2024 São Paulo Grand Prix - Interlagos, Nov 01 - 03

[Sieper]

If it was LH who drove that race, everyone would be calling this the greatest drive of all time. But it's not so the magnitude of this win is downplayed to diminish Max. It's absolutely clear we have never seen talent like Max in F1 history. He is undisputed GOAT. The best driver debate should focus on the category below Max, who is beyond reproach.

1. Max Verstappen


<Massive gap>

2. Lewis
3. Schumacher

Nah it's not the same. He was getting dropped by ocon at certain points before the red flag. The conditions came to him and he executed.

Be objective please.

Maybe because GP was telling him to be very, very careful, and he actually had championship on the line, unlike Ocon. On the radio, he told GP he wanted to try 1 lap in the worsening conditions, so no point in going balls out when you are just trying for the conditions before coming in.

Don’t reply; it was blatantly obvious he was being careful. As he was at the start (still made 6 places in one lap) and with Leclerc. Imho the race should have been red flagged at that moment. Almost everyone was on inters in those circumstances. We were just waiting for a crash to happen.

[AnthonyG]

Maybe because GP was telling him to be very, very careful, and he actually had championship on the line, unlike Ocon. On the radio, he told GP he wanted to try 1 lap in the worsening conditions, so no point in going balls out when you are just trying for the conditions before coming in.

Alpine were not getting a second chance at scoring this much points in the constructors championship, for them it was equally risky.
That being said, Ocon, Gasly and Verstappen all did a stellar job.

[basti313]

Maybe because GP was telling him to be very, very careful, and he actually had championship on the line, unlike Ocon. On the radio, he told GP he wanted to try 1 lap in the worsening conditions, so no point in going balls out when you are just trying for the conditions before coming in.

Alpine were not getting a second chance at scoring this much points in the constructors championship, for them it was equally risky.
That being said, Ocon, Gasly and Verstappen all did a stellar job.

I would question, how much rubber was left on the tires at this point. We did not see much times from Russel and Norris as Russel went off, but I think they were more than a second faster, still on relatively cold tires.
Verstappen slicing through the field certainly cost some more rubber than Ocon basically running at some gap behind Tsu?

[lh13]

It was obvious Max was taking it easy. Ocon could see where he was going, cars behind couldn't, and it was not like the cars behind were catching Max, he was dropping them as well.

Sent from my 21061119AG using Tapatalk

[avantman]

This kind of stuff turns even the most reasonable people into "conspiracy theorists".

The term "conspiracy theorist" was created in order to discredit "the most reasonable people". Doesn't necessarily mean that all "conspiracy theorists" are reasonable people.

[avantman]

Don’t reply; it was blatantly obvious he was being careful. As he was at the start (still made 6 places in one lap) and with Leclerc. Imho the race should have been red flagged at that moment. Almost everyone was on inters in those circumstances. We were just waiting for a crash to happen.

IMHO the race should NOT have been stopped due to weather. I'm normally being very critical on the race direction, but this time they did pretty much everything right.

To stop races every time when it starts to rain appears to be a modern trend, but extremely dangerous practice at the same time, which teams use strategically, at expense of safety of their drivers in order to get an advantage, to get position and tire change for free.
Kudos to Wittich for letting the race go! and yes, this come from Max fan.

What they can do though, is to force all teams to make mandatory stop for wet tire when the conditions become as bad. They should think about it at least.

[basti313]

Don’t reply; it was blatantly obvious he was being careful. As he was at the start (still made 6 places in one lap) and with Leclerc. Imho the race should have been red flagged at that moment. Almost everyone was on inters in those circumstances. We were just waiting for a crash to happen.

IMHO the race should NOT have been stopped due to weather. I'm normally being very critical on the race direction, but this time they did pretty much everything right.

To stop races every time when it starts to rain appears to be a modern trend, but extremely dangerous practice at the same time, which teams use strategically, at expense of safety of their drivers in order to get an advantage, to get position and tire change for free.
Kudos to Wittich for letting the race go! and yes, this come from Max fan.

What they can do though, is to force all teams to make mandatory stop for wet tire when the conditions become as bad. They should think about it at least.

I totally agree. From the forecast it was completely fine to go with the SC.
It was announced to rain for 4 minutes, with the field behind the SC circling, this would have ended with maybe 5-6 laps SC until the track is back in a condition where the drivers should well be able to get the car around the track on the Inters. That would have been a very fair and good solution.
The problem is, that Colapinto took the stop and then tried to reach the field as fast as he could...I did not see anyone in the pits that he was racing to be honest...he could have taken it more easy and not go flying on the spot where it is the most dangerous.

[Leon]

Albon has destroyed that

That Williams is not starting. Can he take Colapintos chassis?

is it allowed?

[search]

The problem is, that Colapinto took the stop and then tried to reach the field as fast as he could...I did not see anyone in the pits that he was racing to be honest...he could have taken it more easy and not go flying on the spot where it is the most dangerous.

after the stop, the team radioed him things about "not having to respect the delta" and being "allowed to push more till SC1", so although this was probably more of a technicality, referring to SC rules, they are partly to blame as well, I'd say.

[Bill]

Don’t reply; it was blatantly obvious he was being careful. As he was at the start (still made 6 places in one lap) and with Leclerc. Imho the race should have been red flagged at that moment. Almost everyone was on inters in those circumstances. We were just waiting for a crash to happen.

