2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

[PlatinumZealot]

Not a bad drive from both Merc drivers today. Taking advantage of the VSC and the SC at the right time to make their stops. Would have been nice to have seen a better strategy from Alonso and Perez not retiring, but such is racing.

They're due upgrade at Silverstone aint they?

May I ask why?

[chrisc90]

Not a bad drive from both Merc drivers today. Taking advantage of the VSC and the SC at the right time to make their stops. Would have been nice to have seen a better strategy from Alonso and Perez not retiring, but such is racing.

They're due upgrade at Silverstone aint they?

May I ask why?

Effectively 'gifted' (used loosely) them 1 position and I believe Perez would have been up there between the mercs if not ahead of them.

Not taking away the great drive both Merc drivers had however.

[Gillian]

At least two pages of deleted posts later…

THIS IS MERCEDES 2020 TEAM THREAD, KEEP IT ON TOPIC.

Need to delete a lot more if that's the topic

[lh13]

At least two pages of deleted posts later…

THIS IS MERCEDES 2020 TEAM THREAD, KEEP IT ON TOPIC.

Need to delete a lot more if that's the topic

We're still in Q8 of 2020, so that's alright.

[Gillian]

The car is better relatively to the others when the ride height is up for all. Just goes to show how poorly it operates at lower heights.
Lewis and George are doing a good job. No mistakes like the other teams. George is really showing his class and bravery.
He has been very bold. And I guess psychologically the world is his oyster now, coming from the back of the grid in a Williams.
Lewis seems to have the pace, but he just doesn't seem as sharp as he used in this car. Even from the onboard.. It's as if he cannot adapt to this new formula as well as the others. He has take more laps before he gets confidence, and that's the difference between him and George. George has about a tenth on average in qualifying. Either by set up or just confidence, or just speed. But I see where Lewis is biased towards the race all the time.
Tomorrow should be good now that Lewis is at the front. let's see what type of pace he has. Also George should be able to race his way up.
I do wonder though, where does the team go with this car. It's almost as if there are no more excuses or cards to play.

Quite something of a post, coming from someone who was a staunch opposer of George getting into Mercedes team. The extent to which you went to denounce George was that, you often cited Latifi as a better driver than George until a point where Latifi had scored some points ahead of George. Your argument was that George hasn't done anything worth deserving a shot at Mercedes. Good to see a change of heart. Judging talented drivers in a bad cars is always prone to mistakes and if such judgement is also biased from a point of view that, the rookie might upset the apple cart of one's favorite driver, then it's even more of a sham.

This unwanted, difficult phase is probably good for George to embed more deeper into the team, trying to find ways of turning things around and in the process become an even better driver. Finally when he gets a good equipment, he would be in far better shape to handle championship challenges.

What is your problem?
I am not biased as you are. I will observe racing and call it as it is. I do not need to defend LH reputation. The man is racing for 15 years and is still fast enough. Look on Danny Ric. At one point fans such as yourself were rating him as the fastest, the latest of late brakers, and better than LH. What has become of him?
I think a lot of new fans underestimate, how dificult it is to be on top of the sport for 15 years; even when faced with extremely good teammates.
It's a new formula, with new, heavy bouncy cars. This formula favours the racing sim generation. Goerge, Max, Charles Lando, will thrive with these bouncy cars that require stamina and youth to drive the best. The drivers cant even see the apex of the turns.
Right now George is beating Lewis. I'm not such a fanboy that I will deny that. A lot of it has to do with the formula change.
But from what I explained in the post, the true story is that Lewis has been setting up for the race, and has been faster in the races. George has been very luck this season, and his qualy bias, and possibly setup balance is paying off.
Finaly, I do not think Lewis is hooked into this car and he is yet to adapt to it.
His downfall is his experience. He has to unlearn how he has driven some tracks and relearn them with these new cars that cannot ride kerbs. And not being a simulator guy to get used to the cars is probably a weakness.

Nonetheless I do think LH can get a win this year.

I'll say it for you: George isn't beating Hamilton. You're welcome.

Great race for both today though, Hamilton pace after safety car was encouraging.

[Gillian]

At least two pages of deleted posts later…

THIS IS MERCEDES 2020 TEAM THREAD, KEEP IT ON TOPIC.

Need to delete a lot more if that's the topic

We're still in Q8 of 2020, so that's alright.

[PlatinumZealot]

Not a bad drive from both Merc drivers today. Taking advantage of the VSC and the SC at the right time to make their stops. Would have been nice to have seen a better strategy from Alonso and Perez not retiring, but such is racing.

They're due upgrade at Silverstone aint they?

May I ask why?

Effectively 'gifted' (used loosely) them 1 position and I believe Perez would have been up there between the mercs if not ahead of them.

Not taking away the great drive both Merc drivers had however.

Wishing other teams to spank Mercedes in the Mercedes thread?! Strange.

[chrisc90]

May I ask why?

Effectively 'gifted' (used loosely) them 1 position and I believe Perez would have been up there between the mercs if not ahead of them.

Not taking away the great drive both Merc drivers had however.

Wishing other teams to spank Mercedes in the Mercedes thread?! Strange.

Not at all. Think you misunderstood that. As I said, both mercedes drivers had a good race.

Do you think it would have been the same result given no retirement from Perez and Alonso pitting at the 'right' time?

[zibby43]

Effectively 'gifted' (used loosely) them 1 position and I believe Perez would have been up there between the mercs if not ahead of them.

Not taking away the great drive both Merc drivers had however.

Wishing other teams to spank Mercedes in the Mercedes thread?! Strange.

Not at all. Think you misunderstood that. As I said, both mercedes drivers had a good race.

