2021 Cost Cap Rumours and Speculation

[west52keep64]

Red Bull’s accounts were finalized in Pound Sterling and the ABA shows its original submission came in at £114,293,000 ($132.4m at the current exchange rate) — nearly £4,000,000 ($4.6m) under the cap — but that the Cost Cap Administration found it “inaccurately excluded and/or adjusted costs amounting to a total of £5,607,000 ($6.5m) in its 2021 Full Year Reporting Documentation.”

Wow, that's quite an error on Red Bull's part. Nothing to do with rule changes as they suggested, they just got it wrong. And to add insult to injury the even applied a tax credit incorrectly!

I still maintain my theory that they knew they'd gone over the cap in last 2021, and they asked their accounts team to explore all avenues to bring their submission under the cap. This resulted in some creative interpretations of the regulations that the ABA clearly didn't agree with.

[vanburin]

10% reduction in development for a 0.37% overspend.

Fairly hefty

The penalty is anything but hefty. McLaren being forced to drop all Constructors points and their constructors championship in 2007 is a hefty penalty. This is a wrist slap, at best, and as others have said could very well be influential in deciding a championship.

[LM10]

10% reduction in development for a 0.37% overspend.

Fairly hefty

Chris, your bias shows through on every single post so your statement here has to be taken with a quarry full of salt. It wasn’t a 0.37% overspend. If the tax credit had been applied it would’ve been. But it wasn’t. So it was a $1.8m overspend. Which bought them two championships and likely more considering the rules in place for the next years.

Just a little correction: 2.2 million dollars was the amount.

I agree with you and just to remind, we're only talking about cost cap breach in 2021 which on it's own would already be enough for a significant advantage in 2021, 2022 and surely the following seasons as well. But, and it's a big but, we don't even know what's going on at the moment. Because, why should a team having been unable to follow the rules in 2021 (thinking they might excape with a light penalty only) not do the same in 2022?
And well, the sad part is that they were right thinking they might escape with a minor penalty...

[yamahasho]

so what is the status of the 2022, Red Bull going to go over or what?

[Incognito]

no accusation or evidence that RBR has sought at any time to act in bad faith, dishonestly or in fraudulent manner, nor has it wilfully concealed any information from the Cost Cap Administration.

So they're just crushingly incompetent when it comes to Maths? I suppose understanding numbers isn't something an F1 team places any importance on, especially in the cost cap era. It's also a relief Red Bull must've submitted their accounts with a note pointing out that they were in breach because, otherwise, they'd have been misrepresenting themselves which would be contrary to the FIA statement. It's a further relief that, at no point in the last few weeks, has Horner ever claimed that RBR weren't in breach because, again, that would undermine the FIA statement.

It's great that the FIA takes intention into account though, because that's very easy to prove. I wonder how other sports treat offenders if they claim that they didn't mean to dope? If only Lance Armstrong had said he'd accidentally fallen on all those EPO syringes...

[west52keep64]

The 10% reduction is actually only 7%, because it's calculated from the 70% they get for being WCC i.e. instead of 70% they get 63%. The fine also doesn't count towards the cost cap for this season or next, so it's an even softer penalty when you look at it that way.

[Incognito]

so what is the status of the 2022, Red Bull going to go over or what?

I assume so. Why wouldn't they? I assume the other teams are all going to desperately try and spend as much on development as possible now. The FIA have very clearly stated today that cheating pays and you're a mug if you don't.

Christ, it's so depressing. Last year's farce and the engine fiasco was bad enough but, with Massi gone and a new chief in place there was some hope that F1 might actually be respectable...

[yamahasho]

Even if the tax credit was applied, they still would of been over $500,000, it gets worse and worse for Red Bull, they had no intention of staying within the cap.

[west52keep64]

To put the penalty in context, this is the development allocation for the top 3 WCC positions:

• Red Bull - 70%
• Ferrari - 75%
• Mercedes - 80%

And this is how the penalty will be applied:

• Red Bull - 63%
• Ferrari - 75%
• Mercedes - 80%

[henry]

World “Muddy the waters” championship is over. Turns out the water was crystal clear. No winner declared, only losers.

[MadMax]

The 10% reduction is actually only 7%, because it's calculated from the 70% they get for being WCC i.e. instead of 70% they get 63%. The fine also doesn't count towards the cost cap for this season or next, so it's an even softer penalty when you look at it that way.

Exactly. The 10% is really 7% which is only 2% more than you get reduced for finishing one place higher in the championship. If RBR had been clever and allowed Ferrari to claim the WCC this year, RBR's actual loss would have only been 2% against Ferrari.

[SiLo]

The 10% reduction is actually only 7%, because it's calculated from the 70% they get for being WCC i.e. instead of 70% they get 63%. The fine also doesn't count towards the cost cap for this season or next, so it's an even softer penalty when you look at it that way.

This should not be how its worked out. It should be a flat 10% rate.

A top team breaching the cap now means they are punished less than a bottom team doing exactly the same thing because of how the car development percentages are worked out.

For instance, Williams doing the same thing would see a 12% reduction in wind tunnel time vs 7% for Red Bull. It should be a flat rate.

[AMG.Tzan]

What a joke!

So you are free to win as many championships as you like with an “overdeveloped” car and then just get a fine and just -10% (which isn’t even -10% in reality) of WT time! Do they really think that Red Bull will lose any performance even they turned up in 2023 with the same car as now??

Not only did they gain a big enough advantage to win the 2021 championship, they also gained aerodynamic knowledge and performance for the next 4 seasons (2022-2025)! Just wait and see Red Bull winning again as if nothing happened from the start of 2023…

Last but not least I can’t really understand why people are so much against the idea of a driver losing his championship since he was driving a car that wasn’t supposed to be as fast! Just think of how many times Lewis and Max ended up so close together in a race and Max won (USA for example)…would Max have won that race had it not been for his faster Red Bull? Probably no…

Athletes have lost their wins and medals years after winning them in the Olympic Games many times (Marion Jones for example) because they were found to have breached a regulation that made them faster…can’t really see what’s different here!

[yamahasho]

why they keeping it secret?
https://www.si.com/fannation/racing/f1b ... nding-jd22

"Red Bull's budget cap overspending has been one of F1's main talking points in recent weeks, as the FIA insisted on keeping the details of Red Bull's penalty for overspending secret."

[mwillems]

why they keeping it secret?
https://www.si.com/fannation/racing/f1b ... nding-jd22

"Red Bull's budget cap overspending has been one of F1's main talking points in recent weeks, as the FIA insisted on keeping the details of Red Bull's penalty for overspending secret."

They were just keeping everything secret until the ABA had been agreed. Likely the FIA were negotiating the punishment with RB and in the case that the ABA wasn't agreed, there was a need not to prejudice the independent adjudicators.

You can't argue with that really other than we have no sight of the original punishment that the FIA offered.