2023 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

[Just_a_fan]

Lewis likely cares about racing and his off track social causes equally, which is exactly why he will be staying. Mercedes and F1 give him a global platform that is hard to find elsewhere. He is the Tiger Woods of motorsports, so F1 and Merc have every reason to entice him to stay and he doesn’t need to play by the same silly season timetable as all the other drivers, perhaps except Max. I’m sure the contract negotiations are around getting Mercedes to maximize support to any cause he champions

As long LH is fine with not winning another WDC and taking a big pay cut, I am sure he will hang around for a few more years. Having said that golf and F1 are very different sports, and one can still dream about winning PGA at the age of 50, whereas the oldest F1 driver to have won a WDC in the past 30 years is Nigel Mansell at the age of 39 back in 1992.
LH is 38 this year and realistically he is unlikely to be able to challenge RBR+Max in 2024 or even 2025 unless with FIA help. I think LH will likely head to America after F1 to continue his motorsports career.

If he has a car that gives him a chance to compete, he'll compete and he'll put Max under pressure.

As for age, we can definitely say that Hamilton is better physical shape today than Mansell ever was. Mansell would have been stronger, probably, having spent most of his career driving unassisted-steering cars, but other than that, the current drivers are world class athletes as well as world class drivers.

[CHT]

Lewis likely cares about racing and his off track social causes equally, which is exactly why he will be staying. Mercedes and F1 give him a global platform that is hard to find elsewhere. He is the Tiger Woods of motorsports, so F1 and Merc have every reason to entice him to stay and he doesn’t need to play by the same silly season timetable as all the other drivers, perhaps except Max. I’m sure the contract negotiations are around getting Mercedes to maximize support to any cause he champions

As long LH is fine with not winning another WDC and taking a big pay cut, I am sure he will hang around for a few more years. Having said that golf and F1 are very different sports, and one can still dream about winning PGA at the age of 50, whereas the oldest F1 driver to have won a WDC in the past 30 years is Nigel Mansell at the age of 39 back in 1992.
LH is 38 this year and realistically he is unlikely to be able to challenge RBR+Max in 2024 or even 2025 unless with FIA help. I think LH will likely head to America after F1 to continue his motorsports career.

If he has a car that gives him a chance to compete, he'll compete and he'll put Max under pressure.

As for age, we can definitely say that Hamilton is better physical shape today than Mansell ever was. Mansell would have been stronger, probably, having spent most of his career driving unassisted-steering cars, but other than that, the current drivers are world class athletes as well as world class drivers.

We are not comparing drivers from a different era, but comparing drivers during their time, ie. today's world-class athletes and drivers in their 20s vs those 40s. In the history of F1, the most common age to win WDC is in the 20s or 30s. Hardly anyone ever wins their WDC in their 40s. This could be due to a combination of factors, such as risk appetite, salary, and limited options. A good example is MS, who came back from retirement in his 40s. When driving alongside Nico, MS was never able to outshine his younger less experience teammate.

For LH, his only chance of winning a WDC is if Merc can give him a can that is superior to the rest, as I think an "equal" car will not be sufficient to mount a challenge against a team like RBR + Max, who is now at his prime.

Looking at LH driving today, he is more like a gentleman and ambassador, rather than a ruthless fighter like Max we see today.

[CHT]

Teams such as Mclaren should be familiar with ground effect as well. They are still at the same team that won with Alain Prost and Senna. I am sure all the technical know how and data are still kept in their database

the designers of the original 80s GE cars are either retired or dead. there is no way mclaren could've applied anything from the 80s to the current gen.

yep, and even if the data from back then still existed (if it ever did), everything has changes so much it wouldn't be applicable.

No about copying the design, but the process and methodology of simulating downforce in wind tunnel.

[AR3-GP]

Wasn't it said that Rory Byrne consulted for Ferrari on the '22 car? People are still around.

[CHT]

Wasn't it said that Rory Byrne consulted for Ferrari on the '22 car? People are still around.

Correct me if I am wrong I always have the idea that Merc's greatest strength is in engine and chassis design and their weakest link is perhaps in Aero. somehow Merc just doesn't have the nice curvy flow as RBR,

[zibby43]

The bouncing returning with these upgrades is super concerning.

Lewis and Toto aren’t lying about it either. You can see the car bouncing on the straights and in the high speed corners. As soon as they add downforce to this package, the bouncing comes back.

[PlatinumZealot]

Quite new to this however I'd like to ask, what in particular makes the W14 a much better performing car relative to others when it's low fuel?

