Ferrari F1-75

[JPower]

Are you expecting ferrari to publically say that they screwed the pooch with a missed opportunity and that the merc concept is already superior to theirs??!

This line of questioning from whoever asked it was always going to produce the expected answer.

No one from Ferrari had to say anything at all. This wasn't a quote on the public record.

[Andi76]

Well what else are they going to say? "Yes we tried that but couldn't figure out how to make it quick so we went with a simpler solution"

Very hard to read anything from such a quote.

Untill now it seems that Ferrari has taken the right decision...as it seems that Mercedes does not know how to make it quick either...if you judge it how the car is behaving. Mercedes still is porpoising a lot. Also Ferraris concept surely is not "a simpler solution". Its a new concept...

But anyway - we will see next week whos decision was better, Mercedes or Ferrari.

[dialtone]

ah ah it's the same bullshitter who claimed that Ferrari would mount the front push rod ... how can you believe this bullshit

Duchessa is usually very reliable and actually has sources from within Ferrari. So I think you may be using a language that is a tad too strong there.

Are you expecting ferrari to publically say that they screwed the pooch with a missed opportunity and that the merc concept is already superior to theirs??!

This line of questioning from whoever asked it was always going to produce the expected answer.

I'm not expecting anything, I didn't say that what was quoted was promising or not. I just said that Duchessa usually is reliable, and yeah, Ferrari hasn't been over-hyping themselves lately, but I really don't think it makes an ounce of difference, the only thing that matters is that the car looks good handling on track and it seems like it does.

[SiLo]

Well what else are they going to say? "Yes we tried that but couldn't figure out how to make it quick so we went with a simpler solution"

Very hard to read anything from such a quote.

Untill now it seems that Ferrari has taken the right decision...as it seems that Mercedes does not know how to make it quick either...if you judge it how the car is behaving. Mercedes still is porpoising a lot. Also Ferraris concept surely is not "a simpler solution". Its a new concept...

But anyway - we will see next week whos decision was better, Mercedes or Ferrari.

It's difficult to know that because the Mercedes has changed quite a bit vs the Ferrari, which has some smaller updates on but is mostly the same car. I don't even think we will see next week, we will see at the end of the year more like.

Back on topic, is the Ferrari riding fairly high or do I need my eyes tested?

[Andi76]

No, i also noticed that Ferrari is riding fairly high a few times. I remember Michael Schmidt from German "Auto, Motor, Sport" saying that the Ferrari is running quite well over a large range of ridge heights. Maybe they are checking out how far they can go and validating their aero-maps.

[Timtim99]

Well what else are they going to say? "Yes we tried that but couldn't figure out how to make it quick so we went with a simpler solution"

Very hard to read anything from such a quote.

Untill now it seems that Ferrari has taken the right decision...as it seems that Mercedes does not know how to make it quick either...if you judge it how the car is behaving. Mercedes still is porpoising a lot. Also Ferraris concept surely is not "a simpler solution". Its a new concept...

But anyway - we will see next week whos decision was better, Mercedes or Ferrari.

It's difficult to know that because the Mercedes has changed quite a bit vs the Ferrari, which has some smaller updates on but is mostly the same car. I don't even think we will see next week, we will see at the end of the year more like.

Back on topic, is the Ferrari riding fairly high or do I need my eyes tested?

Ferrari got whatever move Mercedes or Redbull makes covered, hence they did not bring any upgrade, because they have turned up their engine or do low field run, if you all remember that 2 weeks ago Binotto stated that F1-75 have a lot of room under the side-pods, they can go very narrow if necessary. he said their car is designed modularly to make these changes without a big design overhaul.

[LM10]

Well what else are they going to say? "Yes we tried that but couldn't figure out how to make it quick so we went with a simpler solution"

Very hard to read anything from such a quote.

Care to elaborate why Ferrari’s solution is a simpler one? Thanks in advance.

