2024 Aston Martin | Aramco F1 Team

[selvam_e2002]

any interesting news from today tyre test?

[Sherrinford]

Maybe to 2025 they could make the car similar to"Bahrain 2023" when they understood the car with that flexible wing. Im suposing guys, i dont know about nothing, just suposing. Maybe they building the AMR25 with a flexible concept they can improve something. AMR24 looks like wrong and if they really understood where and what is the problem, could be more interesting put focus on AMR25 after summer break. If they continious doing test, they dont know nothing.

You can't go back to the AMR23, the concept was too slow, they've moved on. Also, the issues they've encountered are likely limits you only hit when you get to a certain level of DF.
I noticed the upgrade the RB20 got that Max didn't like, seemed to try to add some push out in front of sidepods. That was a traight of the AMR23. It's likely where it lost the low speed traction.

For me the problem is purely mechanical, which is why the updates don't change much. Aerodynamics in this case is secondary. That front suspension above all doesn't convince me

[diffuser]

Maybe to 2025 they could make the car similar to"Bahrain 2023" when they understood the car with that flexible wing. Im suposing guys, i dont know about nothing, just suposing. Maybe they building the AMR25 with a flexible concept they can improve something. AMR24 looks like wrong and if they really understood where and what is the problem, could be more interesting put focus on AMR25 after summer break. If they continious doing test, they dont know nothing.

You can't go back to the AMR23, the concept was too slow, they've moved on. Also, the issues they've encountered are likely limits you only hit when you get to a certain level of DF.
I noticed the upgrade the RB20 got that Max didn't like, seemed to try to add some push out in front of sidepods. That was a traight of the AMR23. It's likely where it lost the low speed traction.

For me the problem is purely mechanical, which is why the updates don't change much. Aerodynamics in this case is secondary. That front suspension above all doesn't convince me

I love it when people say stuff like that. What data do you have that shows that?

[OnEcRiTiCaL]

You can't go back to the AMR23, the concept was too slow, they've moved on. Also, the issues they've encountered are likely limits you only hit when you get to a certain level of DF.
I noticed the upgrade the RB20 got that Max didn't like, seemed to try to add some push out in front of sidepods. That was a traight of the AMR23. It's likely where it lost the low speed traction.

For me the problem is purely mechanical, which is why the updates don't change much. Aerodynamics in this case is secondary. That front suspension above all doesn't convince me

I love it when people say stuff like that. What data do you have that shows that?

I think Monaco, shitty performance proved his statement. I mean in Monaco very important the mechanical grip and they were nowhere.

[peewon]

Maybe to 2025 they could make the car similar to"Bahrain 2023" when they understood the car with that flexible wing. Im suposing guys, i dont know about nothing, just suposing. Maybe they building the AMR25 with a flexible concept they can improve something. AMR24 looks like wrong and if they really understood where and what is the problem, could be more interesting put focus on AMR25 after summer break. If they continious doing test, they dont know nothing.

You can't go back to the AMR23, the concept was too slow, they've moved on. Also, the issues they've encountered are likely limits you only hit when you get to a certain level of DF.
I noticed the upgrade the RB20 got that Max didn't like, seemed to try to add some push out in front of sidepods. That was a traight of the AMR23. It's likely where it lost the low speed traction.

For me the problem is purely mechanical, which is why the updates don't change much. Aerodynamics in this case is secondary. That front suspension above all doesn't convince me

I think there is some validity to that thinking. Newey himself solely focused on the suspension for the new regs. I think where teams (like Aston and Mercedes) made mistakes is they went chasing peak downforce figures not realising how sensitive the cars are to ride heights and changes to it. Stable platform seems to be more important than absolute downforce figures in ideal conditions.

[zoroastar]

For me the problem is purely mechanical, which is why the updates don't change much. Aerodynamics in this case is secondary. That front suspension above all doesn't convince me

I love it when people say stuff like that. What data do you have that shows that?

I think Monaco, shitty performance proved his statement. I mean in Monaco very important the mechanical grip and they were nowhere.

im sure aston would admit that they need to get better in both areas (mechanical and aero) as well as strategy. trying to single out one area where they need to improve is sorta useless when you are comparing yourself to other teams, that have been doing it better. theres not one single area where this car needs to improve. the same can be said for every team probably, to different extents

[diffuser]

For me the problem is purely mechanical, which is why the updates don't change much. Aerodynamics in this case is secondary. That front suspension above all doesn't convince me

I love it when people say stuff like that. What data do you have that shows that?

I think Monaco, shitty performance proved his statement. I mean in Monaco very important the mechanical grip and they were nowhere.

Well that's a good argument.

Didn't Alonso say he should have qualified much higher than he did? He was held back by traffic?

[-wkst-]

On the other side they had a great Monaco race in 2023.

So the mechanical side was good in 2023, but bad in 2024? Hard to believe.