Ride height is the biggest effect in these ground effect cars. But also the contact patch size and tyretemperature. The contact patch is affected by the tyre pressure and the load on the tyre. Formula 1 suspensions are actually very interesting in that even though the car may be 90 kilograms lighter after fuel is burnt off, the ride-height barely gets higher, but the pitch of the car can change though. So I reckon these factors are tuned in a away to bias the sweet spot to the end of the stint.

[AR3-GP]

Quite new to this however I'd like to ask, what in particular makes the W14 a much better performing car relative to others when it's low fuel?

Ride height is the biggest effect in these ground effect cars. But also the contact patch size and tyretemperature. The contact patch is affected by the tyre pressure and the load on the tyre. Formula 1 suspensions are actually very interesting in that even though the car may be 90 kilograms lighter after fuel is burnt off, the ride-height barely gets higher, but the pitch of the car can change though. So I reckon these factors are tuned in a away to bias the sweet spot to the end of the stint.

It has also been suggested that there is a negative effect on the balance as a result of the high fuel weight distribution.

[Willy]

Quite new to this however I'd like to ask, what in particular makes the W14 a much better performing car relative to others when it's low fuel?

Ride height is the biggest effect in these ground effect cars. But also the contact patch size and tyretemperature. The contact patch is affected by the tyre pressure and the load on the tyre. Formula 1 suspensions are actually very interesting in that even though the car may be 90 kilograms lighter after fuel is burnt off, the ride-height barely gets higher, but the pitch of the car can change though. So I reckon these factors are tuned in a away to bias the sweet spot to the end of the stint.

It's not a phenomenon of W14. It's an outlier in Hungary. A lot also depends upon what strategy others around are doing.

[DGP123]

For LH, his only chance of winning a WDC is if Merc can give him a can that is superior to the rest, as I think an "equal" car will not be sufficient to mount a challenge against a team like RBR + Max, who is now at his prime.

Looking at LH driving today, he is more like a gentleman and ambassador, rather than a ruthless fighter like Max we see today.

Nonsense. That equal car line you’ve copied from Marko, post weekend.

[F1Krof]

Quite new to this however I'd like to ask, what in particular makes the W14 a much better performing car relative to others when it's low fuel?

Ride height is the biggest effect in these ground effect cars. But also the contact patch size and tyretemperature. The contact patch is affected by the tyre pressure and the load on the tyre. Formula 1 suspensions are actually very interesting in that even though the car may be 90 kilograms lighter after fuel is burnt off, the ride-height barely gets higher, but the pitch of the car can change though. So I reckon these factors are tuned in a away to bias the sweet spot to the end of the stint.

It's not a phenomenon of W14. It's an outlier in Hungary. A lot also depends upon what strategy others around are doing.

https://f1pace.com/p/2023-belgian-gp-ra ... box_2.webp

https://f1pace.com/p/2023-hungarian-gp- ... box_2.webp

https://f1pace.com/p/2023-british-gp-ra ... box_2.webp

https://f1pace.com/p/2023-austrian-gp-r ... box_2.webp

https://f1pace.com/p/2023-canadian-gp-r ... box_2.webp

The charts very good and informative.

[dans79]

[PlatinumZealot]

Ride height is the biggest effect in these ground effect cars. But also the contact patch size and tyretemperature. The contact patch is affected by the tyre pressure and the load on the tyre. Formula 1 suspensions are actually very interesting in that even though the car may be 90 kilograms lighter after fuel is burnt off, the ride-height barely gets higher, but the pitch of the car can change though. So I reckon these factors are tuned in a away to bias the sweet spot to the end of the stint.

It's not a phenomenon of W14. It's an outlier in Hungary. A lot also depends upon what strategy others around are doing.

https://f1pace.com/p/2023-belgian-gp-ra ... box_2.webp

https://f1pace.com/p/2023-hungarian-gp- ... box_2.webp

https://f1pace.com/p/2023-british-gp-ra ... box_2.webp

https://f1pace.com/p/2023-austrian-gp-r ... box_2.webp

https://f1pace.com/p/2023-canadian-gp-r ... box_2.webp

The charts very good and informative.

Clean air has a big effect on the average laptimes as you can see. The bottom end of the boxes is a good indicator of the true pace of the car.

[omegacel71]

https://formu1a.uno/aggiornamenti-merce ... -maggiori/

This article is saying that the porpoising is mainly a setup issue

[Farnborough]

https://formu1a.uno/aggiornamenti-merce ... -maggiori/

This article is saying that the porpoising is mainly a setup issue

Technically yes it is, raise the car to stop the cycle looping into amplified vertical travel and it goes away, then it's slow.

Exactly the conundrum they started with in 2022.