2024 Visa Cash App RB Team

This forum contains threads to discuss teams themselves. Anything not technical about the cars, including restructuring, performances etc belongs here.
Dunlay
Dunlay
1
Joined: 10 Mar 2024, 15:23

Re: 2024 Visa Cash App RB Team

Post

djos wrote:
23 Sep 2024, 13:30
avantman wrote:
23 Sep 2024, 11:41
He wanted to come back to fight for grand prix wins, not to fight with Ocon and Gasly for P12. Red bull managers took him back with that in mind as well, thinking he might be good enough outpace Tsunoda quite comfortably and then possibly take Perez seat.
Looking at where red bull racing are now, and most likely will be the next year as well - not in a position to fight for race wins even with Max...I don't feel like we or he should be sad now, it probably feels like deliverance, liberation for him finally...well sort of. If it all ended in abu-dhabi 2022, being bought out of his contract and shown the door effectively midseason, never having a 2nd chance in other team....all that would feel far worse I think, both for Daniel and his fans. He didn't look devastated to me, liberated rather. And we can see how thankful he is to red bull and everything they, Horner, Marko, have done to him... fans will feel always aggrieved of course.
Fans that feel aggrieved need to grow up, F1 is brutal - I feel sad and disappointed that things didn’t pan out.

The only thing I’m angry about is Maclaren corrupting Daniel’s driving style, instead of fixing their PoS weird handling car years ago! Lando was on record complaining about it for 4 years. It seems firing James key was something they should have done a long time ago.

One other thing that is obvious to me, is Daniel has always been decent in average cars, but Mega in good cars! It’s kinda weird to think about, especially when you have other drivers that have been great in average cars, and rubbish in fast cars.
I haven't read another more weird comment that that. Going by that logic, Red Bull should have fired Newey umpteen number of times since 2018 looking at how undrivable the cars were. A driver with adaptable skills managed to get some good results to keep Newey going. In case of Daniel, he simply didn't know how to adapt to differing cars while Lando did. If teams keep firing staff because a sensitive driver can't drive slightly difficult cars, then nobody would be left in F1 to design cars.

User avatar
djos
113
Joined: 19 May 2006, 06:09
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: 2024 Visa Cash App RB Team

Post

Dunlay wrote:
23 Sep 2024, 13:46
djos wrote:
23 Sep 2024, 13:30
avantman wrote:
23 Sep 2024, 11:41
He wanted to come back to fight for grand prix wins, not to fight with Ocon and Gasly for P12. Red bull managers took him back with that in mind as well, thinking he might be good enough outpace Tsunoda quite comfortably and then possibly take Perez seat.
Looking at where red bull racing are now, and most likely will be the next year as well - not in a position to fight for race wins even with Max...I don't feel like we or he should be sad now, it probably feels like deliverance, liberation for him finally...well sort of. If it all ended in abu-dhabi 2022, being bought out of his contract and shown the door effectively midseason, never having a 2nd chance in other team....all that would feel far worse I think, both for Daniel and his fans. He didn't look devastated to me, liberated rather. And we can see how thankful he is to red bull and everything they, Horner, Marko, have done to him... fans will feel always aggrieved of course.
Fans that feel aggrieved need to grow up, F1 is brutal - I feel sad and disappointed that things didn’t pan out.

The only thing I’m angry about is Maclaren corrupting Daniel’s driving style, instead of fixing their PoS weird handling car years ago! Lando was on record complaining about it for 4 years. It seems firing James key was something they should have done a long time ago.

One other thing that is obvious to me, is Daniel has always been decent in average cars, but Mega in good cars! It’s kinda weird to think about, especially when you have other drivers that have been great in average cars, and rubbish in fast cars.
I haven't read another more weird comment that that. Going by that logic, Red Bull should have fired Newey umpteen number of times since 2018 looking at how undrivable the cars were. A driver with adaptable skills managed to get some good results to keep Newey going. In case of Daniel, he simply didn't know how to adapt to differing cars while Lando did. If teams keep firing staff because a sensitive driver can't drive slightly difficult cars, then nobody would be left in F1 to design cars.
What undrivable cars? This year is the first time since Mark and Seb drove for RBR that the car handling has been an issue.
"In downforce we trust"

User avatar
djos
113
Joined: 19 May 2006, 06:09
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: 2024 Visa Cash App RB Team

Post

There are some very interesting, but wild theories popping up already:

https://apple.news/AZIJcW9tzSauJwwhCux3W1Q


And Ricciardo?

Do not underestimate the strength of the affection the team – particularly Horner – has for him after all they achieved together the first time around and all the time and effort spent getting him back into shape following his departure from McLaren two years ago.

