A place to discuss the characteristics of the cars in Formula One, both current as well as historical. Laptimes, driver worshipping and team chatter do not belong here.
The next generation of Formula 1 cars are set to be smaller, with active aerodynamics for lower drag, reduced fuel tanks, and car to car alerts to prevent crashes, when they are introduced in 2026.
After an F1 Commission meeting on Monday, the FIA stated its aims for wholesale rule changes which will come into effect in 2026, including reduced drag, reduced mass and the use of sustainable materials.
Speaking to Motor Sport, F1’s chief technical officer Pat Symonds expanded on what ideas he thought could possibly be pursued to achieve this, whilst stressing that this was not necessarily discussed in the F1 Commission meeting.
“It’s active aero – absolutely,” said Symonds when asked how the low drag targets – and therefore greater fuel efficiency – could be achieved. “You can’t just reduce drag to cut fuel consumption because the car won’t go round corners.
Kukułka zwyczajna, kukułka pospolita – nazwy ludowe: gżegżółka, zazula (Cuculus canorus) – gatunek średniego ptaka wędrownego z podrodziny kukułek (Cuculinae) w rodzinie kukułkowatych (Cuculidae). Jedyny w Europie Środkowej pasożyt lęgowy. Zamieszkuje strefę umiarkowaną.
Car alerts if its some sort of system like in road cars, a little red light in the mirror if a car is next to you is ok. Anything other than that its a no from me.
I'm definitely in favour of more compact cars, the current ones have the same footprint on the road as a large van!!
I'll believe it when I see it. Teams will get their hands on whatever proposal and it'll no longer in any way resemble what Symonds lists. There's already the "reduce car weight OR arrest the rise in weight" soooooo probably not lighter... just not any heavier than however fat they get by 2025.
#aerogandalf "There is one big friend. It is downforce. And once you have this it’s a big mate and it’s helping a lot." Robert Kubica
Car alerts if its some sort of system like in road cars, a little red light in the mirror if a car is next to you is ok. Anything other than that its a no from me.
Even that if technology for technology sake. I have a 'blind spot warning light' 'Reverse camera' 'Surround view cameras' and all it really needs is sensible mirrors. They put tiny shiny things you can not see anything in and you spend as much time looking at the 'infotainment' screen as you do driving. Driving seems to be what is done when nothing electronic needs fiddling.
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.
Car alerts if its some sort of system like in road cars, a little red light in the mirror if a car is next to you is ok. Anything other than that its a no from me.
Even that if technology for technology sake. I have a 'blind spot warning light' 'Reverse camera' 'Surround view cameras' and all it really needs is sensible mirrors. They put tiny shiny things you can not see anything in and you spend as much time looking at the 'infotainment' screen as you do driving. Driving seems to be what is done when nothing electronic needs fiddling.
A yellow-red LED on the corners of their visor would be a simple, subtle, and progressive indicator for close driving.
Let's get back to 2008 sized cars with 2022 tunnels plz.
Car alerts if its some sort of system like in road cars, a little red light in the mirror if a car is next to you is ok. Anything other than that its a no from me.
Even that if technology for technology sake. I have a 'blind spot warning light' 'Reverse camera' 'Surround view cameras' and all it really needs is sensible mirrors. They put tiny shiny things you can not see anything in and you spend as much time looking at the 'infotainment' screen as you do driving. Driving seems to be what is done when nothing electronic needs fiddling.
A yellow-red LED on the corners of their visor would be a simple, subtle, and progressive indicator for close driving.
Let's get back to 2008 sized cars with 2022 tunnels plz.
And 2008 sized mirrors
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.
Car alerts if its some sort of system like in road cars, a little red light in the mirror if a car is next to you is ok. Anything other than that its a no from me.
Agreed. My car has collision avoidance systems that cut in when the car thinks I'm going to crash, when in actual fact I'm just applying progressive driving techniques (for example when merging onto a roundabout).
I'd turn them off, but they switch back on every time I restart the car.
Favourite driver: Lando Norris
Favourite team: McLaren
Turned down the chance to meet Vettel at Silverstone in 2007. He was a test driver at the time and I didn't think it was worth queuing!! 🤦🏻♂️
Let's get back to 2008 sized cars with 2022 tunnels plz.
Why are people obsessed with narrow F1 cars? F1 cars are supposed to be wide, 2150mm wide to be precise.
Even since 2005, GP2 cars were 1900mm wide compared to F1 at 1800mm wide. So in the reduction proposed for 2026, I hope they only reduce the width down to the F2 width of 1900mm and not all the way down to 1800mm.
Shorter cars? We can all get onboard with that. No problem.
It sounds like they will also pursue active aero (continuously variable wing angles). Since aerodynamic efficiency will be such a priority perhaps (my thought is) they will also pursue partially enclosed wheels.