[JPBD1990]

Clearly Ferrari running with a higher engine mode, but I’m quite sure the fuel load would still be high. If the fuel is roughly equivalent to merc, it’s encouraging that the corners are very similar, if not in Ferrari’s favour.

[Timtim99]

Clearly Ferrari running with a higher engine mode, but I’m quite sure the fuel load would still be high. If the fuel is roughly equivalent to merc, it’s encouraging that the corners are very similar, if not in Ferrari’s favour.

These are all assumptions, anyone benchmarking these cars with previous years is making a mistake, all these graphs or chart are just guessing, Let’s us all waiting 7 more days, then we can start talking about who got the fastest car.

[dialtone]

Clearly Ferrari running with a higher engine mode, but I’m quite sure the fuel load would still be high. If the fuel is roughly equivalent to merc, it’s encouraging that the corners are very similar, if not in Ferrari’s favour.

How is it clear to you? Off the top of my head I can think of at least 6 reasons why it could look like that:

* Merc is draggier than Ferrari
* Merc porpoising forces them to lift before reaching too high speed
* Merc is simply lifting earlier for their own reasons
* Ferrari is running higher engine modes
* Ferrari is lifting less but runs the same engine mode as before
* Ferrari isn't porpoising as much and doesn't need to lift as much at the end of the straight

I don't know how you have enough information to say that it's clearly higher engine mode, it seems to me Ferrari is also lifting in many of those straights, easy to see in the first 2 breaking areas, but you can generally see how rounded almost all their breaking points are. Lastly... P1 in Q3 2021 was 1:28.9 and today they were lapping in 1:34.5 doesn't strike me as anyone is pushing here.

[f1316]

Speed on the straight may also speak to drag - inc the wing settings being run but also inherent to the design - so there are more variables beyond engine setting and fuel load that could affect top speed.

If we believe that Ferrari’s solution is inherently low drag, this could be an indicator (it may also not be though and indeed be the engine settings - we’ll see). I did hear one video with scarbs talking about how the Williams solution - which to me looks very similar to the Mercedes’ - could have issues with drag. Again, we’ll see.

[Hoffman900]

Speed on the straight may also speak to drag - inc the wing settings being run but also inherent to the design - so there are more variables beyond engine setting and fuel load that could affect top speed.

If we believe that Ferrari’s solution is inherently low drag, this could be an indicator (it may also not be though and indeed be the engine settings - we’ll see). I did hear one video with scarbs talking about how the Williams solution - which to me looks very similar to the Mercedes’ - could have issues with drag. Again, we’ll see.

I believe RedBull had an even higher trap speed today than Ferrari, which conceptually is closer to the Mercedes than Ferrari. It’s still too early to say other than Ferrari and Mercedes are lifting, and RedBull will likely be as well.

[JPBD1990]

Woahhh people are defensive. Sorry I used the word ‘clearly’ I was just trying to illustrate a clear difference in the telemetry. You are all correct, I don’t know what accounts for that difference. I put it down to engine mode, but could be wrong.

I want to note though that my post was intended to be positive - looking at the corner telemetry as opposed to the speeds at the end of the straights, Sainz is either faster or equal to the merc in all but 1 corner.

So… no need to be defensive? I’m just trying to share interesting things and have a discussion.

[matteosc]

Clearly Ferrari running with a higher engine mode, but I’m quite sure the fuel load would still be high. If the fuel is roughly equivalent to merc, it’s encouraging that the corners are very similar, if not in Ferrari’s favour.

Interestingly enough, Ferrari achieved those speeds with lower rpm compared to Mercedes (article in Italian, I can translate if you need)

[SiLo]

Well what else are they going to say? "Yes we tried that but couldn't figure out how to make it quick so we went with a simpler solution"

Very hard to read anything from such a quote.

Care to elaborate why Ferrari’s solution is a simpler one? Thanks in advance.

I was making up a hypothetical response to highlight why these kind of quotes shouldn't hold much weight.