2024 Emilia Romagna Grand Prix - Imola, May 17 - 19

[bananapeel23]

Why do they have variante alta?

Owners should go back to the original layout and widen the track.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/ ... mola53.png

This would just be a bad version of Monza. Getting rid of the sector 1 chicanes OR the variante alta chicane could be good, but getting rid of both would just turn the track into Monza with elevation. I like that Imola actually leads to some interesting setup variation between the teams, with some setting up for top speed and others for cornering. Getting rid of the chicanes would just take the nuance out of the track.

Also I don't know if they could create a DRS zone after Acque Minerali even if they got rid of the Variante alta chicane, since the uphill part would lead to incredibly poor vision, which could potentially be insanely dangerous, since it would be an even more dangerous version of the Istanbul park back straight, which has already caused some code brown moments.

Widening and slowing down the Tamburello chicane to create a harder braking zone and more opportunities for different lines (something like Bahrain turn 1), while removing the Villeneuve chicane and adding a second DRS zone before the hairpin might work better though. It would be like a shorter version of the Abu Dhabi back straight. I don't know if they would reach speeds fast enough for DRS to make a substantial difference into the hairpin though. That would also require them to straighten out the kink before Tosa somehow, and I don't know if that's possible since there is a river right beside the track and a hill on the other side. I think it's a bit like the near-impossibility of creating enough runoff after Eau Rouge becuase geography determines just how much can be done to the layout.

Monza will be a lot better without the chicanes.

I have a sneaking suspicion that you would like drag racing or perhaps oval racing? Perhaps you would also be interested in bringing the old AVUS track back to F1?

[Spacepace]

What is the reason for this tracks pitlane being so long? 550 m of which 200 m is just empty space.

This is something that should be addressed, it could make it much more exciting if it wasn’t a guaranteed one-stop because of the enormous pitstop time loss.

Or Pirelli could just bring some softer tyre compounds. I used to like when they first came into the sport and had 2-4 stops a race. And I wish they would make a one off special allocation for Monaco with tyres as soft as chocolate lol

[FW17]

This would just be a bad version of Monza. Getting rid of the sector 1 chicanes OR the variante alta chicane could be good, but getting rid of both would just turn the track into Monza with elevation. I like that Imola actually leads to some interesting setup variation between the teams, with some setting up for top speed and others for cornering. Getting rid of the chicanes would just take the nuance out of the track.

Also I don't know if they could create a DRS zone after Acque Minerali even if they got rid of the Variante alta chicane, since the uphill part would lead to incredibly poor vision, which could potentially be insanely dangerous, since it would be an even more dangerous version of the Istanbul park back straight, which has already caused some code brown moments.

Widening and slowing down the Tamburello chicane to create a harder braking zone and more opportunities for different lines (something like Bahrain turn 1), while removing the Villeneuve chicane and adding a second DRS zone before the hairpin might work better though. It would be like a shorter version of the Abu Dhabi back straight. I don't know if they would reach speeds fast enough for DRS to make a substantial difference into the hairpin though. That would also require them to straighten out the kink before Tosa somehow, and I don't know if that's possible since there is a river right beside the track and a hill on the other side. I think it's a bit like the near-impossibility of creating enough runoff after Eau Rouge becuase geography determines just how much can be done to the layout.

Monza will be a lot better without the chicanes.

Why even bother with corners at all

To get back to start finish line

[FW17]

This would just be a bad version of Monza. Getting rid of the sector 1 chicanes OR the variante alta chicane could be good, but getting rid of both would just turn the track into Monza with elevation. I like that Imola actually leads to some interesting setup variation between the teams, with some setting up for top speed and others for cornering. Getting rid of the chicanes would just take the nuance out of the track.

Also I don't know if they could create a DRS zone after Acque Minerali even if they got rid of the Variante alta chicane, since the uphill part would lead to incredibly poor vision, which could potentially be insanely dangerous, since it would be an even more dangerous version of the Istanbul park back straight, which has already caused some code brown moments.

