Oracle Red Bull Racing RB19 Speculation Thread

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organic
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Re: Oracle Red Bull Racing RB19 Speculation Thread

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Cs98 wrote:
18 Feb 2023, 11:59
LM10 wrote:
18 Feb 2023, 00:34
Cs98 wrote:
17 Feb 2023, 23:30

Easier to stay ahead that way. Every one of those teams is looking to copy RB first chance they get, no reason to help them. After all, what do they gain by releasing the car early? The gratitude of some hobby technical "experts" on the internet :lol: :lol:
The concept of copying is overhyped. Remember the Racing Point being almost a total copy of Mercedes. They still were miles away performance wise. A car being a “copy” will never be as fast as the “original” one. You can only hide details of your own car to prevent others implementing it on their own car.
If you have some kind of a silver bullet on your car which you’re trying to hide for 2 additional weeks, it most probably is going to be a hard or almost impossible thing to copy anyway in times of a budget cap. Other than that, it’s always the whole car which works in synergy and can never be copied to the point it works the same.
You say that but we have 7 cars following a very similar concept after one year of new regs. Only three of those cars actually started out using the concept (RB, AT, Alpine). And using AM as an example. They were actually quite quick at the end of the season using their RB copy, much quicker than at the start.

So copying is very prevalent, even more so now when 7 teams are following a similar concept meaning there’s better correlation for applying stolen ideas.
Yup plus look at the floor edges of every team. I think all but a couple run the RB18 floor cuts and twisted floor section which extracts air and has gurneys around where the sidepods do most of their outwashing

If RB can hide something like this for a couple of weeks I guess that could have massive benefits in a world where these solutions are easily copyable for the majority of the grid. Maybe they're not RB's current main competition but I guess just assuming that is getting complacent?
Last edited by organic on 18 Feb 2023, 12:02, edited 1 time in total.

Cs98
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Re: Oracle Red Bull Racing RB19 Speculation Thread

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PlatinumZealot wrote:
18 Feb 2023, 01:13
Their wind tunnel time for 2023 has been severely stunted... I mean like half a second of magnitude stunted.. So Redbull is actually behind on purpose... Maximizing CFD to the very last minute.
They seem to be ahead of schedule if anything. It’s like a role reversal between RB and Merc this season when it comes to prep.

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organic
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Re: Oracle Red Bull Racing RB19 Speculation Thread

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Has anyone got any good comparison shots of the nose? It seemed to be noticed immediately that it's changed and to me it does look like that too.. but would be nice to have confirmation

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kediown
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Re: Oracle Red Bull Racing RB19 Speculation Thread

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organic wrote:
18 Feb 2023, 12:20
Has anyone got any good comparison shots of the nose? It seemed to be noticed immediately that it's changed and to me it does look like that too.. but would be nice to have confirmation
Image

Not the best angles, but tried to find some fan footage for better comparison. If any of you goes to Silverstone this year, please take low quality pictures so this can be easier next year :lol:

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Juzh
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Re: Oracle Red Bull Racing RB19 Speculation Thread

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LM10 wrote:
18 Feb 2023, 00:34
Cs98 wrote:
17 Feb 2023, 23:30
LM10 wrote:
17 Feb 2023, 23:10


The midfield teams are not even anywhere near RedBull. Totally irrelevant to hide the car for 2 weeks from them.
Easier to stay ahead that way. Every one of those teams is looking to copy RB first chance they get, no reason to help them. After all, what do they gain by releasing the car early? The gratitude of some hobby technical "experts" on the internet :lol: :lol:
The concept of copying is overhyped. Remember the Racing Point being almost a total copy of Mercedes. They still were miles away performance wise. A car being a “copy” will never be as fast as the “original” one. You can only hide details of your own car to prevent others implementing it on their own car.
If you have some kind of a silver bullet on your car which you’re trying to hide for 2 additional weeks, it most probably is going to be a hard or almost impossible thing to copy anyway in times of a budget cap. Other than that, it’s always the whole car which works in synergy and can never be copied to the point it works the same.
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Stu
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Re: Oracle Red Bull Racing RB19 Speculation Thread

