2024 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

[scuderiabrandon]

That was a masterclass in how to utilise the tires though

MV, in my view uses quite different loading and interpretation of the tire to generate speed. A little more rally than classical track technique, perhaps not a match in absolute, absolute peak pace, that's in comparison to CL for example, but with better use of tire carcass and wear.

Max drives the tyre how he is told to drive tyre by the team

[Farnborough]

That was a masterclass in how to utilise the tires though

MV, in my view uses quite different loading and interpretation of the tire to generate speed. A little more rally than classical track technique, perhaps not a match in absolute, absolute peak pace, that's in comparison to CL for example, but with better use of tire carcass and wear.

Max drives the tyre how he is told to drive tyre by the team

Presumably you'd know the intricacies to make conclusive statement on that element ?

It is though my point, how that chassis (that so far they're all chasing) is evolved and used, has significantly an emphasis of what is possible with a combined approach of the driver and engineering team.

It was from comparison of tire against the beaten Ferrari example that I've made comment, clearly not of interest to offer debate here though

Recognition of these type are core in trying to beat the other team though.

[Sevach]

I think Vasseur after the shaky first few months last year (which makes sense as he had no experience in a team like Ferrari where every interview is micro analyzed to the death) has been on point with interviews and statements. He is right they have to push and close the gap to Red Bull which is still far ahead.

Agreed, I was under the impression it was a bit of underselling on his end, but I see they are happy with deg and tyre treatment overall so they now want to focus on pure performance/downforce. I thought they might want to try and push a bit more in the race to make up some lap time and trade it for worse deg, but as we all saw in Australia it takes just a little bit too much pushing on early laps and the deg goes sky high - so that's not what you want to do...

Honestly, it's so good to see 3 teams now seem to be fully prepared with their cars and will be pushing each other this season. RB, McLaren and Ferrari have done really good, if RB was less ahead it would be a 2010 rerun

If they want to challenge Red Bull they'll need to go in the "danger zone".
Honestly you have to do it and trust your drivers will do things correctly, even that is something they need to learn since last year they didn't even have this option.

[LM10]

Current weather forecast for the WE is rain, by the way.

Hopefully, if that will be the case, we won't see this stuff :

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GJqXe0pXUAA ... name=large

Don’t see why this should be the case for Ferrari. Best team in terms of deg so far this season.

[SoulPancake13]

That was a masterclass in how to utilise the tires though

MV, in my view uses quite different loading and interpretation of the tire to generate speed. A little more rally than classical track technique, perhaps not a match in absolute, absolute peak pace, that's in comparison to CL for example, but with better use of tire carcass and wear.

Yeah sorry that's just bullshit. Charles is one of the best at tyre management on the grid. He fooled the team to think a one stop in Austin was doable last year while not being far off Sainz's pace on a two stop. It's down to the car.

[Farnborough]

That was a masterclass in how to utilise the tires though

MV, in my view uses quite different loading and interpretation of the tire to generate speed. A little more rally than classical track technique, perhaps not a match in absolute, absolute peak pace, that's in comparison to CL for example, but with better use of tire carcass and wear.

Yeah sorry that's just bullshit. Charles is one of the best at tyre management on the grid. He fooled the team to think a one stop in Austin was doable last year while not being far off Sainz's pace on a two stop. It's down to the car.

Thank you for sitting so succinctly in judgement on what is a realistic discussion point. But I doubt you're materially competent to make such statement. Unless you can offer otherwise

As it's a technical forum, there's clearly a very big difference in tire use illustrated in that image between comparative Ferrari and RB it would seem reasonable to consider some aspect of that in valid discussion.

Clearly not though, the need to be, or appear to be right, seems all pervasive, to the detriment of any further consideration.

[SoulPancake13]

That was a masterclass in how to utilise the tires though

MV, in my view uses quite different loading and interpretation of the tire to generate speed. A little more rally than classical track technique, perhaps not a match in absolute, absolute peak pace, that's in comparison to CL for example, but with better use of tire carcass and wear.

Yeah sorry that's just bullshit. Charles is one of the best at tyre management on the grid. He fooled the team to think a one stop in Austin was doable last year while not being far off Sainz's pace on a two stop. It's down to the car.

Thank you for sitting so succinctly in judgement on what is a realistic discussion point. But I doubt you're materially competent to make such statement. Unless you can offer otherwise

As it's a technical forum, there's clearly a very big difference in tire use illustrated in that image between comparative Ferrari and RB it would seem reasonable to consider some aspect of that in valid discussion.

Clearly not though, the need to be, or appear to be right, seems all pervasive, to the detriment of any further consideration.

Could driver style be a difference? Of course. All the data we have says otherwise, with Pirelli themselves saying Charles has always been one of the best on the tyres. Neither you or I will ever have a definitive idea of who uses the tyres less because they have never been in the same car. What we do have is comparison to teammates, and comparison between general trends of cars where Charles has been better on deg than his teammate Sainz in 90% of races, and where Max blows Checo out of the water - and obviously, the last two seasons the RB cars had much better deg. Any comparison we can make is difficult because these two have not been in relatively matched cars for very long. Looking at a F1-75 that was awful on inters vs an RB18 which loved them is not fair in my opinion.

[Farnborough]

"Looking at a F1-75 that was awful on inters vs an RB18 which loved them is not fair in my opinion."

That was, at that GP part of the performance in overall finishing positions though.

And subsequently, that quality will be part of future races. My point is that the combination that weekend saw the RB MV performance easily outstrip all others consummately, none of driver preference.

