2024 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

[BritishPowerboats]

Mercedes need a new Aero team and need to speak with some boat guys. What they have is similar to when boats are porpoising Ie. they have their center of pressure or in their case negative center of pressure collapsing and shifting rapidly back and forth as it re establishes its self and collapses. Ok Aero is not boating but neither is trying to fly a car up side down 20mm from the tarmac. Water is 800 x denser than air so the problem is magnified and easier to study but with such a narrow window for it to be correct for aero, optimization is crucial. They would do well to study some Savitsky and adapt it.

[JordanMugen]

He really has nothing to prove after 103 wins and 7wdc.

Russell wasn't driving for Mercedes in 2020 or 2021, so nobody knows if Russell could have 1 WDC or 2 WDC, which would also mean Hamilton would "only" be on 6 WDC (which is still excellent!).

All both Mercedes drivers -- Russell and Hamilton -- can do is push to the maximum. Obviously despite Lewis being certain that Mercedes GP "never makes mistakes", he lost faith in the team while also Wolff did not offer a sufficient contract. A shame for the three-star brand, but it happens I guess -- Vettel similarly left Red Bull Racing for the prancing horse despite success, while Alonso left Renault for McLaren-Mercedes despite success...

Indeed Hamilton himself left McLaren-Mercedes despite success and could otherwise have stuck with McLaren-Honda, McLaren-Renault and McLaren-Mercedes to the present day!

[chrisc90]

Lewis is working assiduously on one final win for Mercedes.. nothing else really matters at this point! haha

At what point do you compromise the teams points haul in the WCC in favour of trying to get that 1 more win? (which will be complete fluke and a miracle). At this point, they are probably better off fighting for position in the WCC than anything else.

[SKYnRacing24]

Theres improving setups and there's looking for a silver bullet in the setup that's not there. My take is he's been struggling to unlock performance in the ground effect era and most of the experiments are for his own benefit more than the teams, which is why George keeps his mouth shut and gets on with it. The win is not coming and anyone who believes so is straight off there rocker. The car is not even capable for podium and please dont use yesterdays sprint race as indicator.

[JordanMugen]

Imagine you are well into your fifites, new regulation change, new role, you gave it your absolute best shot, and your work, due to the ignorance of everyone and yourself for that matter, is considered total trash!! You are tired, you have been going hard since 2011.... Do you push for another three years again into even ANOTHER regulation change?!! Nahh. You're gonna call it a day and let somebody else do that ---. I don't blame Elliot for retiring.

Except the perception was totally wrong?

It was actually Mercedes best car out of the W13, W14 and W15 and higher echelons like Wolff were way out of line calling it an "s-box". It was a superb car -- a race winner!

For a midfield team like Mercedes-Benz, to build a race winning car like that is an excellent effort. It was so fast on smooth tracks when it was running low (it looked really cool too!).

In any case, they have the W15 now and it will now be case to develop it (and the evolutionary W16?) try to close down the gap to the upper midfield teams like McLaren, Ferrari and Aston Martin.

In this case the blame seems squarely on Wolff for not giving Elliot his full support and retaining Elliot's skill and expertise. A huge loss of technical skill for Mercedes GP!

[Silent Storm]

How the tables have turned... When Vettel was struggling in 2014 most Lewis fans said a champion should adapt to the car, none of his reasons were taken seriously.
Now we have Lewis asking for a stable rear... He got that and the blame moved to understeer.

All these explanations are fun to read...
Lewis indeed is a expert circus master. Sebastian, Daniel, Kimi and any other driver that struggled never cared to manipulate his fans to this length.

Reminds me of what Jin9128 said in 2021 about Hamilton and how it still stands true to this day.

[Mosin123]

Theres improving setups and there's looking for a silver bullet in the setup that's not there. My take is he's been struggling to unlock performance in the ground effect era and most of the experiments are for his own benefit more than the teams, which is why George keeps his mouth shut and gets on with it. The win is not coming and anyone who believes so is straight off there rocker. The car is not even capable for podium and please dont use yesterdays sprint race as indicator.

the car will never make a podium either if every body is happy with finishing 6th like GR is........

