Christian Horner under Investigation

[RedNEO]

Journalist: “But sir we’ve already said he’s being investigated for controlling behaviour and the news has gone stale, we have nothing!”

Editor: Put sexual in the headline.. bingo! fresh as a daisy!

[Hammerfist]

From what I hear it is Jos Verstappen that strongly dislikes Horner and wants him gone. Doesn't make a lot of sense to me as he is not employed by the team so how can he have so much power? The "fresh allegations" surfaced from a source in the Netherlands though. When the news first came out they did not give specifics but I think many and myself included thought it was a sexual harrassment case. Whenever you hear a woman stepping up against a superior it is almost always sexual harrassment. We do have the "confirmation" now. I don't think Horner escapes this. I feel bad for Geri and his family, but if the evidence is actually there, Horner has to resign.

[denyall]

Red, you're beating two drums all day, innocent until proven guilty and media bias/corporate overloads pushing a narrative for clicks and ad money.

At the end of all this, what it's all true, if the paper has all the evidence they claim? When the evidence comes out and proves that, what say you then? Was it wrong for the paper to publish what they knew to be factual? Are media supposed to sit on their hands and wait until the conclusion of an investigation before writing a story?

[denyall]

Red, you're beating two drums all day, innocent until proven guilty and media bias/corporate overloads pushing a narrative for clicks and ad money.

At the end of all this, what it's all true, if the paper has all the evidence they claim? When the evidence comes out and proves that, what say you then? Was it wrong for the paper to publish what they knew to be factual? Are media supposed to sit on their hands and wait until the conclusion of an investigation before writing a story?

Let somebody accuse you of sexual misconduct and let a paper print it before you get a chance to defend yourself.. you ok with that?

You didn't answer my question.

[RedNEO]

From what I hear it is Jos Verstappen that strongly dislikes Horner and wants him gone. Doesn't make a lot of sense to me as he is not employed by the team so how can he have so much power? The "fresh allegations" surfaced from a source in the Netherlands though. When the news first came out they did not give specifics but I think many and myself included thought it was a sexual harrassment case. Whenever you hear a woman stepping up against a superior it is almost always sexual harrassment. We do have the "confirmation" now. I don't think Horner escapes this. I feel bad for Geri and his family, but if the evidence is actually there, Horner has to resign.

We don’t have any confirmation.. we don’t even have a scrap of evidence. Not even a sliver.

[RedNEO]

Red, you're beating two drums all day, innocent until proven guilty and media bias/corporate overloads pushing a narrative for clicks and ad money.

At the end of all this, what it's all true, if the paper has all the evidence they claim? When the evidence comes out and proves that, what say you then? Was it wrong for the paper to publish what they knew to be factual? Are media supposed to sit on their hands and wait until the conclusion of an investigation before writing a story?

Let somebody accuse you of sexual misconduct and let a paper print it before you get a chance to defend yourself.. you ok with that?

You didn't answer my question.

I’m not sure what question you are even asking? What I’ll say if their is evidence? That’s exactly what I want to see otherwise he’s innocent. Is that clear enough?

Where is the evidence? You just want a paper to print stuff and you just believe they have the evidence because they said so? Where is it then? If you don’t have it just say you don’t have it and we can resume this when you actually have something instead of talking about hypotheticals.

[Hammerfist]

From what I hear it is Jos Verstappen that strongly dislikes Horner and wants him gone. Doesn't make a lot of sense to me as he is not employed by the team so how can he have so much power? The "fresh allegations" surfaced from a source in the Netherlands though. When the news first came out they did not give specifics but I think many and myself included thought it was a sexual harrassment case. Whenever you hear a woman stepping up against a superior it is almost always sexual harrassment. We do have the "confirmation" now. I don't think Horner escapes this. I feel bad for Geri and his family, but if the evidence is actually there, Horner has to resign.

We don’t have any confirmation.. we don’t even have a scrap of evidence. Not even a sliver.

Yeah, which is why I put confirmation in quotes. But if the evidence actually comes out Horner is toast.

[RedNEO]

From what I hear it is Jos Verstappen that strongly dislikes Horner and wants him gone. Doesn't make a lot of sense to me as he is not employed by the team so how can he have so much power? The "fresh allegations" surfaced from a source in the Netherlands though. When the news first came out they did not give specifics but I think many and myself included thought it was a sexual harrassment case. Whenever you hear a woman stepping up against a superior it is almost always sexual harrassment. We do have the "confirmation" now. I don't think Horner escapes this. I feel bad for Geri and his family, but if the evidence is actually there, Horner has to resign.

We don’t have any confirmation.. we don’t even have a scrap of evidence. Not even a sliver.