IMHO the race should NOT have been stopped due to weather. I'm normally being very critical on the race direction, but this time they did pretty much everything right.

To stop races every time when it starts to rain appears to be a modern trend, but extremely dangerous practice at the same time, which teams use strategically, at expense of safety of their drivers in order to get an advantage, to get position and tire change for free.
Kudos to Wittich for letting the race go! and yes, this come from Max fan.

What they can do though, is to force all teams to make mandatory stop for wet tire when the conditions become as bad. They should think about it at least.

I totally agree. From the forecast it was completely fine to go with the SC.
It was announced to rain for 4 minutes, with the field behind the SC circling, this would have ended with maybe 5-6 laps SC until the track is back in a condition where the drivers should well be able to get the car around the track on the Inters. That would have been a very fair and good solution.
The problem is, that Colapinto took the stop and then tried to reach the field as fast as he could...I did not see anyone in the pits that he was racing to be honest...he could have taken it more easy and not go flying on the spot where it is the most dangerous.

we got fullwets that never get used which is just wasteful. Racing before Pirelli era were conducted in treacherous conditions without safety cars and redflags.if they deploy a safety car then the position of the cars at next restart should be based on car position 5 laps prior to deployment safety car to prevent teams gaming the system.

[avantman]

IMHO the race should NOT have been stopped due to weather. I'm normally being very critical on the race direction, but this time they did pretty much everything right.

To stop races every time when it starts to rain appears to be a modern trend, but extremely dangerous practice at the same time, which teams use strategically, at expense of safety of their drivers in order to get an advantage, to get position and tire change for free.
Kudos to Wittich for letting the race go! and yes, this come from Max fan.

What they can do though, is to force all teams to make mandatory stop for wet tire when the conditions become as bad. They should think about it at least.

I totally agree. From the forecast it was completely fine to go with the SC.
It was announced to rain for 4 minutes, with the field behind the SC circling, this would have ended with maybe 5-6 laps SC until the track is back in a condition where the drivers should well be able to get the car around the track on the Inters. That would have been a very fair and good solution.
The problem is, that Colapinto took the stop and then tried to reach the field as fast as he could...I did not see anyone in the pits that he was racing to be honest...he could have taken it more easy and not go flying on the spot where it is the most dangerous.

we got fullwets that never get used which is just wasteful. Racing before Pirelli era were conducted in treacherous conditions without safety cars and redflags.if they deploy a safety car then the position of the cars at next restart should be based on car position 5 laps prior to deployment safety car to prevent teams gaming the system.

well, they were used in Q1, Q2 and in the race some drivers put them on as well. Problem with wet is it's very bad slow tire because Pirelli use much harder rubber compound for full wet tire compared with inter. Which is opposite to what you'd expect. But they seemingly use much harder rubber simply because their technology is so poor, they can't address overheating and excessive wear any other way than using much harder rubber compound.

[search]

well, they were used in Q1, Q2 and in the race some drivers put them on as well. Problem with wet is it's very bad slow tire because Pirelli use much harder rubber compound for full wet tire compared with inter. Which is opposite to what you'd expect. But they seemingly use much harder rubber simply because their technology is so poor, they can't address overheating and excessive wear any other way than using much harder rubber compound.

Tsunoda was about 10s faster on full wets than those on Intermediates, so in the right conditions they can be the better tire.

But yes, problem is, that those conditions necessary quickly lead to a neutralization of the race anyway, so most times it makes more sense to not stop for them.

[Ken27]

If it was LH who drove that race, everyone would be calling this the greatest drive of all time. But it's not so the magnitude of this win is downplayed to diminish Max. It's absolutely clear we have never seen talent like Max in F1 history. He is undisputed GOAT. The best driver debate should focus on the category below Max, who is beyond reproach.

1. Max Verstappen


<Massive gap>

2. Lewis
3. Schumacher

Nah it's not the same. He was getting dropped by ocon at certain points before the red flag. The conditions came to him and he executed.

Be objective please.

What by a couple of seconds while getting his tires in the window? Ocon was being reeled in before the second safety car. Max started from P17 in the 2nd best car, it's objectively a better drive than Lewis who started P4 in the fastest car in 2008.

[search]

If it was LH who drove that race, everyone would be calling this the greatest drive of all time. But it's not so the magnitude of this win is downplayed to diminish Max. It's absolutely clear we have never seen talent like Max in F1 history. He is undisputed GOAT. The best driver debate should focus on the category below Max, who is beyond reproach.

1. Max Verstappen


<Massive gap>

2. Lewis
3. Schumacher

Nah it's not the same. He was getting dropped by ocon at certain points before the red flag. The conditions came to him and he executed.

Be objective please.

What by a couple of seconds while getting his tires in the window? Ocon was being reeled in before the second safety car. Max started from P17 in the 2nd best car, it's objectively a better drive than Lewis who started P4 in the fastest car in 2008.

no, he was extending the gap on Verstappen. Here's the screenshot from Tsunoda's pit exit on lap 30 (as reference for my post above, but can be used for OCO/VER as well) in comparison to lap 31, just when the SC was deployed

[basti313]

That was the lap in which Ver was wide in one corner.