Silly season 2024-2025

[ME4ME]

I don't really see why Williams would jump ship for Honda. Aston did it to gain manufacturer-backed status. For Williams it would be a risk, just as it would be to Mclaren. Stella described it well imo earlier this year:

“If we look at our limitations, they have nothing to do with the power unit,” said Stella. “I think they are much more fundamental, and that's where I would like to keep the focus.

“Ideally you are a works team, but with an established power unit manufacturer,” he said.

“Then there's being a customer with an established [manufacturer], or joining a new partnership, but it comes with some elements of risk.

“In 2026 we want to be there [at the front]. We don't want to be saying: 'Okay, now we need more years because the project is too immature.'

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/mcla ... /10482700/

Regardless of Honda, I think Yuki could indeed be a viable option for Williams if indeed Yuki was left without a seat at Red Bull / Alpha Tauri. Schumacher too, but like a wrote earlier he's in that "mediocre" league too. Did he really do any better than what Seargent is currently doing?

Thinking a bit more about this, Williams might indeed be pressed to find a better 2nd driver quickly. Imagine Hamilton not signing or going elsewere: Mercedes would pay off Williams and sign their top driver in an instant, just like in the past. Vowles wouldn't like it, be I doubt he would stand in the way for Albon to get a chance in a top team.

At this point, even Ricciardo could be on the market. Williams could hope to sign him, if at the right cost.

[FW17]

Is Schumacher in contention for Zhou's seat next year?

[ringo]

Lewis turned round and said the McLaren looks like a Red Bull. Yet to see any resemblance there.

I mean if its all because Merc haven't give him a car that isn't capable of putting it on the top step of the podium then it seems a bit of a 'bitter' way to try and negotiate a contract. Maybe there's a BIG win/podium bonus attached to his contract and it hasn't been paying. I cant see the likes of Verstappen and Lewis getting 40million a year if they always finishing 4th or 5th each season. I dare bet that 40million is made up of win bonuses etc. Say a base contract of 20million a year, and the remaining 20million is split between 20-odd races each season.

He was on base salary + result bonus before, I believe he wanted to go to "all in the salary" as there hasn't been much result bonus available. That's going to be talking point for lots of reasons.

Likely the sticking point. The article someone posted before in the Merc thread? said that Toto and Lewis use that 'Penny' as they dont like talking money between friends.
So it would seem, in my opinion, that Mercedes aren't going to be paying top dollar for a driver that's not putting it on the top step of the podium any more. Toto/Merc might have said, Look Lewis, we aren't getting the wins, as the cars not properly competitive with Red Bull, so we dont think your worth the £40million/year to finish P4-6 with the occasional podium thrown in the mix. George is on £8m/year and Lewis near enough 5x that amount. Its a lot to spend on a driver getting an occasional podium over the last 2 seasons. Of course there's the fan base and budget the marketing brings aswell from Lewis.

Tough one - clearly Lewis isn't happy with the offer Mercedes have come back with - which is going to be based marginally on the results the team are having. Lewis thinks i'm worth this much, Mercedes say X amount less. Makes perfect sense if he wanted to move away from base + results style to a full salary. As irrespective of whether he come first or 10th all season, he would get the same money being on a 'all in' contract.

Thing is....who would want to pay £40million/year for Lewis. That's the big question. Only the likes of Ferrari - but I cant see them spending twice what they paying Charles for Lewis coming to the end of his career.

Hamilton is a 7 x WDC. That a lone warrants a top salary. When Alonso has been racing in the midfield, why didn't you question him still being a top earner despite no results and just 2 WDC from 2006?
There should be more respect and recognition coming from long term F-1 fans towards Hamilton. He is not a rookie, nor a journey man. He doesn't need performance clauses to demand the highest salary in the sport.
He's the most successful F-1 pilot of all time, and has earned formula 1 more money over his 16 years from his fan following alone than F-1 can ever compensate him for. The day Hamilton quits F-1, that's the day F-1 loses 50% of its fans. Even his detractors watch formula one to see him not win.
It is rumoured he is getting 50 million per year. I do not know how media arise at this figure, but it's not surprising and makes a lot of sense, given Liberty's growing viewership around the world. More reasons for Mercedes to compensate Hamilton more.