Widening and slowing down the Tamburello chicane to create a harder braking zone and more opportunities for different lines (something like Bahrain turn 1), while removing the Villeneuve chicane and adding a second DRS zone before the hairpin might work better though. It would be like a shorter version of the Abu Dhabi back straight. I don't know if they would reach speeds fast enough for DRS to make a substantial difference into the hairpin though. That would also require them to straighten out the kink before Tosa somehow, and I don't know if that's possible since there is a river right beside the track and a hill on the other side. I think it's a bit like the near-impossibility of creating enough runoff after Eau Rouge becuase geography determines just how much can be done to the layout.

Monza will be a lot better without the chicanes.

I have a sneaking suspicion that you would like drag racing or perhaps oval racing? Perhaps you would also be interested in bringing the old AVUS track back to F1?

My fav track is the old hockenheimring

[V12-POWER]

This would just be a bad version of Monza. Getting rid of the sector 1 chicanes OR the variante alta chicane could be good, but getting rid of both would just turn the track into Monza with elevation. I like that Imola actually leads to some interesting setup variation between the teams, with some setting up for top speed and others for cornering. Getting rid of the chicanes would just take the nuance out of the track.

Also I don't know if they could create a DRS zone after Acque Minerali even if they got rid of the Variante alta chicane, since the uphill part would lead to incredibly poor vision, which could potentially be insanely dangerous, since it would be an even more dangerous version of the Istanbul park back straight, which has already caused some code brown moments.

Widening and slowing down the Tamburello chicane to create a harder braking zone and more opportunities for different lines (something like Bahrain turn 1), while removing the Villeneuve chicane and adding a second DRS zone before the hairpin might work better though. It would be like a shorter version of the Abu Dhabi back straight. I don't know if they would reach speeds fast enough for DRS to make a substantial difference into the hairpin though. That would also require them to straighten out the kink before Tosa somehow, and I don't know if that's possible since there is a river right beside the track and a hill on the other side. I think it's a bit like the near-impossibility of creating enough runoff after Eau Rouge becuase geography determines just how much can be done to the layout.

Monza will be a lot better without the chicanes.

I have a sneaking suspicion that you would like drag racing or perhaps oval racing? Perhaps you would also be interested in bringing the old AVUS track back to F1?

what’s wrong with chicane-less monza?

[hollus]

So, someone makes a passing mention of questionable parenting (agreed, a bit off topic)... please notice the question part in questionable, that lovely uncertainty, the gray zone, where interpretations are possible.

Also, please notice that the post wasn't about that, but about the racing qualities of yesterday's race winner.

And suddenly bam! A post just saying how 120% not true that it. And nothing else.
And then bam, wham! Yes"! 250% true! And nothing else...

Both posts are off topic, both posts are now deleted. Both posts are taking a controversial theme and taking it to one extreme, then to the other extreme. Both with no hope of an informative discussion following.

Please, please, please, a plea to all...

Let's not scream louder that the rest (they scream back), let's not pick fights, let's not look for fights and let's not feed the fights we find.

It truly makes the forum unreadable and less enjoyable for all. You have no idea of the amount of fights we stop in the nib (because most disappear before you read them).
The forum is what you all make of it, really, please don't make it obnoxious and unreadable. The mods cannot be everywhere all the time to clean up.

[Just_a_fan]

Monza will be a lot better without the chicanes.

I have a sneaking suspicion that you would like drag racing or perhaps oval racing? Perhaps you would also be interested in bringing the old AVUS track back to F1?

what’s wrong with chicane-less monza?

It killed a whole lot of people?

[Francis Bacon]

You'd be living on the moon too if Charles was a 3 time WDC with 60 wins and redefining the record books every other weekend At 26 Verstappen has already established himself as an all time great. He will probably have done more from 2021-2024 than the likes of Charles, Lando and George will accomplish over their entire careers combined, and we know those guys are super talented. He has simply set himself apart and there's no reason we should sit by idly pretending it's not happening. Offending the sensibilities of some haters who can't handle or recognize greatness when it's right in front of their noses is par for the course.

If he was against some one better than Perez, i could agree with you, stick Norris in the car next to him, or LH, ohh wait... he doesnt want a challange. Max's own words

There would be another excuse, there always is. That's the magic of detracting. Remember now, Perez only became "awful" after being consistently trounced by Verstappen.

But sure, I'd like to see Norris in a RB too, it could work on a personal level, but Norris didn't want to go up against Max when he had the offer. Says enough.