For reference, my view is they are both brilliant to watch drive a car fast, but their approach in how they move the car around has considerable contrast from one to the other. That can and does yeald different performance pace across variation in circumstances.

We'll soon get another view to then judge a little more during the next race.

[Xyz22]

That was a masterclass in how to utilise the tires though

MV, in my view uses quite different loading and interpretation of the tire to generate speed. A little more rally than classical track technique, perhaps not a match in absolute, absolute peak pace, that's in comparison to CL for example, but with better use of tire carcass and wear.

While Max is tremendous at managing tyres, such a difference can only be explained by two chassis working the tyres in completely different ways. In fact, Perez's tyres were also in much better conditions compared to Leclerc's tyres.

[SoulPancake13]

"Looking at a F1-75 that was awful on inters vs an RB18 which loved them is not fair in my opinion."

That was, at that GP part of the performance in overall finishing positions though.

And subsequently, that quality will be part of future races. My point is that the combination that weekend saw the RB MV performance easily outstrip all others consummately, none of driver preference.

For reference, my view is they are both brilliant to watch drive a car fast, but their approach in how they move the car around has considerable contrast from one to the other. That can and does yeald different performance pace across variation in circumstances.

We'll soon get another view to then judge a little more during the next race.

I think you give almost too much credit to the driver here versus the car. The entire season, bar maybe Monaco, Ferrari struggled on the intermediate tyres(and not just Charles, but Sainz too). A difference that large is not caused by difference in driving style, as a comparison between Checo and Charles's tyres were also made after the GP and the image looked quite similar, and I'm sure we'd both agree that Max's tyre saving abilities outclass Checo's. I understand your point, and I'm not saying Max is bad on tyres, but I think when they had cars with such fundamentally different characteristics and level of strength, the tyre performance between drivers is not comparable. Otherwise, I could just as easily point to Vegas and say that in the toughest conditions for tyres, Charles had better management of the mediums vs Verstappen in a car that had more deg all season long.

[FDD]

Looking at these 3 races, it might be the other way round even

So right, so true!

[dialtone]

"Looking at a F1-75 that was awful on inters vs an RB18 which loved them is not fair in my opinion."

That was, at that GP part of the performance in overall finishing positions though.

And subsequently, that quality will be part of future races. My point is that the combination that weekend saw the RB MV performance easily outstrip all others consummately, none of driver preference.

For reference, my view is they are both brilliant to watch drive a car fast, but their approach in how they move the car around has considerable contrast from one to the other. That can and does yeald different performance pace across variation in circumstances.

We'll soon get another view to then judge a little more during the next race.

You think that difference in tire management of the past 2 seasons was Max?

I thought you said this is a technical forum. These are the type of evaluations that end up with people talking Max down because his fans think he’s the one carrying the car around the track while making engine noises with his mouth.

Max has never been particularly good at tire management. British press calls Checo the tire whisperer. Vettel did a one stopper in Bahrain with Ferrari to win the race in 2018, on 39 laps when tires were supposed to last 30, he’s good but that car was amazing to its tires.

Max has had a superior car, just like Leclerc didn’t magically turn into a driver that saves tires and places fast laps at the end of his races after one year but instead the SF-24 is just better.

Let’s be serious.

[dia6olo]

"Looking at a F1-75 that was awful on inters vs an RB18 which loved them is not fair in my opinion."

That was, at that GP part of the performance in overall finishing positions though.

And subsequently, that quality will be part of future races. My point is that the combination that weekend saw the RB MV performance easily outstrip all others consummately, none of driver preference.

For reference, my view is they are both brilliant to watch drive a car fast, but their approach in how they move the car around has considerable contrast from one to the other. That can and does yeald different performance pace across variation in circumstances.

We'll soon get another view to then judge a little more during the next race.

You think that difference in tire management of the past 2 seasons was Max?

I thought you said this is a technical forum. These are the type of evaluations that end up with people talking Max down because his fans think he’s the one carrying the car around the track while making engine noises with his mouth.

Max has never been particularly good at tire management. British press calls Checo the tire whisperer. Vettel did a one stopper in Bahrain with Ferrari to win the race in 2018, on 39 laps when tires were supposed to last 30, he’s good but that car was amazing to its tires.

Max has had a superior car, just like Leclerc didn’t magically turn into a driver that saves tires and places fast laps at the end of his races after one year but instead the SF-24 is just better.

Let’s be serious.

Exactly this!
It never ceases to amaze me how some drivers are elevated to silly levels by some while completely ignoring the car which is responsible for the vast majority of it

[ringo]

I think it's too early to say how much better the sf24 is on tyres. The 3 races so far have not been representative. The teams are still learning the new cars. Also with only Mclaren behind them by some margin, Ferrari are able to not use the tyres so hard. They know they wont catch rb20 and thr know the mcl38 wont catch them. Compared to last year when they were trying to stave off mclaren and mercedes and Aston.
Not saying the car is average as its an improvement over last year, but i am not convinced it is kinder to its tyres until see them push or being pushed.

[SoulPancake13]

I think it's too early to say how much better the sf24 is on tyres. The 3 races so far have not been representative. The teams are still learning the new cars. Also with only Mclaren behind them by some margin, Ferrari are able to not use the tyres so hard. They know they wont catch rb20 and thr know the mcl38 wont catch them. Compared to last year when they were trying to stave off mclaren and mercedes and Aston.
Not saying the car is average as its an improvement over last year, but i am not convinced it is kinder to its tyres until see them push or being pushed.

The whole idea though is that you can go faster while using less tyre - we are undeniably better on tyres because we are faster than last year's car while having less deg. This either means the car is miles faster or the deg is improved.