[organic]

Zhou may have renewed for 2024

According to our information,Guanyu Zhou's situation has been resolved and the young Chinese driver is about to extend his contract until 2024. In recent weeks, several drivers (not just F2 drivers) have been in talks to replace him.Unfortunately for them, the door is about to close

[Zynerji]

He was on base salary + result bonus before, I believe he wanted to go to "all in the salary" as there hasn't been much result bonus available. That's going to be talking point for lots of reasons.

Likely the sticking point. The article someone posted before in the Merc thread? said that Toto and Lewis use that 'Penny' as they dont like talking money between friends.
So it would seem, in my opinion, that Mercedes aren't going to be paying top dollar for a driver that's not putting it on the top step of the podium any more. Toto/Merc might have said, Look Lewis, we aren't getting the wins, as the cars not properly competitive with Red Bull, so we dont think your worth the £40million/year to finish P4-6 with the occasional podium thrown in the mix. George is on £8m/year and Lewis near enough 5x that amount. Its a lot to spend on a driver getting an occasional podium over the last 2 seasons. Of course there's the fan base and budget the marketing brings aswell from Lewis.

Tough one - clearly Lewis isn't happy with the offer Mercedes have come back with - which is going to be based marginally on the results the team are having. Lewis thinks i'm worth this much, Mercedes say X amount less. Makes perfect sense if he wanted to move away from base + results style to a full salary. As irrespective of whether he come first or 10th all season, he would get the same money being on a 'all in' contract.

Thing is....who would want to pay £40million/year for Lewis. That's the big question. Only the likes of Ferrari - but I cant see them spending twice what they paying Charles for Lewis coming to the end of his career.

Hamilton is a 7 x WDC. That a lone warrants a top salary. When Alonso has been racing in the midfield, why didn't you question him still being a top earner despite no results and just 2 WDC from 2006?
There should be more respect and recognition coming from long term F-1 fans towards Hamilton. He is not a rookie, nor a journey man. He doesn't need performance clauses to demand the highest salary in the sport.
He's the most successful F-1 pilot of all time, and has earned formula 1 more money over his 16 years from his fan following alone than F-1 can ever compensate him for. The day Hamilton quits F-1, that's the day F-1 loses 50% of its fans. Even his detractors watch formula one to see him not win.
It is rumoured he is getting 50 million per year. I do not know how media arise at this figure, but it's not surprising and makes a lot of sense, given Liberty's growing viewership around the world. More reasons for Mercedes to compensate Hamilton more.

Meh.

What has he done, lately? Having the best car and engine combo for YEARS then entitles a driver to charge more in the future? Is that a lottery win, or what?

Hamilton is a great. Probably the GOAT.

That doesn't override the fact that anyone driving his car from 2014-2021 would have won WCC as well. So it's really not that special.

[ringo]

I see your reasoning but to put perspective and show why you are not accounting for many factors then why did Alonso stay the most highly paid driver even when he stopped winning championships?
Ferrari was paying him over 30 million or so per year i believe.
I would love to hear your answer.

And remember anyone driving a redbull in 2010 to 2013 and 2021 to 2023 would be a champion as well. So clearly the compensation is not solely based on delivering what the car can.

Top drivers get paid highly so they do not fall into the hands of a rival. That's just one thing you did not factor. There are many more.
Hamilton falling to ferrari or redbull is a dream for those teams and a disaster for Mercedes.

[Zynerji]

I see your reasoning but to put perspective and show why you are not accounting for many factors then why did Alonso stay the most highly paid driver even when he stopped winning championships?
Ferrari was paying him over 30 million or so per year i believe.
I would love to hear your answer.

Ferrari knew their car shouldn't even be close to those RBR's and Nando came close to stealing it all on pure talent, only to lose through trash strategy.