Not quite. You're mischaracterising. Lando isn't afraid of "going up against Max." Rather, he didn't want to join the Red Bull team, which is wholly oriented on Max, vs staying with McLaren, a team he already knows and trusts."

[Silent Storm]

If he was against some one better than Perez, i could agree with you, stick Norris in the car next to him, or LH, ohh wait... he doesnt want a challange. Max's own words

There would be another excuse, there always is. That's the magic of detracting. Remember now, Perez only became "awful" after being consistently trounced by Verstappen.

But sure, I'd like to see Norris in a RB too, it could work on a personal level, but Norris didn't want to go up against Max when he had the offer. Says enough.

Not quite. You're mischaracterising. Lando isn't afraid of "going up against Max." Rather, he didn't want to join the Red Bull team, which is wholly oriented on Max, vs staying with McLaren, a team he already knows and trusts."

What do you mean by this?

[Polarit]

Max was the difference in this race.

You can always tell how far ahead a car is by their weakest driver.

When Perez who is a mid to lower tier driver is finishing 2-4th you know the car is the difference. It’s the biggest problem with the Red Bull dominance is how far off Perez is baring on street circuits to Max.

When he’s struggling below that you know the car isn’t quite as good.

I think Lando had a chance to win but he had a few mistakes chasing and lost the time on Max who was not putting a foot wrong.

If Red Bull had a second driver like Webber was to Vettel, like Rosberg was to Hamilton…. It wouldn’t seem so boring.

Bottas was a great qualifier to Hamilton but in the race he wasn’t near…. He was a lot closer than Perez is to Verstappen though.

But in this race Perez struggling means the Red Bull isn’t as dominant as it usually is.

[ringo]

You'd be living on the moon too if Charles was a 3 time WDC with 60 wins and redefining the record books every other weekend At 26 Verstappen has already established himself as an all time great. He will probably have done more from 2021-2024 than the likes of Charles, Lando and George will accomplish over their entire careers combined, and we know those guys are super talented. He has simply set himself apart and there's no reason we should sit by idly pretending it's not happening. Offending the sensibilities of some haters who can't handle or recognize greatness when it's right in front of their noses is par for the course.

If he was against some one better than Perez, i could agree with you, stick Norris in the car next to him, or LH, ohh wait... he doesnt want a challange. Max's own words

There would be another excuse, there always is. That's the magic of detracting. Remember now, Perez only became "awful" after being consistently trounced by Verstappen.

But sure, I'd like to see Norris in a RB too, it could work on a personal level, but Norris didn't want to go up against Max when he had the offer. Says enough.

Perez was dropped by Mclaren. So make of that what you will. He was also dropped by a lower standard team, Force India.
None of Lewis teammates were at a decline. All were on the rise and considered prodigies or champions.
Just saying.
I suspect quite a few fans are not watching F-1 before they hybrid era to get an appreciation of certain things.
Even Vettel, though I am not a fan of his, I have to respect his skill an achievement. Vettel at 2014 and at Ferrari was not the same driver. He still did wonders in the Torro Rosso and Redbulls he won with. After being trounced by Ricciardo, he should have stayed another year to adapt.

[venkyhere]

I think Lando had a chance to win but he had a few mistakes chasing and lost the time on Max who was not putting a foot wrong.

Small disagreement, if I may :

Both Lando and Max didn't put a foot wrong once they both realized there was a dogfight brewing, right from lap mid-40s somewhere, when :

(i) whatever Lando and his engineer were doing, playing around with car settings, suddenly brought the H back into temp window and being the only driver who brought his H gently to life, it paid dividends and he pulled away from chasing LeClerc

(ii) No matter what Max and his engineer did, they couldn't extract any more pace, and started earning more strikes for track limits, the more he pushed the car, the worse the tyres behaved. Despite the setup of the car that didn't favour the H, Max had pushed his H far too early after installing them (I think this was a mistake from team&driver, because they had Perez data to infer that the H is behaving terribly on their car) and now made it even worse for himself.

By the last 2-3 laps, although the gaps had closed, Lando's tyres were going away as well (dirty air), and he could no longer eat 0.5s per lap. Still he managed to get into DRS range in the final lap. If there was one more lap, whether he would've actually DRS overtaken is another Q, because they would've fought into turn2 chicane and anyone could come out in front.

