next years engines

[jaslfc]

Next year all the teams must change to v8 or limit the revs in their existing v10 engines. Currently the engines are running about 900 bhp what will the power be next year? is the engine goin to be similar to the gp2 series v8 engine

[pompelmo]

It's gonna be simmilar to gp2 engine..approx 700bhp

[Steven]

Is it really going to drop that much?
Of course we are dropping considerably in capacity... Since I expect a similar rpm will these engines therefore have about the same sound?

What would the main possibilities be to compensate for this loss?
I think it may lead to an even sleeker coke bottle design at the end of the car since the engine can be made shorter than currently with a V10

[scarbs]

I don’t know much about the GP2 engine, but I doubt there will be any similarities beyond the basic geometry, which is fixed for the new V8s. Power output is now projected to be well over 700bhp, while rev ceilings will go up, despite the extra vibrations Cosworth are running the engine to 20k RPM so expect peak power at around 19,500- 19,750.
The engines will be tiny, BAR have run theirs already and Willis commented on the units size. A cars key component lengths will change drastically, between the choice of long wheel base maintained by a 12-15 cm spacer or a reduced wheelbase. Radiators and ancillaries will be smaller so smaller sidepods can be expected too, also with fewer exhausts to package the final section of coke bottle shaping can be even tighter.

[Reca]

The GP2 engine is, IIRC, a 4000 cc revving at maximum at 10k rpm and having little less than 600 hp, I have the specifications somewhere, I'll post them later.

For the F1 V8, as scarbs said, will be a totally different beast, I would expect a power reduction in the order of 15-20% compared with the V10, closer to 15 than to 20.

Edit : I failed to find the article with the detailed specifications, I can just confirm the previous data.

[bcsolutions]

So then the engines are going to be lighter, smaller and easier to package. The ancillaries lighter, smaller and easier to package. The engine speed is increasing along with specific output. The cars are going to be marginally slower than they are now but not apreciably so. Yet the development cost of the new V8's is surely massive in comparison to the development cost of the much tried and tested V10? It seems to me that the FIA has failed in its attempts to slow the cars down and reduce the cost of F1.

[uzael]

If MercBenz or Ferrari has $300million to spend on an engine, they will spend it, regardless of whether it's 2.4V8 or 3.0V10. The whole costs going up argument is based upon running two development progrmas at the same time, which they already do anyway to develop the current engine, as well as design next years engine. Want to really reduce cost? Fix the engine specifications at the beginning of the year and allow one or two revisions. Make certain past the same all year long, like engine blocks and cylinder heads. That will make purchasing the gnines much cheaoer for smaller teams.

[Scuderia_Russ]

If Want to really reduce cost? Fix the engine specifications at the beginning of the year and allow one or two revisions. Make certain past the same all year long, like engine blocks and cylinder heads.

This just isn't Formula-1 IMO.

[uzael]

Is the F1 of the 50's anything like the F1 of today? Of course not, times change as does the sport. A decade ago driver aids were severly curtailed and monitored (sometimes more successfully than others), but did that inherently make the sport no longer 'Formula 1'? Sports evolve, times change and sometimes regulations have to be changed that drastically alter the sport in order to save the racing we enjoy.

[Scuderia_Russ]

Of course the sport has changed since the fifties i'm not disputing that. But once something like the engine is restricted this way it's time for the wings...then it's control wings, control engines, control gearbox then you have a single make series that is not Formula 1. The F.I.A. has quite a juggling act. Motorsport r+d gives them a headache in trying to slow these cars down before they become a safety risk.

[Crafty]

uzael is absolutely correct.

In this months F1 Racing mag there is a short article on the 06 spec engines, a stack of journalists were shown the honda engine on a dyno at 20,000rpm. They also spoke to cosworth who were very positive on their engine project.
Apparently they had been spending lots of money on reducing the friction surfaces and the number of moving parts in the engine.. in wother words the money "saved" by new regulations was soon spent in other areas.

The feeling fromt he article was that niether honda or cosworth expect the V8s to be much behind the V10s in terms of power..

[Guest]

Engines have been restricted before.

[ib141]

Yeah they used to be 3.5L V12's. In the end they will make up the power deficit. FIA generally underestimate how good the enigneers are in F1. They were supposed to be 1.5-2 secs a lap slower after the aero changes but not even halfway through the season and they're lapping faster

[manchild]

Video of 2006 V8 Cosworth on dyno!

http://www.cosworth.com

[Reca]

IF the number on the monitor right under the rpm is the torque in Nm, then :



Then, here is the rpm vs time from a sound analysis :



there are a few “vibrations” of the curve probably related with noise in the signal that the program mixes with the engine frequency, I’ll try to clean it when I have a bit of spare time, but the accuracy at peak rpm is quite good, thanks to the fact that it keeps a basically constant rpm for a couple of seconds.