2023 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

[Vaexa]

It was more like 4 tenths at a regular track. Abu Dhabi (7 tenths off) seemed to be particularly bad for Merc, whilst Brazil and Mexico's high altitudes favoured their car. Throw in RB and Ferrari stopping development of their cars much earlier than Mercedes (RB's final upgrade was spa for instance) and it's tricky to catch up. It's what you saw for years before when RB would close up at the end of the year and Merc would come with their new car and reestablish the gap. It's just hard to catch up

One cant help but wonder then what the whole point of the large regulation changes were ultimately for if we may (likely) be stuck with the same fundamental problem which it was intended to solve: the same team(s) dominating. And apparently, as you pointed out, playing catch-up is very hard to do because the leader(s) would "reestablish the gap".

So, with the new regs we now have slower, heavier, bouncier cars with the same pre-reg problems.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

This is a very common gripe for folks whose teams are currently losing that also completely misses the point of the technical regulations, which is to make the actual on track racing closer. The feedback from drivers is it generally did.

The aero sliding scale and budget cap are meant to level the field in time, but stamping out the legacy advantage of top teams in facilities, personnel and more abstractly, expertise just doesn't happen overnight.

[AR3-GP]

It was more like 4 tenths at a regular track. Abu Dhabi (7 tenths off) seemed to be particularly bad for Merc, whilst Brazil and Mexico's high altitudes favoured their car. Throw in RB and Ferrari stopping development of their cars much earlier than Mercedes (RB's final upgrade was spa for instance) and it's tricky to catch up. It's what you saw for years before when RB would close up at the end of the year and Merc would come with their new car and reestablish the gap. It's just hard to catch up

One cant help but wonder then what the whole point of the large regulation changes were ultimately for if we may (likely) be stuck with the same fundamental problem which it was intended to solve: the same team(s) dominating. And apparently, as you pointed out, playing catch-up is very hard to do because the leader(s) would "reestablish the gap".

So, with the new regs we now have slower, heavier, bouncier cars with the same pre-reg problems.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

but stamping out the legacy advantage of top teams in facilities, personnel and more abstractly, expertise just doesn't happen overnight.

To an extent, it did. Mercedes built the W13, which was racing with Haas and Alfa Romeo at the start of the season (something that would have been unfathomable if the 2021 regulations continued). This year Aston Martin might have a chance at Mercedes.

It will simply take more time to knock Ferrari and Red Bull back a peg.

[PlatinumZealot]

What about the Barcelona upgrades of Ferrari and Red Bull?

Diminishing returns....

Diminishing returns in the second season of a massive regulation change.....

That's what sucks about these restrictive rules. Cars concepts have all basically converged in the second year. The leading cars will reach diminishing returns soon.

[AR3-GP]

Diminishing returns....

Diminishing returns in the second season of a massive regulation change.....

That's what sucks about these restrictive rules. Cars concepts have all basically converged in the second year. The leading cars will reach diminishing returns soon.

The top 4 teams have different car concepts.

[johnny comelately]

It is very possible Mercedes are suffering from the sunk capital bias. Along with an over-reliance on data. Step back boys, step back.

[TotoWolf]

Russel lap on C4 tyres

[organic]

Russel lap on C4 tyres

On timing pillar it lists C5 for me, and that's what I thought he used first time around. Palmer agrees.

Seems likely first lap he did was C5.

[RonMexico]

Reminds me of the FW26 for some reason

[F1Krof]

If they don't deliver yet again this year, I think it is time for Tim Elliot to go. They can't risk getting in this trend and risk 2026 similarly.

[DGP123]

If they don't deliver yet again this year

Russell pretty much already said this is a turd until Baku/Barcelona. Damage would have already been done, and RB/Ferrari will then make another step.

Once you’re behind, it’s pretty much impossible to turn the dud concept around. I’ve got no faith in Elliott. He was promoted from within, but now he’s alone, with nobody around him or above him. Looks like a team that’s lost.

Depressing really. I can only envisage this being the Verstappen era now until 26’. Not sure what Lewis is seeing at the team now, to justify signing a new deal.

[De Jokke]

With the breakdown yesterday, merc is already allowed to bring 'reliability' updates for the engine. Allright!

On a more serious note: watching this vid it doesn't seem all doom and gloom guys:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ewUJBVHnx8

[De Jokke]

Nice pic:

[PlatinumZealot]

Diminishing returns in the second season of a massive regulation change.....

That's what sucks about these restrictive rules. Cars concepts have all basically converged in the second year. The leading cars will reach diminishing returns soon.

The top 4 teams have different car concepts.

You are alluding to the side pods because they grab your eyes? That's a very crude way of looking at things...

[De Jokke]

Menacing shot

[chrisc90]

Ted just said theres a 15minute interview with Shovlin tonight where he details the changes they made and whether they would go a red bull type setup (spoiler they arent apparently)