That's EZ money. He was the team MVP.

PS. Put Lando and George (young, mature, hungry, non-champions)in that Mercedes from 2025, and the team improves. True story.

[ringo]

I have asked Google Bard AI to make a list of the top salaries each year since 2001.

. The results are interesting. You can see where winning does matter and recent success. What is not shown is Alonso being paid 40 million by Mclaren for his whole time there since his return. Clearly it's for some reason he is paid this amount. Was it deserved? McLaren must know why they paid so much.

Year Driver Salary (USD)
2000 Michael Schumacher $30 million
2001 Michael Schumacher $31 million
2002 Michael Schumacher $32 million
2003 Michael Schumacher $33 million
2004 Michael Schumacher $34 million
2005 Fernando Alonso $25 million
2006 Fernando Alonso $27 million
2007 Kimi Räikkönen $20 million
2008 Lewis Hamilton $15 million
2009 Lewis Hamilton $17 million
2010 Fernando Alonso $20 million
2011 Sebastian Vettel $25 million
2012 Sebastian Vettel $30 million
2013 Sebastian Vettel $35 million
2014 Sebastian Vettel $40 million
2015 Lewis Hamilton $45 million
2016 Lewis Hamilton $50 million
2017 Lewis Hamilton $52 million
2018 Lewis Hamilton $55 million
2019 Lewis Hamilton $56 million
2020 Lewis Hamilton $66 million
2021 Lewis Hamilton $62 million
2022 Max Verstappen $58 million

[ringo]

Meh.

What has he done, lately? Having the best car and engine combo for YEARS then entitles a driver to charge more in the future? Is that a lottery win, or what?

Hamilton is a great. Probably the GOAT.

That doesn't override the fact that anyone driving his car from 2014-2021 would have won WCC as well. So it's really not that special.

Look on the list i posted and look what you asked in bold. You noticed what's happening for shumach and Vettel? And even alonso?
Rising salaries for exactly what you asked.
And even with relatively poor performance these guys kept asking for more.
Hamilton has the smallest incremental gain each year apart from 2021 which was set after the end of 2020.
Your reasoning for Alonso isnt a very strong reason. Maybe there is some bias to your views.
Alonso had no business getting 40 million from mclaren vs Button. He had no reason to be getting paid that well. He wasnt thar much better than Button. Even his years at ferrari.
2010 was 40 million and after losing to vettel 41 million in 2011. It declined to 26.6 in 2013 still at ferrari. So they soon realized he could not deliver for them. Or maybe due to performance clauses in the contract.
My point is you cannot say that the most decorated driver in the sport cannot demand the best pay each year. There is an expectation from the teams even when that driver has a bad year. A lot comes with the notches on the belt.

[Just_a_fan]

Thread descends in to a driver trashing/defending match. Yay, great.

[Zynerji]

Thread descends in to a driver trashing/defending match. Yay, great.

New here?

[organic]

Booo boring

[organic]

I think Sergio has been replaced by Daniel based on rumours from paddock this evening

[franbatista123]

Holy cow!

[taperoo2k]

I think Sergio has been replaced by Daniel based on rumours from paddock this evening

There's a couple of rumours doing the rounds from what I could see on twitter. I think the Sergio being replaced rumour is the more likely one.

Real Silly Season stuff which might just be wild speculation, so take with a massive pinch of salt.
Lance retiring due to back issues, Stroll Snr selling the team to Saudi Arabia, either it's public investment fund or
Aramco. Sergio retiring or moving to AMR. Alonso retiring and so on.

Really wild rumour - Danny Ric replacing Sergio this season, I can't see Red Bull being that brutal. Though if Horner isn't lying about the RB20 not being developed as much as they'd like due to the cost cap punishment, they'll be wanting to get the second driver issue sorted pronto. An underdeveloped RB20 might face stiffer competition from the likes of Mercedes and McLaren. Just because the RB19 has been all conquering doesn't mean the RB20 will be, convergence appears to be happening design wise.