Do you think it would have been the same result given no retirement from Perez and Alonso pitting at the 'right' time?

Alpines didn’t have the pace for the Mercs today.

[ringo]

Toto is perfectly right.
From a safety grounds the formula is flawed. The formula should be designed in a way that the car is safe within all possible range of adjustments permitted by the regulation.
If a team is setting up the car to be the faster it can be, the permitted adjustments that allow them to chase lap time must fall within a safe mode of operation for the cars.
You cannot have a regulation and tell the teams that the regulation is unsafe, it is up to you to come right up against wherever that blurred line of safety is. It is irresponsible.

The FIA need to make changes to the regulations for the floor. They know what to do to limit the ground effect. Have a flat entry at the front of the floor. That's all it takes. Or mandate a specific cut out in the floor that limits the ground effect.
If nothing is done this year, at least return to a flatter floor next year.

He's right to want the rules changed to suit him?

Others have managed to make a car that works perfectly well.

Teams know how to stop the bouncing.

Merc deliberately running their car on the bump stops. What do they expect?

The Merc agenda is to get active suspension, or fancier suspension brought in.

FIA have brought /bringing in rules that will reduce the amount of bouncing, and Merc will see that as being the solution for rest of this season (inevitable) and probably next.

We will see who has the real problems when these new sensors are brought in showing the oscillations the drivers get on the straights/under bouncing. If a lot of teams are under the limit....no real reason to change the rules really is there.

I don't think you understand what I am saying. It's not about getting rules to suit one team or the other.

I am saying the regulations are flawed, because they are not intrinsically safe; for lack of better words.

Just like how the halo is designed to protect the driver from all possible angles of impact and situations, the technical regs should be designed for all possible setups to be safe. It cannot be that a car is unsafe when it starts to chase laptime through setup.

[chrisc90]

Toto is perfectly right.
From a safety grounds the formula is flawed. The formula should be designed in a way that the car is safe within all possible range of adjustments permitted by the regulation.
If a team is setting up the car to be the faster it can be, the permitted adjustments that allow them to chase lap time must fall within a safe mode of operation for the cars.
You cannot have a regulation and tell the teams that the regulation is unsafe, it is up to you to come right up against wherever that blurred line of safety is. It is irresponsible.

The FIA need to make changes to the regulations for the floor. They know what to do to limit the ground effect. Have a flat entry at the front of the floor. That's all it takes. Or mandate a specific cut out in the floor that limits the ground effect.
If nothing is done this year, at least return to a flatter floor next year.

He's right to want the rules changed to suit him?

Others have managed to make a car that works perfectly well.

Teams know how to stop the bouncing.

Merc deliberately running their car on the bump stops. What do they expect?

The Merc agenda is to get active suspension, or fancier suspension brought in.

FIA have brought /bringing in rules that will reduce the amount of bouncing, and Merc will see that as being the solution for rest of this season (inevitable) and probably next.

We will see who has the real problems when these new sensors are brought in showing the oscillations the drivers get on the straights/under bouncing. If a lot of teams are under the limit....no real reason to change the rules really is there.

I don't think you understand what I am saying. It's not about getting rules to suit one team or the other.

I am saying the regulations are flawed, because they are not intrinsically safe; for lack of better words.

Just like how the halo is designed to protect the driver from all possible angles of impact and situations, the technical regs should be designed for all possible setups to be safe. It cannot be that a car is unsafe when it starts to chase laptime through setup.

I think they are perfectly safe. Notice there was no comments to televised media from Mercedes this race? Toto said they raised the car a bit,as looked at the Rake of the RB. Did you hear about drivers complaining in the race? Did they struggle to get out the car?

The setup of the car plays a big game in this I believe. Infact, I didn’t notice much bouncing at all really apart from maybe a little on sainz on board.

If it continues the way it is, then I imagine the new directive will just fizzle out as teams realise they need to raise the car. Clearly this has been a lightbulb moment for Merc given Totos interview after the race

[siskue2005]

I think they are perfectly safe. Notice there was no comments to televised media from Mercedes this race? Toto said they raised the car a bit,as looked at the Rake of the RB. Did you hear about drivers complaining in the race? Did they struggle to get out the car?

Would love to see the source or link to that claim.

[chrisc90]

I think they are perfectly safe. Notice there was no comments to televised media from Mercedes this race? Toto said they raised the car a bit,as looked at the Rake of the RB. Did you hear about drivers complaining in the race? Did they struggle to get out the car?

Would love to see the source or link to that claim.

Watch the whole interview with jenson, Danica post race with sky. Where he said they had tunnel issues with downforce, adding rake to the car.

Edit: from memory it was where they were discussing Lewis and George taking different setup routes across the weekend.

[siskue2005]

I think they are perfectly safe. Notice there was no comments to televised media from Mercedes this race? Toto said they raised the car a bit,as looked at the Rake of the RB. Did you hear about drivers complaining in the race? Did they struggle to get out the car?

Would love to see the source or link to that claim.

Watch the whole interview with jenson, Danica post race with sky. Where he said they had tunnel issues with downforce, adding rake to the car.

Edit: from memory it was where they were discussing Lewis and George taking different setup routes across the weekend.

Please post the video where he says that they raised the car a bit. Thanks

[chrisc90]

Would love to see the source or link to that claim.

Watch the whole interview with jenson, Danica post race with sky. Where he said they had tunnel issues with downforce, adding rake to the car.

Edit: from memory it was where they were discussing Lewis and George taking different setup routes across the weekend.

Please post the video where he says that they raised the car a bit. Thanks

If it gets released with the full interview I’ll try remember to. Had a look at a couple places YouTube and Facebook but it’s only a very short clip of the full interview from Toto.