ringo wrote: ↑22 Mar 2023, 20:19
Andi76 wrote: ↑22 Mar 2023, 17:11
ringo wrote: ↑22 Mar 2023, 13:31
You use the term "off the mark". Where is your evidence for your detailed claim?
As usual when i see some evidence or data that the team's performance engineer doesn't have but you do then maybe what you say has some credence. But so far if you look on what you wrote, it's speculation. I do not think anything has changed will last year's car to this year's.
Same problem of pushing too hard.
Are you serious? I told you what my evidence is - what the drivers said on the radio, as well as what virtually every Ferrari engineer except Clear (and he said that BEFORE the race in Bahrain, his opinion after the race was certainly different) said, and also Vasseur. In addition, every channel, whether Sky or F1TV brings evaluations of the lap times in long runs of practice and race. Even here in the forum are tens of such data, which prove without any doubt the tire problems... I have listed my evidence more than clearly and the data and statements are anyway familiar to everyone who follows Formula 1... what I find amusing is honestly still that you say it is obvious that Ferrari lacks downforce simply because you conclude it, but you doubt things that are proven beyond doubt by data in every F1 broadcast, by statements of drivers, team bosses and every technician. And even in this thread you can find enough data. So I would say - let's leave this discussion here, because it is more than obvious that this is a case of - I believe what fits into my worldview and what is clearly proven I don't care. And finally everyone can make up his own mind about what you say here and what I say and what is proven and what is not.
every other Ferrari engineer --- who exactly?
Jock Clear after Bahrain.... did not see him say anything after the race.
Vasseur .. not the race engineer, and seems clueless about the team at this stage and mostly speculates.
Sky F1.. speculates just as we do here on f1 tech. They are not on the team.
Tens of data on tyres on F1T? I never see anyone here with tyre data, worse comparing tyre data across teams.
Ferrari lacks downforce, not because I conclude it, but because Jock Clear does, and team, it has no front end. Also the lap time data shows where redbull gains on Ferrari. So I can say the car has less downforce. I just do not have the evidence to describe the mechanisms of anything on the car.
And agree, anyone can make up his mind. But that means you have no grounds to determine if someone elses suggestions is "off the mark".
As far as I am aware, Ferrari have not released any data on their tyre usage, neither is any engineer quoted on such.
They have commented on the front end and simply lack of load and balance on the car compared to redbull.
We see on the lap traces as well where the grip falls away and the gap widens to redbull.
That is already completely wrong. Jock Clear said that BEFORE the race in Bahrain! And let me get this straight - you're telling me that Jock Clear's statement made BEFORE the race in Bahrain that Ferrari has no problems with tire degradation is correct, even though both Sainz and Leclerc said in the race they could go faster but they can't push because immediately the tires overheat? And that Clears statement is correct, although it was proven wrong in the race? And that you can generally observe on every longrun and in every race how high the degradation is at Ferrari? And that Vasseur has no idea, but is completely clueless as a team manager and trained engineer? And consequently also that all the statements of the other teams, of Helmut Marko, Toto Wolf who say Ferrari suffers from extreme tire degradation are also wrong?
I'm sorry, but I think if you do some research you will find enough statements from the 2022 French GP to today where Binotto, Mekkies and others have said that Ferrari has a problem with high tire degradation. I honestly don't want to waste my time proving something that is common knowledge and everyone knows anyway. Also if it would only be about Downforce - Alfa, or other teams who definetely have less downforce than Ferrari must also have tire problems according to your theory. Why does Alfa not have any tire problems? They have a different suspension. Camber stiffness, toe stiffness and vertical stiffness are very important here and having problems in that regard (what is very hard to detect) can cause tire problems.
And I can very well say that what someone said is "off the mark" if what he says turns out to be completely wrong a few hours later.
And there is just as much data here as for your downforce theory. Because the drop of the lap times says here just as much as the lap traces and who where how much time loses over the downforce. Probably even more.
But let's just end this. You think that everybody is wrong or has no idea, Vasseur, Marko, Sainz, Leclerc, Wolff, Shovlin, Hamilton up to all the experts and people from all the other teams who say, supported by data from longruns and races, that Ferrari has problems with tire degradation. And that this one statement from Clear before the race in Bahrain is correct. It's ok for me, it's your right. But it is also my right not to do so. For said reasons.