I guess what you are calling 'mistakes' by Lando might be the nervous/un-smooth behavior of the car coming out of turns - that's probably the driver driving at the teetering edge of maximum grip, pushing the car to the ragged edge. I don't think they were mistake correcting snaps.

[ringo]

I still maintain that Max simply did not manage his tyres well. That's the simplest explanation. A similar faith befell George Russel. Max did however manage to hold on in the end. It may sound like blasphemy to Max fans; but that's what took place for both drivers at this particular track.

[Cs98]

If he was against some one better than Perez, i could agree with you, stick Norris in the car next to him, or LH, ohh wait... he doesnt want a challange. Max's own words

There would be another excuse, there always is. That's the magic of detracting. Remember now, Perez only became "awful" after being consistently trounced by Verstappen.

But sure, I'd like to see Norris in a RB too, it could work on a personal level, but Norris didn't want to go up against Max when he had the offer. Says enough.

Perez was dropped by Mclaren. So make of that what you will. He was also dropped by a lower standard team, Force India.
None of Lewis teammates were at a decline. All were on the rise and considered prodigies or champions.
Just saying.
I suspect quite a few fans are not watching F-1 before they hybrid era to get an appreciation of certain things.
Even Vettel, though I am not a fan of his, I have to respect his skill an achievement. Vettel at 2014 and at Ferrari was not the same driver. He still did wonders in the Torro Rosso and Redbulls he won with. After being trounced by Ricciardo, he should have stayed another year to adapt.

We don't need to peddle bad information Ringo. Perez had a contract with Aston Martin until 2022 but was backstabbed when the team decided they wanted Vettel at the end of 2020, probably thinking he was something he no longer was. $troll obviously wasn't going to be asked to move despite being thoroughly outperformed two years in a row by Perez. And all this coming right on the back of Perez's best season in F1, being best of the rest in P4 despite missing two races and beating the likes of Albon in the RB. Also concluded a 6 year streak of Perez beating his teammate every year. Hulkenberg twice, Ocon twice, Stroll twice. It was a natural decision for RB to pick him up and people at the time were talking about the injustice were he not to be on the grid for 2021. No, he was never considered elite, but he developed into a well above average F1 driver with a well above average F1 career, only considered "awful" by people who want to detract from Verstappen.

[Chuckjr]

It’s now Red Bull, Macca, Ferrari, Merc, Aston/RB jr., the rest.

Congratulations and huge props to McLaren, their fans, and of course Lando. Unbelievable turn around from last year. They are clear #2 now. Outstanding drive, and way to push all the way to the end. Lando was fearless, and risked a lot to try and get past at the end with his lose back end in the last few laps. I’m impressed. He didn’t crack or lose focus. Was calm on the radio. I liked his statement in his on track post race interview, “Expect us.” Nice. With his first win monkey off his back, he smells blood.

Max really showing some poise and talent pulling the car up to pole and first place. Didn’t put a foot wrong. I’m more impressed with him the more I watch him. Seems the Red Bull is a diva this year and he’s handling it well.

Ferrari obviously will find more speed. May take some races but I’m confident they get there. But for now, they are behind McLaren. I see them having a hard time surpassing the developmental pace of Macca, and it may be 2025 before they find it.

McLaren really have been as impressive in their development as Max has been in his. These will be hard energies for Ferrari to overcome. Maybe if Newey goes there they do, but their driver situation will get sticky somethin quick should they become really competitive in 2025…which I foresee becoming an entire f1 tech thread unto itself the likes of which we’ve not seen since 2007.

i have to mention how much I enjoyed seeing the Senna McLaren tribute car running on the track. The sound. The size. The nimbleness. The ability to see the driver so well. The simple wings. Made me so nostalgic. Those were some beautiful, perfectly proportioned cars. Just brilliant. Miss them and the V-10’s, 12’s. Would be brilliant if F1 ditched all batteries, brought back the non-turbo ICE, let them rev to any limit the team wants, v10 or 12, or 8, and just use synthetic fuel. It would be so friggin epic. Omg. Dare to dream.