Champions are not happy with any thing other than competing for titles.....

How the tables have turned... When Vettel was struggling in 2014 most Lewis fans said a champion should adapt to the car, none of his reasons were taken seriously.
Now we have Lewis asking for a stable rear... He got that and the blame moved to understeer.

All these explanations are fun to read...
Lewis indeed is a expert circus master. Sebastian, Daniel, Kimi and any other driver that struggled never cared to manipulate his fans to this length.

Reminds me of what Jin9128 said in 2021 about Hamilton and how it still stands true to this day.

I dont remember any one sayin that in 2014 when he got beaten by Riccardo, people just out right questioned his ability, he then went to Ferrari which was a team full of mistakes that made him look worst, but by this point, Green vettel had already kicked in, AM came along but he didnt really believe in racing any more and wanted out to do his global warming thing / 0 emission work.

[Hammerfist]

Over the past three years, Hamilton fans have been saying that George beat Lewis because of experiments, and the same thing is happening again. Hamilton does these experiments for himself, and if he ends up behind George at the end of the season, he says he doesn't care. Lewis fans are saying that the experiments are the reason for this result.

It's great that finally, the curtains are open, and Hamilton has said that he was the one who did the cooking in the kitchen with the setups, not the team. I think this has always been the case. Hamilton wants to win so badly that he takes risks with the setups.

Worked last year when he was fighting for p2 in the drivers with Perez while GR was fighting to finish 8th...

People have short memorys...

To be fair the narrative las year was not about experiments. That seemed to have stopped midway in 22’.

[Mosin123]

Over the past three years, Hamilton fans have been saying that George beat Lewis because of experiments, and the same thing is happening again. Hamilton does these experiments for himself, and if he ends up behind George at the end of the season, he says he doesn't care. Lewis fans are saying that the experiments are the reason for this result.

It's great that finally, the curtains are open, and Hamilton has said that he was the one who did the cooking in the kitchen with the setups, not the team. I think this has always been the case. Hamilton wants to win so badly that he takes risks with the setups.

Worked last year when he was fighting for p2 in the drivers with Perez while GR was fighting to finish 8th...

People have short memorys...

To be fair the narrative las year was not about experiments. That seemed to have stopped midway in 22’.

He was always commenting on trying different things last year, and not being happy with the balance of the car even when he had a good result, he was commenting on it as soon as pre season testing started.

He even went as far as hanging people out to dry with the " didnt listen to me " and so on comments, but generally he mentioned at almost every weekend about changing set ups, looking for the sweet spot blah blah, Even GR moaned a few times when he finished behind LH, generally doesnt complain at all when he finishes in front of LH, guess it shows what the prioritys are for each driver - GR is happy with just fininishing a head of lewis - LH unhappy with any thing other than fighting for the win..

[Silent Storm]

Theres improving setups and there's looking for a silver bullet in the setup that's not there. My take is he's been struggling to unlock performance in the ground effect era and most of the experiments are for his own benefit more than the teams, which is why George keeps his mouth shut and gets on with it. The win is not coming and anyone who believes so is straight off there rocker. The car is not even capable for podium and please dont use yesterdays sprint race as indicator.

the car will never make a podium either if every body is happy with finishing 6th like GR is........

Champions are not happy with any thing other than competing for titles.....

How the tables have turned... When Vettel was struggling in 2014 most Lewis fans said a champion should adapt to the car, none of his reasons were taken seriously.
Now we have Lewis asking for a stable rear... He got that and the blame moved to understeer.

All these explanations are fun to read...
Lewis indeed is a expert circus master. Sebastian, Daniel, Kimi and any other driver that struggled never cared to manipulate his fans to this length.

Reminds me of what Jin9128 said in 2021 about Hamilton and how it still stands true to this day.