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kediown wrote:
18 Feb 2023, 13:26
organic wrote:
18 Feb 2023, 12:20
Has anyone got any good comparison shots of the nose? It seemed to be noticed immediately that it's changed and to me it does look like that too.. but would be nice to have confirmation
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... /image.png

Not the best angles, but tried to find some fan footage for better comparison. If any of you goes to Silverstone this year, please take low quality pictures so this can be easier next year :lol:
Not sure if anyone else is seeing this but the nose looks higher and wider than RB18 in these photos (even the slope to the chassis looks to have been reduced). Not exactly a ‘high-nose concept’ - circa 2013; but certainly not a floor scraper!

If so it could be that they have found something that will help to drive the keel and floor inlet or they are planning to run more static/low-speed rake.

Due to the livery it is difficult to get much more detail out of these shots, but they are all that we have for now!!
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chrisc90
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Re: Oracle Red Bull Racing RB19 Speculation Thread

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So I presume that the lightweight chassis that was made and rumoured last year will be the tub for this year.

Im not sure how much scope that allows for change in design of the rest of the car but it would be interesting. I think it will be minimal given everything else 'bolts on'.

It could have also been a very clever move from RB last year too. Spend the extra on the tubs and design whilst needing to bring very few updates in the 2022 season and knowing they will be restricted on tunnel and cfd time due to winning the championship and the budget cap penalty they can use more of the budget on developing parts that they wouldnt have had to do over the winter break from the start of the year 2023, so they could have moved some of the cost about and use more to focus on upgrade packages this year.
Mess with the Bull - you get the horns.

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organic
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Re: Oracle Red Bull Racing RB19 Speculation Thread

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Stu wrote:
18 Feb 2023, 15:51
kediown wrote:
18 Feb 2023, 13:26
organic wrote:
18 Feb 2023, 12:20
Has anyone got any good comparison shots of the nose? It seemed to be noticed immediately that it's changed and to me it does look like that too.. but would be nice to have confirmation
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... /image.png

Not the best angles, but tried to find some fan footage for better comparison. If any of you goes to Silverstone this year, please take low quality pictures so this can be easier next year :lol:
Not sure if anyone else is seeing this but the nose looks higher and wider than RB18 in these photos (even the slope to the chassis looks to have been reduced). Not exactly a ‘high-nose concept’ - circa 2013; but certainly not a floor scraper!

If so it could be that they have found something that will help to drive the keel and floor inlet or they are planning to run more static/low-speed rake.

Due to the livery it is difficult to get much more detail out of these shots, but they are all that we have for now!!
Yes I believe I see the higher/wider nose but like you say, can't be sure with the livery especially because RB's nose had yellow not down to the tip last year so it looked deceptively short:

Image

And we can easily be fooled by this sort of thing with the quality we have

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Re: Oracle Red Bull Racing RB19 Speculation Thread

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Wouldn't it be cooll if RB shows up with just a minor tweak to the RB19 and win the first race?

That they were so confident in 22 they just ran an overheavy detuned car they knew would be fast enough to win in 23 too? If they stripped it of some weight and made just some tweaks to the balance and slapped on the deferred updates they had in stock? That is not at all far fetched. (Remember that updates not raced are outside the cap!)

They can probably just carry over most of the parts.

That would be the absolute hardest blow they could give the competition, knowing RB is allocating most of the '23 budget on the '24 car. While all teams deplete their budgets catching up.

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chrisc90
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Re: Oracle Red Bull Racing RB19 Speculation Thread

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Henk_v wrote:
18 Feb 2023, 16:04
Wouldn't it be cooll if RB shows up with just a minor tweak to the RB19 and win the first race?

That they were so confident in 22 they just ran an overheavy detuned car they knew would be fast enough to win in 23 too? If they stripped it of some weight and made just some tweaks to the balance and slapped on the deferred updates they had in stock? That is not at all far fetched. (Remember that updates not raced are outside the cap!)

They can probably just carry over most of the parts.

That would be the absolute hardest blow they could give the competition, knowing RB is allocating most of the '23 budget on the '24 car. While all teams deplete their budgets catching up.
What is the rules on budgeting and carrying over un-used parts?
Mess with the Bull - you get the horns.