He has disappointed since his return last year, yet his strongest – and most relevant – performance since 2022 came not in a qualifying session or race for AlphaTauri/VCARB, but in the Pirelli tyre test he spent behind the wheel of the Red Bull RB19 at Silverstone last July.

That his fastest lap would have been good enough for second on the grid for the British Grand Prix two days earlier only supported the theory, stretching all the way back to when he emerged out of nowhere to run Sebastian Vettel out of town in 2014, that Ricciardo only excels in good, well-balanced cars with lots of downforce.

Enough to unlock the Daniel of old, all smiles ‘n’ shoeys on the top step of the podium? Perhaps not. Not at this advanced stage of his career.

But certainly enough for him to act as a very competent wingman to Verstappen – and without the wild fluctuations of Perez, back to his anonymous worst in Singapore after showing signs of life in Baku.

So how’s this for a season-ending scenario?

Ricciardo sits out the next three races, getting all the VCARB out of his system with some work away from the spotlight in the Red Bull simulator, and maybe even a TPC test or two, before stepping into Perez’s car for the final three races when the Mexican GP is over and done with.

With the Constructors’ Championship likely to have all but gone to McLaren by then, both team and driver will have nothing left to lose.

If it works out, Red Bull have a ready-made replacement for Perez for F1 2025.

And if it doesn’t? Daniel can finally walk away from F1 safe in the knowledge that he was given the opportunity he always craved back in a Red Bull and failed to make the most of it.

With a guard of honour waiting for him in the paddock after the race, Singapore may have looked for all the world like the end of the road for Ricciardo.
"In downforce we trust"

User avatar
djos
113
Joined: 19 May 2006, 06:09
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: 2024 Visa Cash App RB Team

Post

The Twitter’sphere is getting stuck into Sergio…

https://apple.news/A6AnL-yWJRj6h5vTPl3cOAg

These posts seems pretty representative:



"In downforce we trust"

User avatar
ispano6
153
Joined: 09 Mar 2017, 23:56
Location: my playseat

Re: 2024 Visa Cash App RB Team

Post

Ricciardo should have never left the RedBull family. Enticed by Cyril and doubtful of Honda's power units. I suppose Ricciardo could have his revenge on McLaren and Lando by taking fastest lap if Max wins by a point.

User avatar
PlatinumZealot
559
Joined: 12 Jun 2008, 03:45

Re: 2024 Visa Cash App RB Team

Post

PlatinumZealot wrote:
03 Jul 2024, 05:05
Today I learned that Daniel is being used as a gauge for Yuki's development.
"Bayer acknowledged the increased expectation on Ricciardo as a result of that experience, saying: “We don’t need to develop Daniel. He came into the team to perform and to help us with Yuki.”

“Between Daniel and Yuki, Daniel has been part of that Yuki development project. At the same time, we obviously were also expecting from him as a very fast and experienced driver, we were expecting performance from him and we are expecting performance from him.”"

https://www.planetf1.com/news/daniel-ri ... er-austria
Remember this guys?!! :idea:

Well he has been developing Yuki.. But he hasnt been performing...

So basically Daniel has gone past his "racing usefulness" to RedBull.
🖐️✌️☝️👀👌✍️🐎🏆🙏

Racing Green in 2028

User avatar
PlatinumZealot
559
Joined: 12 Jun 2008, 03:45

Re: 2024 Visa Cash App RB Team

Post

djos wrote:
23 Sep 2024, 12:59
A sad day, that is for sure.

Laurent said they had to pit Daniel early to clear debris from a brake duct. Still getting the medium tires to last as long as he did was a great effort.

It was nice of the team to give Daniel the chance to grab the fastest lap of the race at the end. Classy move!

It was nice of them to welcome him back into the RedBull family after he walked out on them. This is why he's not angry at them despite them not handling this situation better. He reminds of the prodigal son in the Bible.
🖐️✌️☝️👀👌✍️🐎🏆🙏

Racing Green in 2028

User avatar
djos
113
Joined: 19 May 2006, 06:09
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: 2024 Visa Cash App RB Team

Post

ispano6 wrote:
24 Sep 2024, 01:36
Ricciardo should have never left the RedBull family. Enticed by Cyril and doubtful of Honda's power units. I suppose Ricciardo could have his revenge on McLaren and Lando by taking fastest lap if Max wins by a point.
I agree, he got sold a lemon. Apparently the company managing him the time pushed him to leave RBR - they probably saw the commission potential, and didn’t care about anything else.
"In downforce we trust"

User avatar
djos
113
Joined: 19 May 2006, 06:09
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: 2024 Visa Cash App RB Team

Post

PlatinumZealot wrote:
24 Sep 2024, 01:55
PlatinumZealot wrote:
03 Jul 2024, 05:05
Today I learned that Daniel is being used as a gauge for Yuki's development.
"Bayer acknowledged the increased expectation on Ricciardo as a result of that experience, saying: “We don’t need to develop Daniel. He came into the team to perform and to help us with Yuki.”

