2022 Oracle | Red Bull Racing F1 Team

[AR3-GP]

This is a bit suspect its coming out now and just as a justification for Verstappen's actions.

For what it's worth, I don't think there was any reasonable justification. I think Max needs to be more clever. To think about how throwing Checo a bone when he really wanted it, would pay dividends down the road in pursuit of championship #3.

Nevertheless, the possibility of such a scheme is entertaining...

On the flip side, if its true, I wonder what the FIA would think knowing that a team principal found out that a driver purposely crashed in qualifying and didn't do anything about it...?

Isn't it two years running that a driver crashes in Monaco qualy, and then follows up with a **** eating grin? Quite frankly they need to send a driver who crashes to the back of the current knockout session, but that's for another thread....

[littlebigcat]

Actually, after having a think, it was only a minor breach of team orders...

[ivanlesk]

Well, apparently Max is still little Jos full of complexes.
Hi just shows that he cant be better man.

[west52keep64]

The Monaco rumour holds some water when you think about it, there really nothing to gain for Max in this specific race. He's won the WDC and it's the difference between 6th & 7th position. It must be something beyond/bigger than this race. If Max has his reasons, why doesn't he share them?

It's a damn shame, because Perez has so far been a team player and shown nothing by support for Max. I wouldn't blame Perez if next time he's asked to do something for Max, he simply replies "No".

[AR3-GP]

The Monaco rumour holds some water when you think about it, there really nothing to gain for Max in this specific race. He's won the WDC and it's the difference between 6th & 7th position. It must be something beyond/bigger than this race. If Max has his reasons, why doesn't he share them?

It's a damn shame, because Perez has so far been a team player and shown nothing by support for Max. I wouldn't blame Perez if next time he's asked to do something for Max, he simply replies "No".

Forget about Max's "reasons". Whether they are real or not, Max's priority needs to be currying favor with everyone inside the team who is going to help him become the 2023 WDC and from that point of view, he made the wrong choice if you ask me.

A WDC needs to be selfish, but also cunning and manipulative. The long term play was to throw Perez the bone in order to curry favor for next year. Harping on about the past when it had no outcome on the championship really is very silly and short-sighted.

Max has obviously got the driving part sorted, but he needs to work on the "people manager" side to really maximize the opportunity he has with Red Bull.

[west52keep64]

Forget about Max's "reasons". Whether they are real or not, Max's priority needs to be currying favor with everyone inside the team who is going to help him become the 2023 WDC and from that point of view, he made the wrong choice if you ask me.

A WDC needs to be selfish, but also cunning and manipulative. The long term play was to throw Perez the bone in order to curry favor for next year. Harping on about the past when it had no outcome on the championship really is very silly and short-sighted.

Max has obviously got the driving part sorted, but he needs to work on the "people manager" side to really maximize the opportunity he has with Red Bull.

Yeah agreed. Shades of Alonso i.e. a driver of has systematically alienated himself from every team he's raced for.

The radio message where Max said "don't ask me to do that again" or something similar basically sounded like a statement to say he will never let Perez through. That's fair play if you ask me, but then he can't ask or expect Perez to ever let him through? Which currently isn't the case, anytime Max finds himself behind Perez he's immediately on the radio to the team.

[AR3-GP]

Forget about Max's "reasons". Whether they are real or not, Max's priority needs to be currying favor with everyone inside the team who is going to help him become the 2023 WDC and from that point of view, he made the wrong choice if you ask me.

A WDC needs to be selfish, but also cunning and manipulative. The long term play was to throw Perez the bone in order to curry favor for next year. Harping on about the past when it had no outcome on the championship really is very silly and short-sighted.

Max has obviously got the driving part sorted, but he needs to work on the "people manager" side to really maximize the opportunity he has with Red Bull.

Yeah agreed. Shades of Alonso i.e. a driver of has systematically alienated himself from every team he's raced for.

The radio message where Max said "don't ask me to do that again" or something similar basically sounded like a statement to say he will never let Perez through. That's fair play if you ask me, but then he can't ask or expect Perez to ever let him through? Which currently isn't the case, anytime Max finds himself behind Perez he's immediately on the radio to the team.

To be fair, whether Max's calls for it or not, RB are going to let him through because 95% of the time he's been faster and generally, regardless of who the driver pairing is, the sensible thing to do is let driver with the best chance to win or finish further ahead through. RB is a business first. If Max is their best chance, Perez will have to get out of the way every time.


With all that said, I wonder if Perez quits at end of '24. He's not going to win a championship against Max except for some crazy bad luck for Max.

[organic]

For what it's worth, I don't think there was any reasonable justification. I think Max needs to be more clever. To think about how throwing Checo a bone when he really wanted it, would pay dividends down the road in pursuit of championship #3.