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nico5
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Re: Oracle Red Bull Racing RB19 Speculation Thread

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Stu wrote:
18 Feb 2023, 15:51
kediown wrote:
18 Feb 2023, 13:26
organic wrote:
18 Feb 2023, 12:20
Has anyone got any good comparison shots of the nose? It seemed to be noticed immediately that it's changed and to me it does look like that too.. but would be nice to have confirmation
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... /image.png

Not the best angles, but tried to find some fan footage for better comparison. If any of you goes to Silverstone this year, please take low quality pictures so this can be easier next year :lol:
Not sure if anyone else is seeing this but the nose looks higher and wider than RB18 in these photos (even the slope to the chassis looks to have been reduced). Not exactly a ‘high-nose concept’ - circa 2013; but certainly not a floor scraper!

If so it could be that they have found something that will help to drive the keel and floor inlet or they are planning to run more static/low-speed rake.

Due to the livery it is difficult to get much more detail out of these shots, but they are all that we have for now!!
Could be 2022 AlphaTauri-ish with the raised front wing mainplane, but as someone pointed out could just be the tip of the nose being unpainted. Certainly wider.

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Vanja #66
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Re: Oracle Red Bull Racing RB19 Speculation Thread

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Henk_v wrote:
18 Feb 2023, 16:04
Wouldn't it be cooll if RB shows up with just a minor tweak to the RB19 and win the first race?
***
They can probably just carry over most of the parts.
Horner stated new car is faster than RB18 (says AR3) and is also far lighter, means loads of new parts. As for carry over, all of the teams will try to do that as much as they can, but remember all teams will want to bring the weight down, so complete carry over is limited, while using same tools to make lighter composite parts is possible. Still - new parts.
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Re: Oracle Red Bull Racing RB19 Speculation Thread

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Vanja #66 wrote:
18 Feb 2023, 17:04
Henk_v wrote:
18 Feb 2023, 16:04
Wouldn't it be cooll if RB shows up with just a minor tweak to the RB19 and win the first race?
***
They can probably just carry over most of the parts.
Horner stated new car is faster than RB18 (says AR3) and is also far lighter, means loads of new parts. As for carry over, all of the teams will try to do that as much as they can, but remember all teams will want to bring the weight down, so complete carry over is limited, while using same tools to make lighter composite parts is possible. Still - new parts.
Yes unfortunately it's a bit of a chore to track down and I can't listen right now, but he said it in this interview:



Also, there was another team (forgive me, I go through stuff so quickly, perhaps I will pull it up later), which pretty much said the downforce loss due to the regs change was recovered "incredibly quickly"

Therefore I do expect all teams to be faster than last year. Teams will have more downforce than last year.
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organic
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Re: Oracle Red Bull Racing RB19 Speculation Thread

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kediown wrote:
18 Feb 2023, 13:26
organic wrote:
18 Feb 2023, 12:20
Has anyone got any good comparison shots of the nose? It seemed to be noticed immediately that it's changed and to me it does look like that too.. but would be nice to have confirmation
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... /image.png

Not the best angles, but tried to find some fan footage for better comparison. If any of you goes to Silverstone this year, please take low quality pictures so this can be easier next year :lol:
Looking at this RB almost certainly ran the shakedown with RB18 sidepods

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kediown
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Re: Oracle Red Bull Racing RB19 Speculation Thread

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organic wrote:
19 Feb 2023, 00:50
kediown wrote:
18 Feb 2023, 13:26
organic wrote:
18 Feb 2023, 12:20
Has anyone got any good comparison shots of the nose? It seemed to be noticed immediately that it's changed and to me it does look like that too.. but would be nice to have confirmation
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... /image.png

Not the best angles, but tried to find some fan footage for better comparison. If any of you goes to Silverstone this year, please take low quality pictures so this can be easier next year :lol:
Looking at this RB almost certainly ran the shakedown with RB18 sidepods
Might be a RB18 & RB19 hybrid to test the new front wing and floor combination. The airbox still seems smaller to me than it is in RB18