Which team is most likely to catch redbull before 2026 discussion

[TFSA]

I do not see this.
With budget cap and engine freeze they have simply lost their mojo.

Ironically, i think Hamilton is a kind of obstacle to them getting it back.

He keeps demanding changes when they disappoint, and complaining that they don't listen to him. And while driver feedback is important, he's not an engineer. I honestly think that the way he tries to pressure their engineering department is a detriment to their development.

He should stick to driving. That's what he is good at.

[BlueCheetah66]

Mercedes ofcourse. If Mclaren can make huge gains so can they. They have dropped the zero pod. They will know what works by now. They’ll have a contender next year when they have redesigned the monoque and suspension.

I do not see this.
With budget cap and engine freeze they have simply lost their mojo.

If we speak about "most likely" it is "most likely" that everything goes on as now. This means McLaren is making steps, maybe even Ferrari is back in the game. But "most likely" it is McLaren going the path they obviously go.

Ironically, i think Hamilton is a kind of obstacle to them getting it back.

He keeps demanding changes when they disappoint, and complaining that they don't listen to him. And while driver feedback is important, he's not an engineer. I honestly think that the way he tries to pressure their engineering department is a detriment to their development.

He should stick to driving. That's what he is good at.

Claims like this can only really be substantiated with time. For all we know, Mercedes could be competing with Red Bull next year and Hamilton's pressure on the rest of the team can be seen as a good thing. If we are being honest, If the driver feedback directly control philosophy direction and it fails, I see that more as a failure of the senior personnel within team

[chrisc90]

What would people estimate the current gap to RB is to the rest of the other teams?

[KimiRai]

Due to recency bias you could say McLaren just like you would have said Aston Martin at the start of the year. It's an extremely difficult prediction. You could make a pretty good case why each of the big teams and even some of the medium sized teams could do it. Personally I can't choose which one.

[TFSA]

Claims like this can only really be substantiated with time. For all we know, Mercedes could be competing with Red Bull next year and Hamilton's pressure on the rest of the team can be seen as a good thing.

The entire point of this thread is to speculate - so i don't see why you would single out my comment.

Everything in this thread can only be substantiated with time.

[AR3-GP]

Norris said the new wind tunnel will allow McLaren to work more efficiently. “There’s nothing wrong with what we have now,” he said. “It’s just the rate of development and being able to literally just go next door, understand something and figure it out and come back and adjust it and go straight back in.
“We can probably do 10 more things in a day than we can if we’re using what we have now. So a bit of it is maybe some small things in performance, but it’s also just efficiency of work. And a lot of what Formula 1 is now is efficiency of work. Time, money put into things and then seeing the results straight away. And that’s what we’re getting from the new wind tunnel.”

How Mclaren have gotten to where they are now without an on-site windtunnel is incredible...and ominous...
https://www.racefans.net/2023/09/29/nor ... dominance/

[Cs98]

Merc. Look at the level RB are operating at now. The driving, the design, the strategy, pit crew. Ending the domination of Merc required them to become the best at everything, no real weaknesses. The chances of McLaren or Ferrari getting to that stage just feel incredibly slim. Even if they get the car right that's not even half the job done to unseat RB. Merc is the only other team that has shown it can dominate and operate at a high level in all these categories in the last decade. The chance of a resurgence is slim, but they are realistically the only team that can put up a challenge over an entire season. It'll take a mighty car and a lot of luck.

Mclaren pit crew gives RB a run for their money. Mclaren drivers are promising as well. They have the most windtunnel hours and Mclaren is well...Mclaren...a championship winning team.

McLaren used to be a winning team, that was ages ago. Winning culture doesn't just stick around for decades.

[scuderiabrandon]

McLaren are in the same group behind Red Bull (Ferrari/Mercedes/Aston) where the track decides where they rank in the pecking order that weekend. Unfortunately that won't enough to compete with Red Bull over an entire season. They've made huge strides but they've done that by out developing two teams that can't really develop due to poor architectural decisions and still at certain venues are behind them. Yes that's not their fault but next season when Ferrari/Mercedes do make those changes that get rid of these constraints, who knows what kind of steps they could take aswell.

I don't think it is unreasonable to assume they are much closer to their 2024 form than either Ferrari or Mercedes. I would never count McLaren out though.

[KimiRai]

How Mclaren have gotten to where they are now without an on-site windtunnel is incredible...and ominous...
https://www.racefans.net/2023/09/29/nor ... dominance/

Your usage of ellipsis makes it all the more dramatic But sure, McLaren why not. If it can't be my favourite team, I'd settle for them coming back to winning ways.

[PlatinumZealot]

I want to hear everyone’s thoughts on who you think is mostly to catch/surpass redbull before 2026 if at all.

McLaren seems to have figured out these rules. Hope they go back to silver and rocket red.. (even orange would be a good sub forthe red).

[CHT]

Merc. Look at the level RB are operating at now. The driving, the design, the strategy, pit crew. Ending the domination of Merc required them to become the best at everything, no real weaknesses. The chances of McLaren or Ferrari getting to that stage just feel incredibly slim. Even if they get the car right that's not even half the job done to unseat RB. Merc is the only other team that has shown it can dominate and operate at a high level in all these categories in the last decade. The chance of a resurgence is slim, but they are realistically the only team that can put up a challenge over an entire season. It'll take a mighty car and a lot of luck.

Mclaren pit crew gives RB a run for their money. Mclaren drivers are promising as well. They have the most windtunnel hours and Mclaren is well...Mclaren...a championship winning team.

McLaren used to be a winning team, that was ages ago. Winning culture doesn't just stick around for decades.

McLaren decline actually started when they established Mclaren Automotive back in 2010, perhaps running the company too thin and subsequently a split from Merc partnership. In today's standard, I don't think they are considered as one of the most well funded team, perhaps the best of the rest behind Ferrari Redbull and Merc.

[AR3-GP]

Mclaren has so so many windtunnel and CFD hours. They have more windtunnel hours than cars that are slower than them (Ferrari, Mercedes, Aston) and it will remain this way until July of 2024.

I really think they are going to win races on merit next year. Maybe not a championship, but a few races that suit their car more than rival teams

[CHT]

Mclaren has so so many windtunnel and CFD hours. They have more windtunnel hours than cars that are slower than them (Ferrari, Mercedes, Aston) and it will remain this way until July of 2024.

I really think they are going to win races on merit next year. Maybe not a championship, but a few races that suit their car more than rival teams

They are ahead of Merc for sure and having 2 young drivers, they will only get better next year.

[Spoutnik]

I think Ferrari will make a big step.
They know their flaws. The mood is quite high at Maranello, espacially compared to the beginning of the year/or at Brackley...
Track like this or Suzuka would've been a disaster for the SF23 "A" now Leclerc has bring P4 and P5. They just can't go further on the improvement given this year chassis.
On the engine side they are really good, and they might find some extra horse for next year.
The car still pretty good at start/stop tracks (Singapore, Monza, Spa..).

[organic]

I think McLaren, Ferrari could each be at RB's level at the start of next year