2024 Bahrain Grand Prix - Sakhir, Feb 29 - Mar 02

[Cassius]

https://x.com/tonisokolov1011/status/17 ... w2eCbwUjFA

Can’t get it to populate, but here is a race pace comparison chart.

Use [ img ] instead of URL ..

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GHhG_fLXQAE ... name=large

Here is a reference for last year's FP2. For most of last season, Red Bull didn't show their race pace in FP2. Just half a second for RB20 over RB19 in FP2, after 12 months of development.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FqTuyCsWAA0 ... name=large

Half a second gain vs last year seems plausible. Race pace seems pretty accurate with Max being 0.3-0.4s ahead of Merc and Ferrari. The key here is 1-lap pace. 0.4s slower than Lewis is a lot of difference in engine performance. Maybe it is combi of weight and engine. Max' fastest lap in testing was 0.1s faster on a used set of c3s.

Also, it is more the corners that were slow for Max, not so much the top speed. Balance issues on last 2 corners?

[Paa]

If these race sims are anything to go by, then they pretty much confirms the sentiment after the tests.
RB 2-3 tenths ahead of Fer-Mer-Mcl. Then Aston further 1-2 tenths behind.

Comparison is interesting vs last year. RB is 0.5-0.8 quicker, while the others improved 1-1.5s. This also suggest the gap has decreased.

[AR3-GP]

If these race sims are anything to go by, then they pretty much confirms the sentiment after the tests.
RB 2-3 tenths ahead of Fer-Mer-Mcl. Then Aston further 1-2 tenths behind.

Comparison is interesting vs last year. RB is 0.5-0.8 quicker, while the others improved 1-1.5s. This also suggest the gap has decreased.

Their average lap-time has come down quite a bit this year simply because they stabilized the tire degradation. Last year they might start in the 1.37s but finish in the 1.40s. This year they are fininshing in the 1.37-38 bracket. This makes it hard to quantify what is performance and what is just consistency. Although performance achieved in a specific way (broad aero map) aids consistency.

The true measure of the gains in performance would be qualifying comparisons.

[venkyhere]

Watch out for max in T12 tomorrow and over the race. It's a medium to high speed corner. The Redbull is leagues ahead of others. I'm telling this after watching the onboards. Not from laptime.
That one corner, RB20 with Max at the helm, is blitzing everyone.

[Paa]

If these race sims are anything to go by, then they pretty much confirms the sentiment after the tests.
RB 2-3 tenths ahead of Fer-Mer-Mcl. Then Aston further 1-2 tenths behind.

Comparison is interesting vs last year. RB is 0.5-0.8 quicker, while the others improved 1-1.5s. This also suggest the gap has decreased.

Their average lap-time has come down quite a bit this year simply because they stabilized the tire degradation. Last year they might start in the 1.37s but finish in the 1.40s. This year they are fininshing in the 1.37-38 bracket. This makes it hard to quantify what is performance and what is just consistency. Although performance achieved in a specific way (broad aero map) aids consistency.

The true measure of the gains in performance would be qualifying comparisons.

To be honest, I didn't really consider ultimate performance. Race pace is what matters the most.

[continuum16]

I had a theory that I posted a long time ago about the tires. I think there's an upper limit to what the tire wants to do regardless of how much downforce a car has. An actual laptime limit below which it will simply get too hot. So in theory performance convergence should occur when the leading team can no longer exploit additional downforce gains because of the tire. If said leading team would work on aerodynamic efficiency instead, then they could continue to gain laptime without hitting the tire performance wall.

Interesting. I think there is some merit to this at least conceptually.

What springs to mind is not a real example but actually a virtual one (apologies if this goes OT slightly). I know it is not a true sim, but in one of the recent F1 games (21 or 22 I think) you could upgrade the cars over 10 seasons to add downforce and whatnot, but the tire model did not change and after about 3-4 seasons your car would overheat the tires in a few laps (like 1 or 2, Haas '23-style) because it was so fast and you would actually lose laptime compared to when you were theoretically "slower." They later changed the game physics to mitigate these issues, something you can't do in real life (maybe Newey could idk ) Although I doubt we have approached this point IRL I think that at some point this theory may be decently accurate.