I am also supporting the theory that it's a combination of some factors. Aero and mechanical. Maybe they concentrated too much on a slippery car as well.

And let's not forget the tyres, Vasseur said to Schmidt that (understanding) the tyres is worth much more than any updates...

[AR3-GP]

And let's not forget the tyres, Vasseur said to Schmidt that (understanding) the tyres is worth much more than any updates...

This is true. If the car does not keep the tires in the right temperature window, the downforce is meaningless.

[Nikosar]

On the other side they had a great Monaco race in 2023.

So the mechanical side was good in 2023, but bad in 2024? Hard to believe.

I am also supporting the theory that it's a combination of some factors. Aero and mechanical. Maybe they concentrated too much on a slippery car as well.

And let's not forget the tyres, Vasseur said to Schmidt that (understanding) the tyres is worth much more than any updates...

Yeah, Krack back in March said that they were happy with the Mercedes suspension and the issue came from the tyres. However during the last race tyres deg and tyre temp was slightly better. Slow progress but still a progress’s.

[diffuser]

On the other side they had a great Monaco race in 2023.

So the mechanical side was good in 2023, but bad in 2024? Hard to believe.

I am also supporting the theory that it's a combination of some factors. Aero and mechanical. Maybe they concentrated too much on a slippery car as well.

And let's not forget the tyres, Vasseur said to Schmidt that (understanding) the tyres is worth much more than any updates...

Yeah, Krack back in March said that they were happy with the Mercedes suspension and the issue came from the tyres. However during the last race tyres deg and tyre temp was slightly better. Slow progress but still a progress’s.

Like I said before...because of the wet quali, they ran more DF than they would normally run at SPA. This resulted in the slow top speeds and the one stop race. Think you need to take our impressions of the car's change in traights from SPA with a grain of salt.

[Nikosar]

On the other side they had a great Monaco race in 2023.

So the mechanical side was good in 2023, but bad in 2024? Hard to believe.

I am also supporting the theory that it's a combination of some factors. Aero and mechanical. Maybe they concentrated too much on a slippery car as well.

And let's not forget the tyres, Vasseur said to Schmidt that (understanding) the tyres is worth much more than any updates...

Yeah, Krack back in March said that they were happy with the Mercedes suspension and the issue came from the tyres. However during the last race tyres deg and tyre temp was slightly better. Slow progress but still a progress’s.

Like I said before...because of the wet quali, they ran more DF than they would normally run at SPA. This resulted in the slow top speeds and the one stop race. Think you need to take our impressions of the car's change in traights from SPA with a grain of salt.

Alright thank you for the clarification, I thought more DF would stress the tyre more.

[Sherrinford]

You can't go back to the AMR23, the concept was too slow, they've moved on. Also, the issues they've encountered are likely limits you only hit when you get to a certain level of DF.
I noticed the upgrade the RB20 got that Max didn't like, seemed to try to add some push out in front of sidepods. That was a traight of the AMR23. It's likely where it lost the low speed traction.

For me the problem is purely mechanical, which is why the updates don't change much. Aerodynamics in this case is secondary. That front suspension above all doesn't convince me

I love it when people say stuff like that. What data do you have that shows that?

In addition to the performance of Monaco as mentioned by the other user, they stated that the car is very sensitive to driving heights, so they cannot find a correct set-up in my opinion to not good mechanical. Among other things, they have had understeer at the front since the beginning of the season. If you then go and look at the suspension itself (there are images to prove it) they have maintained, the front end square and not V-shaped like the Redbull, plus others solutions that differ from the competition.

[Sherrinford]

I also add the flow viz in the February tests the flow comes off from the sidepods, that was lack of correlation to the front. That's what I think, but I don't think I'm far from the truth

[diffuser]

For me the problem is purely mechanical, which is why the updates don't change much. Aerodynamics in this case is secondary. That front suspension above all doesn't convince me

I love it when people say stuff like that. What data do you have that shows that?

In addition to the performance of Monaco as mentioned by the other user, they stated that the car is very sensitive to driving heights, so they cannot find a correct set-up in my opinion to not good mechanical. Among other things, they have had understeer at the front since the beginning of the season. If you then go and look at the suspension itself (there are images to prove it) they have maintained, the front end square and not V-shaped like the Redbull, plus others solutions that differ from the competition.

Like I said about Monaco, Alonso got traffic in Quali, he would have qualified higher.

The "sensitive to ride height" to me is a DF thing. Small changes to ride height lead to too big increase or decrease of DF. The floor DF is too peaky. Plus, since the floor is atleast 3 parts, Front, middle, and diffuser (the 3 air exits on the floor). You can see how change in floor height can cause a loss Of DF on the front part of the floor leading to understeer.

Now it could be a suspension thing, in that the suspension is unable to keep the car in a "as constant" ride height as other cars do but I have no data on that.

That's my understanding anyways. Doesn't mean I'm right.