2024 Monaco Grand Prix - Monte Carlo, May 24 - 26

[Watto]

I’ve rewatched a few times the gasly - ocon incident and to be honest I do not understand the furore against Ocon.

I get it from a team mate perspective, but racing wise the move ocon pulled was entirely within the rules, he didn’t leave track, he was ahead at the apex (which we learned in miami entitles the overtaking driver to the firstborn son of the overtaken), as overtaking driver he should have left some space and thus is a bit at fault, but if the reasoning for Kmag is that he should have braked, then Gasly was beaten and should have given up and instead stayed there.

So I don’t get it…

The only things I get with KMags is that Perez checked his mirrors and knew he was there but am surprised it wasn't something where they at least investigated post race after interviewing drivers. But agree really otherwise.

The issue with Ocon to me was it was a team mate more than the incident inself at least if you compare to Perez/KMags

[chrstphrln]

I’ve rewatched a few times the gasly - ocon incident and to be honest I do not understand the furore against Ocon.

The problem was that Gasly couldn't disappear into thin air when Ocon pushed him into the crash barrier at the exit of the corner. He would have had to reverse to prevent Ocon from hitting him.

[Andres125sx]

Monaco was very often decided on Saturday. Everyone knows that and it's okay.
That's why it's the iconic Monaco.

Sorry but I have to disagree, it´s not okay, it´s been a subject of debate for years, or even decades

Monaco is iconic for races from many many years ago, Senna is probably main responsible, but not only Ayrton. Since then, wich coincidentally is since aero became key in F1, it´s been an extremelly boring GP. That´s more than 2 decades ago!

Nowadays race leader can be, and actually have been in past GPs, 6-7 seconds per lap slower than possible, and none was able to even try a pass. To me that is not racing, it´s a gimmick. I think people understimate how slow is doing 6-7 seconds slower laptimes.

Actually, 1:20 wich was race pace for first laps is pretty close to GP2 pole... That´s not what I expect from a F1 GP race

[chrstphrln]

Monaco was very often decided on Saturday. Everyone knows that and it's okay.
That's why it's the iconic Monaco.

(...)
Monaco is iconic for races from many many years ago, Senna is probably main responsible, but not only Ayrton. Since then, wich coincidentally is since aero became key in F1, it´s been an extremelly boring GP. That´s more than 2 decades ago!

(...)

Monaco was iconic long before Senna.
However, you are right, his mesmerising laps, in which he said he drove through the streets and alleyways almost subconsciously, made some people realise that the fascination of Monaco is not dozens of overtaking manoeuvres and that this Grand Prix should be assessed differently.
I realise that not everyone has this understanding.
But demands from some TV viewers to remove this weekend from the racing calendar because they don't feel sufficiently entertained... absurd.
And it's not going to happen.

[langedweil]

"entitles the overtaking driver to the firstborn son of the overtaken"

That's a beauty !!

[TFSA]

I’ve rewatched a few times the gasly - ocon incident and to be honest I do not understand the furore against Ocon.

I get it from a team mate perspective, but racing wise the move ocon pulled was entirely within the rules, he didn’t leave track, he was ahead at the apex (which we learned in miami entitles the overtaking driver to the firstborn son of the overtaken), as overtaking driver he should have left some space and thus is a bit at fault, but if the reasoning for Kmag is that he should have braked, then Gasly was beaten and should have given up and instead stayed there.

So I don’t get it…

Being ahead at the apex entitles Ocon to space. It does not mean that Gasly has been "beaten" and has to disappear - especially when he can't.

The guidelines for overtaking clearly states, that an overtake must be done in a safe and controlled manner. Ocon squeezing Gasly against the wall with nowhere to go can hardly be considered safe.

I agree that i don't understand the furrore. On The Race podcast, one of the participants agrees with this, and states that Ocon kinda got 80% of the move done, but then was a bit over-optimistic on the exit. It was a bit of an optimistic move, but hardly worthy of the anger he's getting. Magnussen on Perez was also a bit optimistic.

[basti313]

I would go with something like, special tires, softer than the C5, no other compounds for this event, all sets are of this special compound.
Obligatory passages through the pits(changing tires optional), 1 or 2, must be done under green flag conditions no SC or VSC allowed, you can change tires during these periods but it doesn't count for your obligatory pit trips.

Well...they do not even have to go for special tires. Just not use the C3. It is just a stupid rule to have a tire that can go twice the race distance just by the rule. If they would just go with C5 and C4 or maybe even just the C5 it would be a good solution.

[langedweil]

I would go with something like, special tires, softer than the C5, no other compounds for this event, all sets are of this special compound.
Obligatory passages through the pits(changing tires optional), 1 or 2, must be done under green flag conditions no SC or VSC allowed, you can change tires during these periods but it doesn't count for your obligatory pit trips.

Well...they do not even have to go for special tires. Just not use the C3. It is just a stupid rule to have a tire that can go twice the race distance just by the rule. If they would just go with C5 and C4 or maybe even just the C5 it would be a good solution.

I'd opt for C5 only then ..

[basti313]

I would go with something like, special tires, softer than the C5, no other compounds for this event, all sets are of this special compound.
Obligatory passages through the pits(changing tires optional), 1 or 2, must be done under green flag conditions no SC or VSC allowed, you can change tires during these periods but it doesn't count for your obligatory pit trips.