[AR3-GP]

Watch out for max in T12 tomorrow and over the race. It's a medium to high speed corner. The Redbull is leagues ahead of others. I'm telling this after watching the onboards. Not from laptime.
That one corner, RB20 with Max at the helm, is blitzing everyone.

What confuses me is that T12 looks like it should be a flat out corner. I didn't expect to see big differences between the cars.

[AR3-GP]

I had a theory that I posted a long time ago about the tires. I think there's an upper limit to what the tire wants to do regardless of how much downforce a car has. An actual laptime limit below which it will simply get too hot. So in theory performance convergence should occur when the leading team can no longer exploit additional downforce gains because of the tire. If said leading team would work on aerodynamic efficiency instead, then they could continue to gain laptime without hitting the tire performance wall.

Interesting. I think there is some merit to this at least conceptually.

What springs to mind is not a real example but actually a virtual one (apologies if this goes OT slightly). I know it is not a true sim, but in one of the recent F1 games (21 or 22 I think) you could upgrade the cars over 10 seasons to add downforce and whatnot, but the tire model did not change and after about 3-4 seasons your car would overheat the tires in a few laps (like 1 or 2, Haas '23-style) because it was so fast and you would actually lose laptime compared to when you were theoretically "slower." They later changed the game physics to mitigate these issues, something you can't do in real life (maybe Newey could idk ) Although I doubt we have approached this point IRL I think that at some point this theory may be decently accurate.

That virtual example is precisely what I was getting at. You could be right that we won't see it yet, but it partially explains why Verstappen can't just go out and run a 1.35 at the beginning of his stint, and instead chooses to run the 1.37. That opening lap on a new tire is already a form of tire limit induced convergence. You can't stress the tire too much on lap 1 whether you a RBR or a Haas.

[JPower]

One thing I've noticed this year, drivers are using far more curb on corner entry than ever before especially coming into T4 and T11.

[Xyz22]

Watch out for max in T12 tomorrow and over the race. It's a medium to high speed corner. The Redbull is leagues ahead of others. I'm telling this after watching the onboards. Not from laptime.
That one corner, RB20 with Max at the helm, is blitzing everyone.

What confuses me is that T12 looks like it should be a flat out corner. I didn't expect to see big differences between the cars.

It's not in race trim though.

[f1isgood]

I look forward to qualifying tomorrow. The field spread will make it very close and exciting I think. Expecting low 1.29 / high 1.28 for pole. Shame that the Horner saga has overshadowed what could be the most competitive race we get in a year.

[zibby43]

https://x.com/tonisokolov1011/status/17 ... w2eCbwUjFA

Can’t get it to populate, but here is a race pace comparison chart.

Use [ img ] instead of URL ..

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GHhG_fLXQAE ... name=large

Cheers.

[TeamKoolGreen]

When the Mercedes cars did their 1-2 times, the cars were sparking almost constantly through the lap. The front of Georges floor basically caught on fire at one point. The Mercs are running way lower than the Red Bulls. It is easy to see even from TV. The Aston Martin is riding lower than the Red Bull but higher than the Mercs.

It will be interesting to know if the Mercs with that ride height setup will have a legal skid block by the time qualifying or a race is done.

[Luscion]

When the Mercedes cars did their 1-2 times, the cars were sparking almost constantly through the lap. The front of Georges floor basically caught on fire at one point. The Mercs are running way lower than the Red Bulls. It is easy to see even from TV. The Aston Martin is riding lower than the Red Bull but higher than the Mercs.

It will be interesting to know if the Mercs with that ride height setup will have a legal skid block by the time qualifying or a race is done.

on Ham's quickest lap he was only sparking in a few corners and down the main straight, Russell was sparking like crazy but in his post practice interview he said it was because of a small adjustment they made, looked through the data and changed it. i dont think Merc would be running this low if they didnt think it would be fine, they have a good chunk of long run data to know how much the plank is wearing. i think people forget the reason they got DQ'd in COTA last year is because it was a sprint and they didnt do much long runs

[Watto]

I almost wondered at one point if there was something broken on the Merc it was sparking/running that low. I though I recall someone from the Sky comms team almost thinking it was a light before being told it was sparking (hope I didn't imagine that part) . If they can run that low in race they have for sure made a lot of good progress and have a good platform to build off.