2023 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

[dialtone]

For the record here are the race sims of the first drivers of a few teams:

Do these happen to also be the "fastest" race sim of each team? That would be more instructive. Verstappen's stint was on the soft. Perez was actually quicker on the medium. Ignoring Perez flatters the others.

Perez dipped into the 1.34s (no one else did) and no one seems to be taking notice of what that means, and if Verstappen would be on the same tire...None of those mid 34s from Perez had DRS either.

https://i.postimg.cc/FH13L6Lz/image.png

I just picked at random based on position in the quali sims, yeah Perez laps were the best pace, as I recognized as well VER had a slight edge anyway.

Piqued my interest though so I went to check a lap from LEC and PER (lap 17 for both of their tires, that's PER fastest lap of the sim against the slowest from LEC but still in line with the times (1.35.39 for LEC and 1.34.64 for PER):



All the gain from PER is in the back straight and straights in general. So then I compared the same between VER and PER:



And IMHO PER is running a higher engine mode because the gain graph looks the same as for LEC, in each straight lots of time gain for PER.

I don't think this is due to Softs/Mediums, neither tire is giving up IMHO, it's just engine mode.

[AR3-GP]

For the record here are the race sims of the first drivers of a few teams:

Do these happen to also be the "fastest" race sim of each team? That would be more instructive. Verstappen's stint was on the soft. Perez was actually quicker on the medium. Ignoring Perez flatters the others.

Perez dipped into the 1.34s (no one else did) and no one seems to be taking notice of what that means, and if Verstappen would be on the same tire...None of those mid 34s from Perez had DRS either.

https://i.postimg.cc/FH13L6Lz/image.png

I just picked at random based on position in the quali sims, yeah Perez laps were the best pace, as I recognized as well VER had a slight edge anyway.

Piqued my interest though so I went to check a lap from LEC and PER (lap 17 for both of their tires, that's PER fastest lap of the sim against the slowest from LEC but still in line with the times (1.35.39 for LEC and 1.34.64 for PER):

https://i.imgur.com/jl3BFB5.jpeg

All the gain from PER is in the back straight and straights in general. So then I compared the same between VER and PER:

https://i.imgur.com/UizfZK4.jpeg

And IMHO PER is running a higher engine mode because the gain graph looks the same as for LEC, in each straight lots of time gain for PER.

I don't think this is due to Softs/Mediums, neither tire is giving up IMHO, it's just engine mode.

Yes I noted that. It was pointed out that Verstappen was facing the downshifting issue again during his race runs in FP2. They would have turned the power down on his engine to manage it.

Of course I can't tell you how many 'knobs" they have, but I don't think Perez is running at full power either. It's just Verstappen is the outlier because of the downshifting problem.

We shall see then. I know you won't concede anything prematurely

[dialtone]

Yes I noted that. It was pointed out that Verstappen was facing the downshifting issue again during his race runs in FP2. They would have turned the power down on his engine to manage it.

Of course I can't tell you how many 'knobs" they have, but I don't think Perez is running at full power either. It's just Verstappen is the outlier because of the downshifting problem.

Sure. I don't think Ferrari is favorite tomorrow but even Marko recognized they have the best engine and in Bahrain we saw the speed improvement. The wing they are using here isn't going to punish them worse than the difference they had last year when they ran the same wing they had in Bahrain.

If people think Ferrari will be behind in top speed by more than a few kph (and mind you it's not just top speed that matters but the height of the curve) I think they are wrong. Ferrari engine may give up but it won't be slow and the car is efficient this year.

EDIT: as additional consideration, if RBR was so superior in this race why not change also VER gearbox? They may be forced anyway tomorrow but why risk it when your car laps everyone?

[AR3-GP]

Yes I noted that. It was pointed out that Verstappen was facing the downshifting issue again during his race runs in FP2. They would have turned the power down on his engine to manage it.

Of course I can't tell you how many 'knobs" they have, but I don't think Perez is running at full power either. It's just Verstappen is the outlier because of the downshifting problem.

Sure. I don't think Ferrari is favorite tomorrow but even Marko recognized they have the best engine and in Bahrain we saw the speed improvement. The wing they are using here isn't going to punish them worse than the difference they had last year when they ran the same wing they had in Bahrain.

If people think Ferrari will be behind in top speed by more than a few kph (and mind you it's not just top speed that matters but the height of the curve) I think they are wrong. Ferrari engine may give up but it won't be slow and the car is efficient this year.

I think Ferrari will be within 3-4km/h of top speed when the sandbags come out. No disagreement there. As I said elsewhere I not only think Ferrari have PU turned down, but almost excessively and perhaps worryingly so. A genuine fear that these PUs are not long for this world.

There's a number of reasons to run a PU at 93-95%, which include making sure engine cooling, vibrations, harvesting, and even braking cooling are calibrated for the circuit. Running way off the anticipated power levels runs the risk of not stress testing certain aspects of the car for the circuit and may lead to surprise problems.

