2023 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, Sep 01 - 03

[Just_a_fan]

Watch the 2019 incident again, as far as I can tell there is no clear contact.

As far as "the outcome shouldn't matter", I think that's a misunderstanding on your part. The severity of the collision must be taken into account. Every brush up and close call that doesn't result in damage obviously doesn't yield a penalty, these are not big enough collisions to deserve a penalty. But if you hit someone hard enough to take their front wing off, and you are predominantly at fault, that is obviously deserving of a penalty. Leclerc didn't cause any damage, it's not even clear there was contact, the same cannot be said for Lewis.

They didn't touch because Hamilton took to the grass to avoid the contact. Had he stayed where he was as Piastri did, there would have been contact and, entirely possibly, one or both of them would have received damage.

If Piastri had taken to the grass as Hamilton did in 2019, would you have been happy with Hamilton just receiving a black and white flag warning?

Yes, provided it wasn't so blatant a squeeze that it proves impossible to control the car for the guy getting squeezed. But if it's just half a wheel on the grass and he keeps going I'm fine with a BW flag.

What about half a car on the grass?

[Just_a_fan]

Of course, I wasn't trying to imply anything, just some numbers thrown out.

And even with that high top speed he couldn't get close enough to overtake. Amazing really, but then that's DRS trains sadly.

[Just_a_fan]

Except Russell got a penalty and Sainz didn't ( ).

Why is that funny? Inconsistent stewarding has ruined many a race over the years and being shouted about by most fans at some point.

[hollus]

13249 RPM. !!!

Really surprised about Hamilton
Overtake button + double DRS maybe ?
Do you have an onboard footage

https://streamable.com/vqjkx3

Highest speeds of the race:
ham 359 kmh
Per & Gas 356 kmh
Lec 355 kmh

That's the result of various tows and O/T. In the same car driven basically in clean air for much of the race (once Perez got by he was gone), Russell's top speed was only 334.4km/h. Likewise, the high top speeds for some at the end of sector 2 were also thanks to DRS.

Of course, I wasn't trying to imply anything, just some numbers thrown out.

[AR3-GP]

Except Russell got a penalty and Sainz didn't ( ).

Why is that funny? Inconsistent stewarding has ruined many a race over the years and being shouted about by most fans at some point.

You are missing the inside joke between dialtone and I. He will know what I'm referring to

[Juzh]

13249 RPM. !!!

Saw that car with shortest gearing reaches highest speed More evidence these ratios simply aren't important anymore.
gotta remember this clip next time someone tries to tell me f1 cars are limited to 12.5 or 13k

[Oleo]

Leclerc literally did this again with Perez in lap 31 this year. Not as extreme as 2019, but definately comparable to Ham Pia. Although the overtaking party was different, so slightly different situation. Still one car width space needs to be given when a car is alongside.

[Farnborough]

13249 RPM. !!!

Saw that car with shortest gearing reaches highest speed More evidence these ratios simply aren't important anymore.
gotta remember this clip next time someone tries to tell me f1 cars are limited to 12.5 or 13k

Is there comparable with Albon when absolutely flat out ? Looks like another unintended consequence of drag data going toward W13 concept that may have seriously capped the far reaches of performance. Obviously only sometimes used at those elevated track speed, but could be significant influence in the areas that LH indicated that the RB was so fast when it went past him earlier in season. Seems like Williams and others may not have that artificial capping in their overall ratio strategy.

[AMG.Tzan]

Keeping your race alive isn't only about making clean overtakes! It's also avoiding certain crashes and living to fight another day...

I don't disagree. But why can't you see that same logic applies to Lewis and how he chose to complete that overtake by cutting across Piastri? It was a huge risk (and completely unnecessary), and it put him as the responsible party if anything went wrong.

Everything applies to everyone!

I mean he instantly apologized on the radio and afterwards to Piastri himself and he got a 5 second penalty! What else do you expect from him? Tell me another driver that has apologized in a similar situation!

He was in the blind spot he said so that’s why he cut across…it was just a slight movement to the right not even “cutting across”!

[dialtone]

Leclerc literally did this again with Perez in lap 31 this year. Not as extreme as 2019, but definately comparable to Ham Pia. Although the overtaking party was different, so slightly different situation. Still one car width space needs to be given when a car is alongside.

Perez was not alongside. You have to be inside the wheelspan to be reasonably alongside and gain the right for space.

[ringo]

I’m with you that it’s LH’s fault but you are taking it way out of proportion. He already said it was his mistake and gave no fault to Piastri and went to apoligize. This issue is done. S*** happens.

That Merc is somewhat taking advantage of the 5s penalty is preposterous. We should have a tin foil hat forum topic. I’m no fan of theirs but c’mon.

Yes a lot of "moaning" from some corners in the words of Toto.
As for overtaking vs overtaken in the above posts.. it doesn't matter. Piastri was attacking and Lewis was attacking in both cases. Don't see why some go to the extent which they do. The guy was punished and even apologized and admitted he was wrong. Yet it's like some want him to lose his super license and get a race ban.

[ringo]

They didn't touch because Hamilton took to the grass to avoid the contact. Had he stayed where he was as Piastri did, there would have been contact and, entirely possibly, one or both of them would have received damage.

If Piastri had taken to the grass as Hamilton did in 2019, would you have been happy with Hamilton just receiving a black and white flag warning?

Yes, provided it wasn't so blatant a squeeze that it proves impossible to control the car for the guy getting squeezed. But if it's just half a wheel on the grass and he keeps going I'm fine with a BW flag.

What about half a car on the grass?
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/ ... tember.jpg

Fact supported with pictures. Don't worry, this is not enough to make the incidents anyway comparable.
Yes Hamilton squeezed onto the grass, by Leclerc looking over on him and intentionally squeezing.
Yes some say Leclerc did not know Lewis was there. No penalties is fine in their books!

[Spoutnik]

[TFSA]

Fact supported with pictures. Don't worry, this is not enough to make the incidents anyway comparable.
Yes Hamilton squeezed onto the grass, by Leclerc looking over on him and intentionally squeezing.
Yes some say Leclerc did not know Lewis was there. No penalties is fine in their books!

Leclerc is literally looking away from Lewis in that picture....
He's looking to his left at the corner.


Edit: I just went and rewatched it. Leclerc was looking to his left the entire time, and not just at the moment this picture was taken.

[Cs98]

What about half a car on the grass?
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/ ... tember.jpg

It's fine, BW flag. The car briefly touched the grass before going back on the kerb. Both Leclerc and Lewis were lucky it was there. Evading someone cutting across in a braking zone isn't exactly risk free in and of itself.