Nevertheless, the possibility of such a scheme is entertaining...

On the flip side, if its true, I wonder what the FIA would think knowing that a team principal found out that a driver purposely crashed in qualifying and didn't do anything about it...?

Isn't it two years running that a driver crashes in Monaco qualy, and then follows up with a **** eating grin? Quite frankly they need to send a driver who crashes to the back of the current knockout session, but that's for another thread....

Imo a driver who causes a red flag should lose their fastest laptime in that session

[west52keep64]

With all that said, I wonder if Perez quits at end of '24. He's not going to win a championship against Max except for some crazy bad luck for Max.

Yup, and then RB is back to trying to shoehorn in one of their young drivers who definitely won't want to play number 2.

It's such an own goal for Max & RB.

Watching some of the media pen interviews with Max, he talks about his reasons and how we won't say what those are, but he voiced them to the team and the team complied.... smells pretty fishy to me.

EDIT: Seriously, watch this interview: https://www.skysports.com/watch/video/s ... my-reasons

"We sat as a team and put everything on the table"... what is he talking about? The WDC & WCC is sealed, what's to put on the table? He obviously has some dirt on the team and he's using it. Very very shady if you ask me.

[west52keep64]

On the flip side, if its true, I wonder what the FIA would think knowing that a team principal found out that a driver purposely crashed in qualifying and didn't do anything about it...?

Isn't it two years running that a driver crashes in Monaco qualy, and then follows up with a **** eating grin? Quite frankly they need to send a driver who crashes to the back of the current knockout session, but that's for another thread....

Imo a driver who causes a red flag should lose their fastest laptime in that session

Yeah I agree something needs to be done, it's becoming such a frequent occurrence it's not even funny. Maybe they have a special rule for Monaco that you have to finish the session to keep the lap time, and if you trigger a yellow/red flag your lap might be deleted. I think the deletion but will have to be reviewed on a case-by-case basis, but at least making them finish the session will put a stop to the idea that they're already on pole so just YOLO it in to the wall to make sure nobody else gets pole.

[AR3-GP]

Isn't it two years running that a driver crashes in Monaco qualy, and then follows up with a **** eating grin? Quite frankly they need to send a driver who crashes to the back of the current knockout session, but that's for another thread....

Imo a driver who causes a red flag should lose their fastest laptime in that session

Yeah I agree something needs to be done, it's becoming such a frequent occurrence it's not even funny. Maybe they have a special rule for Monaco that you have to finish the session to keep the lap time, and if you trigger a yellow/red flag your lap might be deleted. I think the deletion but will have to be reviewed on a case-by-case basis, but at least making them finish the session will put a stop to the idea that they're already on pole so just YOLO it in to the wall to make sure nobody else gets pole.

A car that crashes so badly that it needs a red flag in qualifying wouldn't be able to pass the post-session technical inspection so I have no idea why they are allowed to keep their times from that point of view as well. You can't prove the car was legal during the session anymore. You can't check it's weight if it's strewn over the track. You can't check the rear wing slot gap if all of it is destroyed. At the minimum, a car crashed like Perez in Monaco this year or Leclerc last year in Monaco should be DSQd from qualifying.

If a car made it back to the pits in full health, I suppose then you limit the punishment to simply removing a lap time from the current session.

[chrisc90]

^^ great loophole in the regs there. Run a massively underweight car, then park it in the barrier with the front wheel off the car and FIA unable to decide whether it was legal or not. Your fastest lap time stands and you stick a bit more ballast in to hit minimum weight for the race.

[AR3-GP]

In all of the Verstappen-Perez points hulabaloo we have completely forgotten to discuss how awful the car was today


It was Austria Pt2 just like I said. Embarrassing pace drop off and tire wear. Perez held his head above water for about 17 laps, then bled out seconds by the handful to Russell. It was a massacre

I think they bottled the car setup just like they did in Austria.

We shouldn't speak of this weekend ever again

[chrisc90]

Yes agreed. Maybe it was the lack of run time before qualifying with it being a sprint weekend and the car was a bit too wrong out of the box. Maybe it was the combination of the wing and diffuser, or whether there might have been something else in the pipeline for next year. Who knows.
Either way the car went from being the best on the tyres one week to the complete opposite 2 weeks later.

We have to remember that Max was unhappy with the car from the onset this weekend. I’m sure it will be service as usual next week in Dubai

[west52keep64]

^^ great loophole in the regs there. Run a massively underweight car, then park it in the barrier with the front wheel off the car and FIA unable to decide whether it was legal or not. Your fastest lap time stands and you stick a bit more ballast in to hit minimum weight for the race.

The only fly in the ointment there is they could get called to the weigh bridge at any point during the entire qualifying session. If they got caught it wouldn't just be a DSQ from the race, it would most likely be a multiple race ban.