620kg

[gibells]

Is there some kind of innovation the teams could add to their cars next year, rather than just bumping up the weight with ballast?

Something like bigger water pumps/cooling system for a hotter engine, or something?

Just wondering if it's a way one team can steal the march on the others.

[Callum]

The thing about increasing the weight of components of the car is that they don't really have a choice of where to add the weight. For example a bigger water pump will always be near the middle of the car. Whereas with ballast they can actually choose the placement and help alter the cars ballance.

[RH1300S]

You know what - the 'innovation' is KERS. Despite the FOTA teams saying they won't use it.

It seems to me that the KERS advantage will surely be useful when cars start with a full tank of fuel onboard.

Ermmm......hot engines? I don't recall the last time anyone had a particular problem with engines overheating unless there was specific damage to the system - they don't need to look very hard at this area of car design (IMHO)

[machin]

Ermmm......hot engines? I don't recall the last time anyone had a particular problem with engines overheating unless there was specific damage to the system - they don't need to look very hard at this area of car design (IMHO)

Engine cooling is always an issue.. check out the times in the past that bigger cooling vents are added when the teams go to hot countries.... I think he was suggesting using a bigger water pump to enable smaller radiators to be used (i.e if you pump the water round the system quicker you can maintain a bigger temperature difference between the ambient air and the engine water coming out of the engine and that leads to a higher energy flow between the two)... then you gain on the aero as smaller side-pods can be used....

[mike]

i thought the pressure of water is regulated to 4 bar or something and not matter how big you pump is the rate of heat added is always the same, so there is no point doing that.

maybe add leather seats and climate air conditioning and sat-nav, or even i-pod connection on the cars to make the driver more comfortable.

[Belatti]

You know what - the 'innovation' is KERS. Despite the FOTA teams saying they won't use it.

It seems to me that the KERS advantage will surely be useful when cars start with a full tank of fuel onboard.

Indeed!

And I would like to see the KERS max power rule taken further... more powerful, light and so useful KERS would let the technology go the step foward it needs.

[scarbs]

I think most teams will simply use the 20Kg to house yet more ballast where ever its needed next year. With the slimmer front tyres and longer fuel tanks some flexibility in weight bias will be useful. Although a small amount of the extra weight will be taken up on the larger monocoque, but probably less than 5Kg of it.

[jddh1]

What about moving this ballast mass? Say, you have 5 slabs of metal. You build in a mechanism to slide one slab at a time further towards the center as fuel is consumed. (Thinking of ballast mass at the nose/cockpit area.) I am not sure if this is legal or even thought of before.

[sticky667]

"moveable aero" hahahahah

[gridwalker]

What about moving this ballast mass? Say, you have 5 slabs of metal. You build in a mechanism to slide one slab at a time further towards the center as fuel is consumed. (Thinking of ballast mass at the nose/cockpit area.) I am not sure if this is legal or even thought of before.

Movable ballast has been banned since lead shot was found in the water tanks of a Tyrrel (I think it was in 1984, correct me if I'm wrong : no time to research it) ... back then, they were allowed to top up the water tanks & many people think that the lead shot was added in order to push the car up to minimum weight.

So, yeah, Tyrrell said it was movable ballast & it has been banned ever since.

[jddh1]

What about moving this ballast mass? Say, you have 5 slabs of metal. You build in a mechanism to slide one slab at a time further towards the center as fuel is consumed. (Thinking of ballast mass at the nose/cockpit area.) I am not sure if this is legal or even thought of before.

Movable ballast has been banned since lead shot was found in the water tanks of a Tyrrel (I think it was in 1984, correct me if I'm wrong : no time to research it) ... back then, they were allowed to top up the water tanks & many people think that the lead shot was added in order to push the car up to minimum weight.

So, yeah, Tyrrell said it was movable ballast & it has been banned ever since.

Thanks grid.

[Shrek]

Ok here is what i'm thinking, i like the idea of adding weight to get better cooling thus to get better aero, but i was also thinking if you're going to add weight to the front wing, make the front wing heavier(ie made from steel, tungsten if you got the money so more weight will be on the front).

[tahadar]

Ok here is what i'm thinking, i like the idea of adding weight to get better cooling thus to get better aero, but i was also thinking if you're going to add weight to the front wing, make the front wing heavier(ie made from steel, tungsten if you got the money so more weight will be on the front).

since the teams use ballast in the front wings anyways I dont see much of a point in making parts of the wing out of a heavy material. That would simply limit your ballast options if you wanted to take the same front wing to a different track but with a different weight distribution. i expect the extra mass to be used for ballast purposes only..

[Belatti]

What about moving this ballast mass? Say, you have 5 slabs of metal. You build in a mechanism to slide one slab at a time further towards the center as fuel is consumed. (Thinking of ballast mass at the nose/cockpit area.) I am not sure if this is legal or even thought of before.

Movable ballast has been banned since lead shot was found in the water tanks of a Tyrrel (I think it was in 1984, correct me if I'm wrong : no time to research it) ... back then, they were allowed to top up the water tanks & many people think that the lead shot was added in order to push the car up to minimum weight.

So, yeah, Tyrrell said it was movable ballast & it has been banned ever since.

And they say that nowadays F1 teams are a bunch of cheaters...

[King Six]

I hope the minimum weight increase isn't just used for ballast. I'm still hoping FOTA change their mind about KERS and it comes back next season, bigger and better (as the FIA had planned in terms of going green)

But then there's the issue of costs and FOTA not wanting any sort of "tiered" championship which a stronger KERS would inevitably bring should some teams opt out.

Not sure about better/stronger active cooling, does that sort of stuff fall under the engine freeze? (there's a pun in there, somewhere)

Also due to refuelling being banned I'm sure some of that minimum is going to be made up to accommodate a larger tank and some of the other issues that would bring...?