Yeah, which is why I put confirmation in quotes. But if the evidence actually comes out Horner is toast.

If they had anything it would be out along with these so called allegations the paper upgraded from controlling to sexual and Horner wouldn’t be suing the paper.

[SmallSoldier]

De Telegraaf is not reliable in all aspects but sports. Erik van Haren is extremely close to the Verstappens and Marko. But again, people like you will deflect and refuse to hear anything that might contradict your view.

Agreed , the paper was right when they broke the story in the first place.
Seems some people don't want it to be true and are finding ways to ignore the truth.

What kind of world do some of you live in where you can just accuse someone of something and the accusation is just believed and called the truth without a scrap of evidence or giving that person a chance to defend themselves?

Better hope that doesn’t happen to you one day. I’d love to see the look on your face when roles are reversed.

Horner is taking legal action against the paper telegraaf. I wonder if you still want to confidently accuse him again without evidence.. might be you next that’s taken to court.

You claim that Horner is innocent until proven guilty (which I agree with)… But is very hypocritical to state the journalist / paper is lying without proof that they are.

Both, the ones condemning Horner before having all the facts and those “defending him and calling BS on the allegations without any data are equally wrong

[bagajohny]

Agreed , the paper was right when they broke the story in the first place.
Seems some people don't want it to be true and are finding ways to ignore the truth.

What kind of world do some of you live in where you can just accuse someone of something and the accusation is just believed and called the truth without a scrap of evidence or giving that person a chance to defend themselves?

Better hope that doesn’t happen to you one day. I’d love to see the look on your face when roles are reversed.

Horner is taking legal action against the paper telegraaf. I wonder if you still want to confidently accuse him again without evidence.. might be you next that’s taken to court.

You claim that Horner is innocent until proven guilty (which I agree with)… But is very hypocritical to state the journalist / paper is lying without proof that they are.

Both, the ones condemning Horner before having all the facts and those “defending him and calling BS on the allegations without any data are equally wrong

Finally a sensible comment in the thread. It is clearly stated in the articles that they know the name of the person and they have seen the proof. So calling it BS is not right. When the first time they reported it, it turned out to be credible report. And now they have not taken down the article even after getting sued. So we just need to wait till more things come out.

[SoulPancake13]

No matter what, this whole situation is a huge PR loss for Red Bull. Obviously, there are more important things at stake than the brand reputation of a energy drink company with a racing division, but I think the majority of people I have interacted with in person and online tend to believe the allegations, whether that is correct or not(may I add that the court of public opinion works much, much differently than the court of law...)

[Wouter]

.

The employee (name known to the Telegraaf editorial team) apparently documented these messages and reported them to Red Bull GmbH's compliance department in Fuschl at the end of 2023. The company commissioned an independent investigating lawyer to conduct an investigation. This has been public since January 5 thanks to a Red Bull statement on the matter.

Horner not considering voluntary resignation

According to research by Motorsport-Total.com, Horner was then offered an opportunity to get out of the matter without losing face. The plan for this was already in the drawer. Horner would resign as team principal of his own free will, and the official reason could have been health problems.

Incidentally, this is an account that is disputed by sources close to Horner. There had never been such an offer for a voluntary resignation. But Horner, apparently convinced that he was in the right, did not take up this offer.

It is difficult to imagine in the professional media business that De Telegraaf published the story without legal advice.
But: According to information from Motorsport-Total, Horner has now taken legal action against the publication.

.
https://www.motorsport-total.com/formel ... ian-horner

[hollus]

Isn’t there a no politics rule here?

Yes, there is.
Everyone, use the words "Trump" or "Biden" or equivalent at your own risk. There is a no politics rule in the forum, and patience has been exhausted in this thread alone.

Also, just a reminder for everyone to keep it civil, share the space and not try to remove others from the conversation.

Posting restraint to whenever there a new morsel of info, rather than screaming no! and yes! repeatedly, would be awesome.

[taperoo2k]

FYI -It is a criminal offence to send unsolicited sexual images in the UK. The way it works in England and Wales is that the person who recieves the images has to make a formal complaint to the Police for it to be investigated.

Well no complaint has been made to the police but to RB HQ. Does this debunk the pictures gossiping?

Whoever complained has elected to go through the HR process, bypassing Red Bull Racing and going straight to Red Bull GmbH. If there are pictures, then they will have been handed over to the Barrister who is investigating the matter.

[Watto]

The main skepticism I have with the recent rumor is up until now it was rumored as not a sexual context but rather a controlling manner, I don’t really doubt*something* happened just not too sure exactly how serious I am not