Well...they do not even have to go for special tires. Just not use the C3. It is just a stupid rule to have a tire that can go twice the race distance just by the rule. If they would just go with C5 and C4 or maybe even just the C5 it would be a good solution.

I'd opt for C5 only then ..

Yes...I just had a look at the timing and Stroll basically did 25 laps in a for him good pace on the C5 without signs that show much degradation. So the C4 and C5 do not even make sense, that would still be a one-stopper at max.

[CHT]

After watching the perez haas incidents from fans video somehow I feel that Perez may be partly to be blamed for incident. coming out of turn 1 Perez car seem to struggle to accelerate in comparison to those infront and the Hass at the back. What meant to be a fight between Haas has turned into 3 cars carnage

[TFSA]

After watching the perez haas incidents from fans video somehow I feel that Perez may be partly to be blamed for incident. coming out of turn 1 Perez car seem to struggle to accelerate in comparison to those infront and the Hass at the back. What meant to be a fight between Haas has turned into 3 cars carnage

This angle - picture taken at the point of contact - shows that Perez certainly didn't have to squeeze him, and could have given him space.

I think Perez simply assumed that Hulkenberg was on his left side, which is why he decided to close on the right side instead. Too many cars to watch, which is why i feel that labeling it as a racing incident is fair. Had Hulkenberg not been there, i would certainly put the blame on Perez.

[CHT]

After watching the perez haas incidents from fans video somehow I feel that Perez may be partly to be blamed for incident. coming out of turn 1 Perez car seem to struggle to accelerate in comparison to those infront and the Hass at the back. What meant to be a fight between Haas has turned into 3 cars carnage

This angle - picture taken at the point of contact - shows that Perez certainly didn't have to squeeze him, and could have given him space.

I think Perez simply assumed that Hulkenberg was on his left side, which is why he decided to close on the right side instead. Too many cars to watch, which is why i feel that labeling it as a racing incident is fair. Had Hulkenberg not been there, i would certainly put the blame on Perez.

https://i.imgur.com/ubNE9Na.png

You can also see the gap between Perez and the car infront. If Perez is couple of meters ahead he may be able to escape the incident..

[Seanspeed]

After watching the perez haas incidents from fans video somehow I feel that Perez may be partly to be blamed for incident. coming out of turn 1 Perez car seem to struggle to accelerate in comparison to those infront and the Hass at the back. What meant to be a fight between Haas has turned into 3 cars carnage

This angle - picture taken at the point of contact - shows that Perez certainly didn't have to squeeze him, and could have given him space.

I think Perez simply assumed that Hulkenberg was on his left side, which is why he decided to close on the right side instead. Too many cars to watch, which is why i feel that labeling it as a racing incident is fair. Had Hulkenberg not been there, i would certainly put the blame on Perez.

https://i.imgur.com/ubNE9Na.png

I think racing incident is fair given it's a first lap on a tight track with three cars in close proximity, but I will say that if any blame HAD to be apportioned, it would be on Perez to me. There was nothing wrong with Kevin trying to pull up into an open gap. You of course have to trust the car ahead sees you and leaves you room, but if they dont, it's not your fault if they squeeze over, either.

Imagine how crazy that would be in basically any other situation: two cars going down a straight, and the car behind moves to the right to get alongside, but then the car ahead just moves over and pushes the other driver off-track before they can get far enough alongside to be more clearly visible. And then blaming the car BEHIND for it. That's what people are doing here blaming Kevin. There was room, and if Perez wanted to defend over to the right, then he did so too late.

People can blame the slightly swervy nature of that portion of the track, but there was room for both of them. And if Perez misjudged that Nico was alongside on the left, that's still his fault. Maybe an understandable one, and why I too think racing incident is fair, but Perez was the one who misjudged things ultimately.

[Sevach]

Monaco was very often decided on Saturday. Everyone knows that and it's okay.
That's why it's the iconic Monaco.

Sorry but I have to disagree, it´s not okay, it´s been a subject of debate for years, or even decades

Monaco is iconic for races from many many years ago, Senna is probably main responsible, but not only Ayrton. Since then, wich coincidentally is since aero became key in F1, it´s been an extremelly boring GP. That´s more than 2 decades ago!

Nowadays race leader can be, and actually have been in past GPs, 6-7 seconds per lap slower than possible, and none was able to even try a pass. To me that is not racing, it´s a gimmick. I think people understimate how slow is doing 6-7 seconds slower laptimes.

Actually, 1:20 wich was race pace for first laps is pretty close to GP2 pole... That´s not what I expect from a F1 GP race

Senna himself was a good 2s slower than Mansell in the 92 race final laps, Senna in a tire that had done the whole race Mansell on fresh less than 10 lap old tires in addition to the Williams superiority.

I also think drivers are very conscious of damaging their cars these days, in the 90s we would see more people try an "Ocon" if we had someone driving super slow infront, Panis 96 bumped Irvine in the "Grand Hotel" hairpin, now we don't get guys trying to stick their noses in and hoping for the best, everyone knew they had to settle.

Or this.

[bluechris]

This were good times with men behind the wheels, not like the current primadonas and zilly boyz...