“Between Daniel and Yuki, Daniel has been part of that Yuki development project. At the same time, we obviously were also expecting from him as a very fast and experienced driver, we were expecting performance from him and we are expecting performance from him.”"

https://www.planetf1.com/news/daniel-ri ... er-austria
Remember this guys?!! :idea:

Well he has been developing Yuki.. But he hasnt been performing...

So basically Daniel has gone past his "racing usefulness" to RedBull.
Aside from being beaten in qually, Daniel has generally had better races in the 2nd quarter of the season than Yuki.
"In downforce we trust"

Dunlay
Dunlay
1
Joined: 10 Mar 2024, 15:23

Re: 2024 Visa Cash App RB Team

Post

djos wrote:
24 Sep 2024, 04:47
ispano6 wrote:
24 Sep 2024, 01:36
Ricciardo should have never left the RedBull family. Enticed by Cyril and doubtful of Honda's power units. I suppose Ricciardo could have his revenge on McLaren and Lando by taking fastest lap if Max wins by a point.
I agree, he got sold a lemon. Apparently the company managing him the time pushed him to leave RBR - they probably saw the commission potential, and didn’t care about anything else.
He was a grown up man and fully aware of his decisions and he took the decision with full knowledge of what he was doing, despite Dietrich asking him to not leave and offering same compensation as what Renault offered at the time. Blaming his management company is useless. Every man has to own responsibility of his decisions.

Dunlay
Dunlay
1
Joined: 10 Mar 2024, 15:23

Re: 2024 Visa Cash App RB Team

Post

djos wrote:
23 Sep 2024, 13:49
Dunlay wrote:
23 Sep 2024, 13:46
djos wrote:
23 Sep 2024, 13:30


Fans that feel aggrieved need to grow up, F1 is brutal - I feel sad and disappointed that things didn’t pan out.

The only thing I’m angry about is Maclaren corrupting Daniel’s driving style, instead of fixing their PoS weird handling car years ago! Lando was on record complaining about it for 4 years. It seems firing James key was something they should have done a long time ago.

One other thing that is obvious to me, is Daniel has always been decent in average cars, but Mega in good cars! It’s kinda weird to think about, especially when you have other drivers that have been great in average cars, and rubbish in fast cars.
I haven't read another more weird comment that that. Going by that logic, Red Bull should have fired Newey umpteen number of times since 2018 looking at how undrivable the cars were. A driver with adaptable skills managed to get some good results to keep Newey going. In case of Daniel, he simply didn't know how to adapt to differing cars while Lando did. If teams keep firing staff because a sensitive driver can't drive slightly difficult cars, then nobody would be left in F1 to design cars.
What undrivable cars? This year is the first time since Mark and Seb drove for RBR that the car handling has been an issue.
Gasly and Albon agree with this.

Here is a sample.

Jul 18, 2020
https://www.the-race.com/formula-1/is-r ... -an-idiot/
That tallies with Verstappen’s complaint of multiple problems at different stages. It is entirely consistent with a car that is on a knife-edge, one that swaps end without much (or any) warning for the driver.

Such a characteristic will not breed confidence for those behind the wheel, potentially inducing understeer if they are not active enough with the steering or triggering a slide or a spin if they try to attack a corner. And that is not isolated to this weekend.

“I’ve been spinning before, so it’s not like it only happens this weekend,” says Verstappen.

“Clearly so far this year it’s not been the easiest car to drive.

User avatar
djos
113
Joined: 19 May 2006, 06:09
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: 2024 Visa Cash App RB Team

Post

Dunlay wrote:
24 Sep 2024, 05:05
djos wrote:
24 Sep 2024, 04:47
ispano6 wrote:
24 Sep 2024, 01:36
Ricciardo should have never left the RedBull family. Enticed by Cyril and doubtful of Honda's power units. I suppose Ricciardo could have his revenge on McLaren and Lando by taking fastest lap if Max wins by a point.
I agree, he got sold a lemon. Apparently the company managing him the time pushed him to leave RBR - they probably saw the commission potential, and didn’t care about anything else.
He was a grown up man and fully aware of his decisions and he took the decision with full knowledge of what he was doing, despite Dietrich asking him to not leave and offering same compensation as what Renault offered at the time. Blaming his management company is useless. Every man has to own responsibility of his decisions.
I don’t disagree with you, but I’ve seen advisors in my corporate life push for bad decisions to be made that suit their vested interests, and get their way. They’ll use every tiny thing, and amplify it to justify their position.

