McL-H wrote: ↑08 Jul 2022, 14:20
Mclarenfanboy wrote: ↑08 Jul 2022, 13:47
Ben1980 wrote: ↑08 Jul 2022, 12:59
Because Mercedes are a massive team with a lot of infrastructure who would have spent a lot more money in the build up to the new cars and cap. It's really not rocket science.
The rest of your post just seems nonsense.
I think McL-H has some good points, dont dismiss him like that, that mantra of "our inside organisation is perfect bla bla bla ", led us to 2015-2018 times. Yeah , with all the financial problems aside, we are hearing that wind tunnel bla bla bla for ages now... whole Apple campus was built in less times... ok I dont agree that there is not a desire to win, McLaren exist to win, but I don t think everything is really fantastic , and I dont think money is the biggest culprit anymore... I mean , new investors came like 2 year ago ...
Thank you. Yes, how long should it take to build a wind tunnel? Is it that complicated for it to take longer than some of the most major construction projects in the world? And why are we taking funds to secondary racing series if this wind tunnel is holding us back so much? It doesn’t seem right.
And well, I mean that perhaps current investors are there for profit only and they don’t care whether the team is P1 or P4, as long as the team is producing profits to them. I don’t state that to be the case, but a possibility. And if so, I consider it a big betrayal to the fans. Can’t be that fans care more than the owners. But sometimes it damn right seems so since Ojjeh passed away.
I love this team and want them to do good. And I think it is the responsibility of us as fans to demand for nothing more than the absolute best. We are supporting the team with our money and time and I think the questions I ask are genuine and not “nonsense” in any way.
A lot of the questions you are asking are going to be very hard for anyone not in the Team (and potentially in Team Management) to answer accurately, but I’ll try my best to address a few of them based on similar Capex / Infrastructure projects that I have led and continue to manage today.
Regarding Mercedes fighting for wins (which with the exception of Silverstone, hasn’t been the case so far this season), it’s interesting to note that there hasn’t been big aero changes to their car so far, it would seem that most of their improvement are coming from changes / updates to their suspension and some tweaks to their floor… Why they are improving faster than McLaren? It may be due to 2 reasons:
1.- They have better tools / equipment / infrastructure in place, which allows them to do more with less… The better the tools, the less time you need to assess a problem, design a solution and implement it… This gap between both teams has been created during a decade of Mercedes spending more than double what McLaren was in a given season (same situation with Red Bull and Ferrari).
2.- They may have a better brain tank than McLaren, when spending as much as they have during the last decade, it is within the realm of possibility that they simply have a better overall Team in regards to engineers, designers, etc… A lot of people get fixated on discussing a couple of individuals (like Key for example), but seem to forget that these teams have several hundreds of people working on these cars and not one individual is responsible for it… At the level Key operates for example, it shouldn’t be expected for him to “design” a car, but to lead the Team that actually does it and ensure that they are operating at the best level possible.
The Wind Tunnel lead time, a couple of things that you need to take into account… The investment and approval for it was secured in 2019, with the expectation of work on the Wind Tunnel to start in 2020… Even though we are coming back to normal, we seem to forget that during 2020 we had a pandemic going on and most projects like McLaren’s Wind Tunnel had to be brought to a halt. Not only was McLaren actually on the verge of having serious financial difficulties, the pandemic itself and the inability to work normally created delays and the project was surely post-phoned with focus on securing the Team’s financials first and understanding what the impact of Covid would be long term.
Once Covid was a bit more under control and with the Team been more secure from a Financial perspective, the project was probably started once again in 2021 with the expectation of it taking approx 2 years to complete (which seems to be in within the Time Frame that they are currently right now). Supply Chain issues globally and inflation had to also increase the costs for the project itself and delay the arrival of parts / components for it, which will have added several months to the initial project timeline (lead times globally have increased, more so with specialty parts / components like the ones I would expect a Wind Tunnel to need)… Finally and regarding the comment on the construction of a 30 story building been faster than the Wind Tunnel, it usually is way easier / faster to build a new piece of infrastructure than it is to replace / update an existing one since you have a lot less constrains with the a new building, in addition, one is way more complex and unique than the other, requiring a lot more specialized and skilled labor to complete.
Why they are venturing into other racing series? Because it’s good for the long term health of McLaren as a brand and as a company, it increases it’s appeal as a brand and generates more value for it’s investors, which we have to keep in mind that want a “profit”, long gone are the days of rich people investing (or better said, spending) money in Formula 1 just because they like the sport or wanted the glamour associated with it… In today’s world, the investors want a return for their money and if McLaren can’t provide that, they will simply stop supporting the Team… McLaren without the investors wouldn’t exist today… In addition, the other racing categories are way easier / cheaper to fund and for the most part I’m sure they are self sustainable and do not infringe in McLaren’s budget cap… Indycar’s budget is in the single digits compared to the 140 million that the F1 Team costs and has also allowed to find a place for some of the engineers that the team had to cut due to the Budget Cap, which also means that McLaren can use any extra resources it may have now that they can’t just invest more in the F1 Team.
Regarding what the mindset of the shareholders is in regards to sporting accomplishments, your guess is as good as mine and most probably we would be mistaken regardless of position we would take… In my opinion, their first priority is for the Team to be self sustainable, financially stable and not bleeding money on a yearly basis… In order for that to happen, it’s as important for the team to be fiscally responsible as it is to be successful on track, they both go hand in hand.
I will just strongly disagree with your statements that the fans should “demand” anything from the Team… There is no entitlement as a fan to make any kind of “demand” since none have any ownership or “skin in the game” when it comes to the team… The fact that some think that it’s within their rights to make demands baffles me… If one wants to make demands, find a way to invest in the team and become a shareholder… I’m sure the mentality of some would change quiet dramatically if their live savings and their future (and their families) would be linked to McLaren, I’m pretty sure that winning wouldn’t be the priority anymore and making a profit (or at least not losing money) would be at the top of their list.
