Jaguar F1 Team in Schools Challenge

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If I found out the burst pressure of the CO2 cartridge, how should I go about determining the best angle?

Mitch

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Thanks manchild,

I am aiming for the quickest car, while still resembling an F1 car. I have found the pressure of the CO2 cartridge, and I have also found out that you can use any non-metallic material for the front wing and wheels. Any suggestions?

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Here is a link to the stats of the winners from last year.

http://www.f1inschools.co.uk/data/downl ... tional.pdf

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Another thing, you said that I should angle the cartridge, which will in turn make the car go upward somewhat so I will need some downforce to make sure that all of the energy can be transformed into forward motion. Would it then be better to angle the cartridge?

manchild
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Anonymous wrote:Another thing, you said that I should angle the cartridge, which will in turn make the car go upward somewhat so I will need some downforce to make sure that all of the energy can be transformed into forward motion. Would it then be better to angle the cartridge?
As long as the cartridge pressure makes less thrust than what is the overall weight of the car liftoff shouldn't happen.
Remember how jets from aircraft carrier launch? They bring up those boards behind the jet so that stream from the engine can push the jet strongly forward.

What speed can these racers reach?

I don’t know the formula for calculating the cartridge angle but I was hoping that pros here might have it.

mjmurphy
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The highest average speed in the National Finals last year was 39.95 mph / 17.86 m/s.

http://www.f1inschools.co.uk/data/downl ... tional.pdf

manchild
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When it matters material for wings carbon fiber would be the best. Try to find small flat or slightly bended (if you want to generate downforce) pieces of CF from a crashed motorcycle cover or from a racing car. Later you can cut it and tune up with sandpaper.

To achieve great speed wheels must weight as little as possible and most of all centered perfectly. Only way to achieve this is to use plastic wheels from some broken mechanism/toy car or make new ones on a small lathe (gunsmiths usually have them).

Perhaps you could try to find 4 carbon fiber fishing reel spools. They are perfectly manufactured, very little weight and their shape would allow you to achieve necessary width at contact point (15mm min).

Having a ball bearing on the wheel is also very important for achieving great speed. Nowadays they are made even very small. Anyway, taking wheels from a toy-car seam looks simplest to me (if allowed by reg.)

If you have enough time, best way would be to design the wheel, acquire appropriate material (round aluminum bar), find 4 small ball bearings (fishing reel repair shop) and tubes that you’d use as axles (use tubes/pipes to decrease weight, not bars).

You should make these wheels on CNC and if CNC is not required for wheels than a local gunsmith could make you wheels on a lathe with fittings for a ball bearings. Than you can polish the wheels using any household silver polisher (even a tooth paste will do).

The ball bearings must have slightly wider diameter than the fitting on wheel so when it is pushed in it stays firmly attached (PUSH BEARING IN USING PIPE WHOSE DIAMETER IS SIMMILAR TO DIAMETER OF THE OUTER RING OF THE BEARING!!! PUSH ONLY THE OUTER RING OF THE BALL BEARING!!!).

Same goes of axle. The inner diameter of ball bearing should be slightly smaller than axle diameter which is necessary to provide partial grip/fixation (must have greater resistance than the balls & rings of the bearing) of the inner ring of the ball bearing and rotation of the wheel only over the balls in the ball bearing. You can skip this using the glue but than you won't be able to remove wheel fromthe axle.

Use spring, plate and secure pin to secure wheel from moving axially.

Additional plate to secure ball bearing from detaching from the wheel can be added too (it is not shown on the drawing). This could also be done using strong glue.

Wheels should also have aerodynamic covers from both sides to improve aerodynamics.

Image

I also made one very simple design (easy to make using CAD) of the car with all necessary elements (hope i didn't skip something from the reg.)

Image

mjmurphy
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Thanks again manchild,

I have been looking at F1 cars from the 80's and 90's that have done well at Monza. Let me know which one(s) you think work well.

Williams FW07
Williams FW07B
Ferrari T3
Ferrari T4
McLaren MP4/2
McLaren MP4/3
Williams FW11
Williams FW11B
McLaren MP4/6
McLaren MP4/7
McLaren MP4/8
McLaren MP4/9
Williams FW14B
Williams FW15
Williams FW16
Last edited by mjmurphy on 05 Jun 2005, 06:09, edited 1 time in total.

mjmurphy
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Also, is there anyone out there that can help me in determining the best angle for the cartridge? Thanks in advance,

Mitch

Monstrobolaxa
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Location: Covilhã, Portugal (and sometimes in Évora)

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The best cartridge angle is....0º (paralel to the road).

Like mentioned previously...the lowest drag cars are the cars used to brake the land speed record....F1 cars are relativly high drag cars! Winning at Monza isn't only due to aerodynamics engine power is another important aspect of the performance!

manchild
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Thanks for clearing out cartridge angle Monstro. :wink:

The problem he has with design is in regulations. The winner is not just the fastest car but the other issues like complexity, resemblance etc. are graded and than you get overall score including the speed of the car.

The regulations also impose that car must have sidepods of certain dimensions including wings (that is why I graw that ugly neutral sidepod-wing). :lol:…it is said in reg. that there must be a flat space of certain dimensions for a number sticker.

Even more, regulations also mention cockpit as an additional feature that probably gets better rates to overall design.

To be honest, regulations suck, for they seam to be written by someone who wasn't sure whether he is organizing scale model competition or pure speed competition Who ever makes nice scale model will definitely loose for car with great resemblance with an actual F1 car won’t be able to get even close with speed to racers similar to cars used to break the land speed records. Weight and aero of car with great resemblance with an actual F1 will kill any chances for great speed of such concept. :roll:

If it only can be know how is the grading done. Perahaps slow car with superb resemblance can get more points than ugly speed breaker :?:

manchild
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mjmurphy wrote:Thanks again manchild,

I have been looking at F1 cars from the 80's and 90's that have done well at Monza. Let me know which one(s) you think work well....
Choose any of the mid-late '80s cars. Early '80s cars are ground effect cars with good downforce and bad aero, while some of the '90s cars have already raised noses and as I've said your regulations impose at least 160mm (the distance between the two screw eyes) with overall lenght limited to 210mm.

What I'm saying is that high nose car would cause you difficulties reagarding positioning of front screw eye and high noses are just like sidepod wings of ground effect cars - used to improve downforce, not the aerodynamics.

mjmurphy
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Thanks again,

Another thing, should I use front wing endplates to direct the air to the inside or outside of the wheels?

manchild
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That depends on dimensions imposed in regulations. Position of wheels depends on overall body width (min 60 max 85 mm) and wings are limited too (min50 max65 mm). So first think of body and than add wings later, for you don't need to think how to create downforce.

In general try making aero as neutral as possible, just focusing on pure efficiency.

Anyway, I'd say that you should direct air inside the wheels having in mind how this racer might probably look, function...

mjmurphy
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Ok, well do the endplates reduce drag? Also, if I am going to make a cockpit, should I use something similar to the front 'ears' used on the Renault R25 to provide better airflow management around the cockpit area? Also should I use front barge boards like those on the Ferrari F2005 so that the air that passes through the front wing is diverted under and outside the chassis to increase the efficiency of the bottom of the car? Also, will the shape of the bottom of the car influence drag? Also, should the rear wing be placed as low and far back as possible or opposite? And should I use rear-wing endplates like those on the Renault R24? Another thing, should I use front axle barge boards like those on the Ferrari F2004? It seems like airflow management will play a vital role in drag....