The old adage of repeating things often till it becomes the truth, is not restricted to politics.
"In downforce we trust"

User avatar
djos
113
Joined: 19 May 2006, 06:09
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: 2024 Visa Cash App RB Team

Post

Dunlay wrote:
24 Sep 2024, 05:07
djos wrote:
23 Sep 2024, 13:49
Dunlay wrote:
23 Sep 2024, 13:46
I haven't read another more weird comment that that. Going by that logic, Red Bull should have fired Newey umpteen number of times since 2018 looking at how undrivable the cars were. A driver with adaptable skills managed to get some good results to keep Newey going. In case of Daniel, he simply didn't know how to adapt to differing cars while Lando did. If teams keep firing staff because a sensitive driver can't drive slightly difficult cars, then nobody would be left in F1 to design cars.
What undrivable cars? This year is the first time since Mark and Seb drove for RBR that the car handling has been an issue.
Gasly and Albon agree with this.

Here is a sample.

Jul 18, 2020
https://www.the-race.com/formula-1/is-r ... -an-idiot/
That tallies with Verstappen’s complaint of multiple problems at different stages. It is entirely consistent with a car that is on a knife-edge, one that swaps end without much (or any) warning for the driver.

Such a characteristic will not breed confidence for those behind the wheel, potentially inducing understeer if they are not active enough with the steering or triggering a slide or a spin if they try to attack a corner. And that is not isolated to this weekend.

“I’ve been spinning before, so it’s not like it only happens this weekend,” says Verstappen.

“Clearly so far this year it’s not been the easiest car to drive.
They did fix those issues tho, and Alex still couldn’t cope.

Gasly was a different case, he thought he could play Prima Donna and simply shot himself in both feet, annoying the team in the process.
"In downforce we trust"

Dunlay
Dunlay
1
Joined: 10 Mar 2024, 15:23

Re: 2024 Visa Cash App RB Team

Post

djos wrote:
24 Sep 2024, 05:54
Dunlay wrote:
24 Sep 2024, 05:07
djos wrote:
23 Sep 2024, 13:49

What undrivable cars? This year is the first time since Mark and Seb drove for RBR that the car handling has been an issue.
Gasly and Albon agree with this.

Here is a sample.

Jul 18, 2020
https://www.the-race.com/formula-1/is-r ... -an-idiot/
That tallies with Verstappen’s complaint of multiple problems at different stages. It is entirely consistent with a car that is on a knife-edge, one that swaps end without much (or any) warning for the driver.

Such a characteristic will not breed confidence for those behind the wheel, potentially inducing understeer if they are not active enough with the steering or triggering a slide or a spin if they try to attack a corner. And that is not isolated to this weekend.

“I’ve been spinning before, so it’s not like it only happens this weekend,” says Verstappen.

“Clearly so far this year it’s not been the easiest car to drive.
They did fix those issues tho, and Alex still couldn’t cope.

Gasly was a different case, he thought he could play Prima Donna and simply shot himself in both feet, annoying the team in the process.
Same applies to Daniel's situation at McLaren. They fixed the issues, he still couldn't cope.

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/arti ... 8ZpNFRZJRi

User avatar
djos
113
Joined: 19 May 2006, 06:09
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: 2024 Visa Cash App RB Team

Post

Dunlay wrote:
24 Sep 2024, 06:09
djos wrote:
24 Sep 2024, 05:54
Dunlay wrote:
24 Sep 2024, 05:07
Gasly and Albon agree with this.

Here is a sample.

Jul 18, 2020
https://www.the-race.com/formula-1/is-r ... -an-idiot/

They did fix those issues tho, and Alex still couldn’t cope.

Gasly was a different case, he thought he could play Prima Donna and simply shot himself in both feet, annoying the team in the process.
Same applies to Daniel's situation at McLaren. They fixed the issues, he still couldn't cope.

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/arti ... 8ZpNFRZJRi
That was just the bad brake issue they started the season with, the car had the same handling issues even after Daniel left.



https://f1i.com/news/501584-norris-mcla ... ement.html
Queried on McLaren’s prospects next weekend in Jeddah’s high-speed environment, Norris believes the Saudi track should better suit the team’s MCL38.

"But it's also a track where you want to have a good front at apex and this is something we don't have at all, so there are still going to be things we're going to struggle with a lot.
"In downforce we trust"