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+1 Great post Vanja - sums up a lot of my feelings that i wasnt able to put downVanja #66 wrote: ↑01 Feb 2024, 19:37Now that we have a de facto confirmation coming from Merc factory, it's worth pointing out a few things.
The most important aspect of this transfer is Hamilton's age. Starting his first season with Ferrari, he will be 40. Is he past his prime? Hard to argue he is still peaking. His 2022 was downright depressing even for those who are not his fans, making his 2023 all the more impressive (and equally disappointing from Russell, who wasn't just unlucky more often, but outright beaten) so why make this move?
At his age and having achieved what he already achieved, it's incredibly hard to keep the focus and motivation as high as necessary to compete with the young guns. Just ask Djoković, Federer and Nadal (although tennis is a much more physical sport than F1) how much it takes... In Motorsport, switching teams is like falling in love again, it's refreshing, intriguing, invigorating, nerve racking - everything it takes to get the blood flowing and energising yourself. Switching teams near the end of a career is possibly a bit like mid-life crisis, but that just means it could make that much bigger difference.
Will Hamilton lose anything with this move? Absolutely not. Even if he gets slammed by Leclerc the way Rosberg slammed Schumi, no one can take away all his achievements so far and let's be honest - that's not really gonna happen. If he wins a few races, he will do it after (most likely) 3 or 4 years since his last win and it will be amazing. If he gets to win the title, he will be glorified all over the world and truly establish himself as the undisputed GOAT.
Will Leclerc lose anything with this move? Absolutely not. Even if he gets slammed by Hamilton, he will be slammed by the most successful F1 driver ever and let's be honest - that's not really gonna happen. If he is realistically about equal overall with a 40-year-old Hamilton past his prime, it will show he's good but should learn what needs to be improved. And if he is better than Hamilton and gets a title with Hamilton as team mate, it will show his greatness and level for all to see and no one could say he just had the best car.
Will Ferrari lose anything with this move? Absolutely not. Even the pay Hamilton will get will be turned into profit with strong merchandising efforts. If Hamilton is better and possibly wins his 8th title with Ferrari, it will be an amazing story and a truly historical moment. If Leclerc is better and possibly wins his 1st title with Hamilton as team mate, it will show Ferrari made the right call in trusting the future of the team to him.
Additionally, with Hamilton onboard Ferrari will get a decent boost of political power (especially in GB), which should not be underestimated. His move will also be a strong nod to all the engineers and other staff Ferrari is hiring and it seems the things are already well in motion. Vasseur has been rebuilding the team quietly and this is a big wing for him internally and externally. Many things will fall in line a lot easier now. Finally, they are dealing a huge blow to one of their big rivals and have most likely effectively taken them out of the future title fights for a while.
As far as they are all concerned - it's a win-win-win situation. Will there be a clear number 1? With a 7-time-champion joining and a long-term committed young prodigy you'd be daft to do it. And the people without the right understanding and awareness of team dynamics are no longer in Ferrari.
Where does this leave Sainz? No idea and I hope he finds a place where he gets the status he so much desires. He should be mindful of how he brings his Maranello tenure to a close, it might just make or break the rest of his career.
Thanks, appreciate it.
I think Leclerc learning from Hamilton is a given in any case, along with Vasseur and the whole team learning from Hamilton. I said last year that bagging Hamilton would be good for the team, but not sure about Hamilton himself. Obviously, he himself is now sure about that. 
Sums up how I see it. The two drivers will be all nice and friendly for the first few races and if the car is any good, it'll soon become a shitshow.jambuka wrote: ↑01 Feb 2024, 20:00Yeah... I don't see the positives of HAM joining Ferrari.
* It will be difficult for Ferrari to build around lead driver LEC(as they say). HAM is not going to settle for 2nd driver position.
* If LEC did not know about HAM move while signing the contract, it will leave a bitter feeling.
* Both will take points of each other in WDC. WCC might be good if car is good.
* Would be hard for HAM to deal with strategy calls/inefficiencies that Ferrari has displayed past couple of seasons with their pit operations
* HAM may find it difficult to portray the image of Ferrari driver that team expects him to(not be critical, outspoken etc...)
Explain me the logic of showing your opponent, engine, chassis, suspension data without signature?S D wrote: ↑01 Feb 2024, 20:18What will be of interest more than the signing is when and why did he sign.
If it's just to close his career with Ferrari
then this is what it is.
If it's because he saw what Merc had in store that's a bad omen, as was seen before.
However, if he saw some Ferrari engine data or data relating to the chassis, aero and suspension improvements, then that is something that will have us on the edge of our seats.
You don't call a 7-time-champ to be a 2nd driver. You also don't rebuild your team around someone who's 40 and past his prime. You sit him down and ask him to share his experience with everyone, including the other driver and give them both the same treatment. You also don't ask him to accept you vision of public image, you figure it out together.jambuka wrote: ↑01 Feb 2024, 20:00Yeah... I don't see the positives of HAM joining Ferrari.
* It will be difficult for Ferrari to build around lead driver LEC(as they say). HAM is not going to settle for 2nd driver position.
* If LEC did not know about HAM move while signing the contract, it will leave a bitter feeling.
* Both will take points of each other in WDC. WCC might be good if car is good.
* Would be hard for HAM to deal with strategy calls/inefficiencies that Ferrari has displayed past couple of seasons with their pit operations
* HAM may find it difficult to portray the image of Ferrari driver that team expects him to(not be critical, outspoken etc...)
This seems like a move on Ferrari's part to sacrifice LEC & HAM both in order to improve its image, political power and brand value. Not that it wasn't already good. I doubt this combo will help them get WDC.
Vanja #66 wrote: ↑01 Feb 2024, 20:59You don't call a 7-time-champ to be a 2nd driver. You also don't rebuild your team around someone who's 40 and past his prime. You sit him down and ask him to share his experience with everyone, including the other driver and give them both the same treatment. You also don't ask him to accept you vision of public image, you figure it out together.jambuka wrote: ↑01 Feb 2024, 20:00Yeah... I don't see the positives of HAM joining Ferrari.
* It will be difficult for Ferrari to build around lead driver LEC(as they say). HAM is not going to settle for 2nd driver position.
* If LEC did not know about HAM move while signing the contract, it will leave a bitter feeling.
* Both will take points of each other in WDC. WCC might be good if car is good.
* Would be hard for HAM to deal with strategy calls/inefficiencies that Ferrari has displayed past couple of seasons with their pit operations
* HAM may find it difficult to portray the image of Ferrari driver that team expects him to(not be critical, outspoken etc...)
This seems like a move on Ferrari's part to sacrifice LEC & HAM both in order to improve its image, political power and brand value. Not that it wasn't already good. I doubt this combo will help them get WDC.
Taking points off each other could be a problem in the WDC fight. Ferrari first needs to step up and join a full-season WDC fight, they haven't done that since 2012. Bringing Hamilton in does not mean they will be the top team, not even close.
Strategy and operations are being dealt with. It's not there yet, but it has been better in the second half of the season. Vasseur has clearly demonstrated he understands what ingredients he needs to rebuild the team to be the top team, does anyone really think he'd overlook the strategy and operations?!?