I dont remember any one sayin that in 2014 when he got beaten by Riccardo, people just out right questioned his ability, he then went to Ferrari which was a team full of mistakes that made him look worst, but by this point, Green vettel had already kicked in, AM came along but he didnt really believe in racing any more and wanted out to do his global warming thing / 0 emission work.

Here you go... viewtopic.php?t=28449
viewtopic.php?t=15404
Scroll down to read PZ's comments

There were multiple threads on Kimi Raikkonen and Sebastian Vettel.

[Mosin123]

Theres improving setups and there's looking for a silver bullet in the setup that's not there. My take is he's been struggling to unlock performance in the ground effect era and most of the experiments are for his own benefit more than the teams, which is why George keeps his mouth shut and gets on with it. The win is not coming and anyone who believes so is straight off there rocker. The car is not even capable for podium and please dont use yesterdays sprint race as indicator.

the car will never make a podium either if every body is happy with finishing 6th like GR is........

Champions are not happy with any thing other than competing for titles.....

How the tables have turned... When Vettel was struggling in 2014 most Lewis fans said a champion should adapt to the car, none of his reasons were taken seriously.
Now we have Lewis asking for a stable rear... He got that and the blame moved to understeer.

All these explanations are fun to read...
Lewis indeed is a expert circus master. Sebastian, Daniel, Kimi and any other driver that struggled never cared to manipulate his fans to this length.

Reminds me of what Jin9128 said in 2021 about Hamilton and how it still stands true to this day.

I dont remember any one sayin that in 2014 when he got beaten by Riccardo, people just out right questioned his ability, he then went to Ferrari which was a team full of mistakes that made him look worst, but by this point, Green vettel had already kicked in, AM came along but he didnt really believe in racing any more and wanted out to do his global warming thing / 0 emission work.

Here you go... viewtopic.php?t=28449
viewtopic.php?t=15404
Scroll down to read PZ's comments

There were multiple threads on Kimi Raikkonen and Sebastian Vettel.

Thread date
" The curious case of Sebastian Vettel

Post 13 Sep 2019, 23:13 "

You said " When Vettel was struggling in 2014 most Lewis fans said a champion should adapt to the car, "

I said in 2014.

You link me a thread that was started in 2019.

[Silent Storm]

the car will never make a podium either if every body is happy with finishing 6th like GR is........

Champions are not happy with any thing other than competing for titles.....



I dont remember any one sayin that in 2014 when he got beaten by Riccardo, people just out right questioned his ability, he then went to Ferrari which was a team full of mistakes that made him look worst, but by this point, Green vettel had already kicked in, AM came along but he didnt really believe in racing any more and wanted out to do his global warming thing / 0 emission work.

Here you go... viewtopic.php?t=28449
viewtopic.php?t=15404
Scroll down to read PZ's comments

There were multiple threads on Kimi Raikkonen and Sebastian Vettel.

Thread date
" The curious case of Sebastian Vettel

Post 13 Sep 2019, 23:13 "

You said " When Vettel was struggling in 2014 most Lewis fans said a champion should adapt to the car, "

I said in 2014.

You link me a thread that was started in 2019.

There are two links there... One is from 2019 and other is from 2014
Start from page 10 as that's easy.

[Silent Storm]

Btw Ben (bhall) has a classic comment on page 18 of Vettel vs Ricciardo 2014 which I believe fits Hamilton fans currently really well.
If you don't know which comment it is, then let me tell you it starts with "dude"
Replace "Sebastian Vettel's" with "Lewis Hamilton's"

[avantman]

Since 2007, I have always thought that Hamilton and Alonso were on the same level speed wise and Race craft etc, but now I get the feeling that Alonso is better.....

always was.

[Hammerfist]

Since 2007, I have always thought that Hamilton and Alonso were on the same level speed wise and Race craft etc, but now I get the feeling that Alonso is better.....

always was.

And yet he couldnt beat him in the same car as a rookie. Hmmm…