have tested. We don't know if that +7% stands even for the design that Mercedes has come up with. In that regard it could be the same, just a bit better, or even just a bit worse.

So I wouldn't read too much on that number.

It still confirms Ferrari chose correct concept. Given that rumor is correct which I doubt.

But could very well also mean, it was the concept Ferrari got the best out of. In other words Ferrari couldn't get the concept of others working on their car.

As long as teams compare their own things with their other own things, it doesn't say anything where they are in relation to the others.

This was my point. It's obvious that the concept Ferrari has gone for is the best they could come up with, otherwise they wouldn't have done it. But that tells us nothing on how it will perform in relation to other cars, which may have gotten more out of ideas perhaps Ferrari couldn't.

[ferkan]

Just found this on reddit from an aerodynamicist.

"Thinking about this more, I’m thinking this might be acting like a”top side diffuser “. In the old ground effect cars you’d use a skirt to seal the bottom to the track and then have a tallish entry to the diffuser at the front, neck down in the middle to speed the air up and reduce pressure to make the downforce, and then open it back up taller to get the air out.

This design might be the inverse. The curved high sides prevent leakage to free stream and tire wake interference. Think of the bird bath area as the anti-necking down off the old tunnel cars, thus having high pressure and producing downforce.

Previous gen cars needed the rear wing to produce the majority of the force so the last thing you wanted to do was have big side pods in the way to take energy out of the flow. Now the wing might be less important. Now the mid plane wing might be more of way to condition both “top” and bottom diffuser exits, thus accelerating the flow out of both.

CFD would be incredibly interesting"

Can you post a link of the post?

[pantherxxx]

Just found this on reddit from an aerodynamicist.

"Thinking about this more, I’m thinking this might be acting like a”top side diffuser “. In the old ground effect cars you’d use a skirt to seal the bottom to the track and then have a tallish entry to the diffuser at the front, neck down in the middle to speed the air up and reduce pressure to make the downforce, and then open it back up taller to get the air out.

This design might be the inverse. The curved high sides prevent leakage to free stream and tire wake interference. Think of the bird bath area as the anti-necking down off the old tunnel cars, thus having high pressure and producing downforce.

Previous gen cars needed the rear wing to produce the majority of the force so the last thing you wanted to do was have big side pods in the way to take energy out of the flow. Now the wing might be less important. Now the mid plane wing might be more of way to condition both “top” and bottom diffuser exits, thus accelerating the flow out of both.

CFD would be incredibly interesting"

Can you post a link of the post?

https://www.reddit.com/r/F1Technical/co ... &context=3

[Sevach]

Genuinely can’t wait for lap times.

Also I want to point out that I’m not trying to be negative, so I want to stress that I don’t need the ‘Ferrari are very competent and have tested every concept’ speech. I know that. We all know that. The purpose of my speculating is to try and understand the Ferrari better, yes, and understand it relative to the competition. The ‘relative to the competition’ part is the most important thing in competition, right?

To that end the Kyle.engineers video on the Mercedes’ suggests the front and rear wings are among the most cranked of the cars we’ve seen, suggesting they are trying to generate a lot of downforce from those regions. Could that be because they’re not generating as much as say, the Ferrari with quite backed off wings, elsewhere on the car?

Interesting

That could very well be. Maybe tightest possible sidepod design isn’t the best possible concept for the new regs anymore.

Ferrari and others have made their pods bigger than they need to be for cooling purposes so at least a couple of teams believe that.

[Neuron]

Genuinely can’t wait for lap times.

So you need to wait to the last day of Bahrain's tests
Everything before would not be comparable, as always.

[One and Only]

Genuinely can’t wait for lap times.

Also I want to point out that I’m not trying to be negative, so I want to stress that I don’t need the ‘Ferrari are very competent and have tested every concept’ speech. I know that. We all know that. The purpose of my speculating is to try and understand the Ferrari better, yes, and understand it relative to the competition. The ‘relative to the competition’ part is the most important thing in competition, right?

To that end the Kyle.engineers video on the Mercedes’ suggests the front and rear wings are among the most cranked of the cars we’ve seen, suggesting they are trying to generate a lot of downforce from those regions. Could that be because they’re not generating as much as say, the Ferrari with quite backed off wings, elsewhere on the car?

Interesting

That could very well be. Maybe tightest possible sidepod design isn’t the best possible concept for the new regs anymore.

Ferrari and others have made their pods bigger than they need to be for cooling purposes so at least a couple of teams believe that.

Why did cooling requirements increase so much? PUs haven’t changed that much. That makes no sense.