What if porpoising recurs above a certain top speed which Ferrari have not hit yet because they have the PU in snail mode? Sainz seemed to hint at porpoising appearing out of nowhere late in the race in Bahrain, when fuel levels are low, engines are turned up, top speeds at their highest. You miss these details if you detune the engine excessively.

[jambuka]

Sure. I don't think Ferrari is favorite tomorrow but even Marko recognized they have the best engine and in Bahrain we saw the speed improvement. The wing they are using here isn't going to punish them worse than the difference they had last year when they ran the same wing they had in Bahrain.

If people think Ferrari will be behind in top speed by more than a few kph (and mind you it's not just top speed that matters but the height of the curve) I think they are wrong. Ferrari engine may give up but it won't be slow and the car is efficient this year.

I think Ferrari will be within 3-4km/h of top speed when the sandbags come out. No disagreement there. As I said elsewhere I not only think Ferrari have PU turned down, but almost excessively and perhaps worryingly so. A genuine fear that these PUs are not long for this world.

There's a number of reasons to run a PU at 93-95%, which include making sure engine cooling, vibrations, harvesting, and even braking cooling are calibrated for the circuit. Running way off the anticipated power levels runs the risk of not stress testing certain aspects of the car for the circuit and may lead to surprise problems.

What if porpoising recurs above a certain top speed which Ferrari have not hit yet because they have the PU in snail mode? Sainz seemed to hint at porpoising appearing out of nowhere late in the race in Bahrain, when fuel levels are low, engines are turned up, top speeds at their highest. You miss these details if you detune the engine excessively.

Yes I have a feeling Ferrari has some weird habit of trying to hide things and they come undone in the race because they don’t stress enough in FP.

[Schippke]

I noticed on a couple of onboards in FP1 and FP2 on Charles' car specifically some slight porpoising on the onboards... you could see his head bobbing up/down consistently on the run to the final corner and the main straight. Didn't see many onboards of Sainz so couldn't see for sure, but compared to the rest of the field, I couldn't see anything coming from any other drivers onboard (aside from similar areas where a few bumps might've been present).

Again, could be testing a few things again to see how close they can get, but still... odd to see them going through it even at this stage...

[jambuka]

I noticed on a couple of onboards in FP1 and FP2 on Charles' car specifically some slight porpoising on the onboards... you could see his head bobbing up/down consistently on the run to the final corner and the main straight. Didn't see many onboards of Sainz so couldn't see for sure, but compared to the rest of the field, I couldn't see anything coming from any other drivers onboard (aside from similar areas where a few bumps might've been present).

Again, could be testing a few things again to see how close they can get, but still... odd to see them going through it even at this stage...

Was it bouncing or just the floor scraping the curbs at turns? I saw even sparks flying out of RB going over the curbs

[Schippke]

No, this was on the main straight and on the run to the final turn; High speed before the braking zones. If I could find the clips and share them here, I would but would probably be flagged within a few hours by FOM anyway...

[dialtone]

I haven't seen much jumping around:



this is from the highlights video of f1tv around minute 6 or so.

[Capharol]

For the record here are the race sims of the first drivers of a few teams:

Do these happen to also be the "fastest" race sim of each team? That would be more instructive. Verstappen's stint was on the soft. Perez was actually quicker on the medium. Ignoring Perez flatters the others.

Perez dipped into the 1.34s (no one else did) and no one seems to be taking notice of what that means, and if Verstappen would be on the same tire...None of those mid 34s from Perez had DRS either.

https://i.postimg.cc/FH13L6Lz/image.png

not right SAI did 1.34s aswell

[mzso]

You do realize the same thing happened in Bahrain right? On friday they were losing in the straights and saturday they were gaining in the straights. You also realize that HUL had 7-8kph advantage over LEC in FP2 and we've already seen from Bahrain that the Ferrari is a better car than the Haas. We've also seen the race sims are pretty even across a number of teams.

But also RB has the largest rear wing of all, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vtTuGnkA6WM?

Sure. I don't think Ferrari is favorite tomorrow but even Marko recognized they have the best engine

More like most powerful. I think the best is powerful, but also doesn't fail all the time, causing DNFs and grid penalties.

[AR3-GP]

I noticed on a couple of onboards in FP1 and FP2 on Charles' car specifically some slight porpoising on the onboards... you could see his head bobbing up/down consistently on the run to the final corner and the main straight. Didn't see many onboards of Sainz so couldn't see for sure, but compared to the rest of the field, I couldn't see anything coming from any other drivers onboard (aside from similar areas where a few bumps might've been present).

Again, could be testing a few things again to see how close they can get, but still... odd to see them going through it even at this stage...

Could be, and this is why detuning the PU so excessively in free practice (they are doing 10-15km/h slower on purpose), will be misleading for them.

[Peter Ian Staker]

The car has ZERO front end.

[organic]

The car has ZERO front end.

tyres weren't up to temperature. Leclerc was dealing mostly with oversteer on his last lap

[dialtone]

The car has ZERO front end.

Second lap onboard didn't seem too bad and even oversteer in the last corner.