16" wheels with the same tyre profile as current would be an easy way to save weight. Perhaps with narrower tyres too, but hopefully they only reduce the front tyre width and not the rear, and the rears stay nice and fat.
(Yet again people seem obsessed with the '98 to '16 spec narrow rear tyres for some reason?! I am almost positive it is just due to "remembrance bump" psychology effects from following F1 as a child/teenager, and not because these narrow cars with narrow tyres were actually better than the wide cars with wide tyres from '92.)
Interview with Jason Sommerville:
Last edited by JordanMugen on 04 May 2022, 16:48, edited 3 times in total.
Let's get back to 2008 sized cars with 2022 tunnels plz.
Why are people obsessed with narrow cars? Grand Prix cars are supposed to be wide. Even since 2005, GP2 cars were 1900mm wide compared to F1 at 1800mm wide. So in the reduction proposed for 2026, I hope they only reduce the width down to the F2 width of 1900mm and not all the way down to 1800mm.
It's just better racing when cars can fit side-by-side. And thinner cars (mostly) keep a proper aspect ratio, so they are shorter as well. That leads to lighter cars, and even more "better" racing.
I don't see why the wide cars are preferred at all. 2008 car with 2021 tyres would look amazing.
I'm definitely in favour of more compact cars, the current ones have the same footprint on the road as a large van!!
I'll believe it when I see it. Teams will get their hands on whatever proposal and it'll no longer in any way resemble what Symonds lists. There's already the "reduce car weight OR arrest the rise in weight" soooooo probably not lighter... just not any heavier than however fat they get by 2025.
It's just better racing when cars can fit side-by-side. And thinner cars (mostly) keep a proper aspect ratio, so they are shorter as well. That leads to lighter cars, and even more "better" racing.
F1 raced for 20 years with 2150mm wide cars, from 1972 to 1992, and it was no problem at all.
There was plenty of overtaking, for example here at Zandvoort in the '83 Dutch GP, even though most circuits then were not as wide as modern circuits. I just don't believe that narrow 1800mm cars race better. I don't believe it in the slightest.
As for proper aspect ratio, IMO the classic winged Grand Prix car should be wide and short [like this Ferrari 640], not narrow and short...
A lighter car due to a narrow track is a fallacy. The weight gain from having slighter longer wishbones for a wider track is minimal. The extra width is mostly empty space after all.
With the wider track you of course get free roll stiffness and (perhaps more importantly?) you move the tyre wake further away from the bodywork perhaps making the aerodynamics less sensitive.
Last edited by JordanMugen on 04 May 2022, 17:10, edited 1 time in total.
It's just better racing when cars can fit side-by-side. And thinner cars (mostly) keep a proper aspect ratio, so they are shorter as well. That leads to lighter cars, and even more "better" racing.
F1 raced for 20 years with 2150mm wide cars, from 1972 to 1992, and it was no problem at all.
There was plenty of overtaking, for example here at Zandvoort in the '83 Dutch GP, even though most circuits then were not as wide as modern circuits. I just don't believe that narrow 1800mm cars race better. I don't believe it in the slightest.
As for proper aspect ratio, IMO the classic winged Grand Prix car should be wide and short [like this Ferrari 640], not narrow and short...
A lighter car due to a narrow track is a fallacy. The weight gain from having slighter longer wishbones for a wider track is minimal. The extra width is mostly empty space after all.
Exactly! Wasted space better utilized by the spectacle.
2008 cars, IMHO, are the best size of all time. We have lost the term "nimble" from F1 since 2017...
2008 cars, IMHO, are the best size of all time. We have lost the term "nimble" from F1 since 2017...
Hard disagree, '92 F1 cars are the icons.
I edited in the things you get for free with a wider track, the things which would have motivated the McLaren designers to make their car 2150mm wide in '72 in the first place and hence the FIA to set that as the maximum width:
Free roll stiffness
Side-mounted radiators (later: venturi floors, flat floor) less affected by the front tyre wake
Going to 1900mm wide like F2 would be a compromise, and would avoid returning to F1 cars that look squashed like '98 to '16.
So why exactly was the 2008 F1 car 10 centimetres narrower than a 2008 GP2 car?
I can tell you: the only reason is because the FIA said so... After all good racing is the priority of GP2, so why wouldn't GP2 go for a narrower car if it made for better racing?
The idea that making F1 cars 1.8m wide, or better still 1.6m wide or 1.2m wide would suddenly allow them to race five-wide like Formula Ford just doesn't seem to be supported by better racing in the narrow track (winged) era. Where the circuit allows, F1 cars can already go three or sometimes four cars wide despite being 2.0m in width, they even did that back when they were 2.15m wide.
Last edited by JordanMugen on 04 May 2022, 17:33, edited 4 times in total.
