2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

[Formula 1 fan 1996]

Is there any difference in power when comparing Ferrari and Mercedes engines?

[ScuderiaLeo]

Any insights into the relationship with Lewis and Ricky Adami his race engineer?
I think Lewis is going to just wing it in the first race in terms of making adjustments in the car.
I do not think he is on top of things just yet. Just my hunch.
He is still learning the terminologies for the parts on the car and the systems and could have a little lag at times when you need instant feedback to optimize in real time.
I see more blue flags violations and box box confusions!

Adami is an extremely experienced engineer, over 10x more so than Leclerc's, and in my opinion one of the better ones in F1. He is typically very concise.

While I'm sure Hamilton will have some moments of misunderstanding, I don't anticipate any conflict between him and Adami.

[Fakepivot]

Is there any difference in power when comparing Ferrari and Mercedes engines?

This i like to know the most, engines, all these tech anaylises we get from media and f1 officals mostly aero there so very little about engines.. maybe next year they can expose more about these engines since it won't be same.

[bluechris]

I saw again as much laps as i was able to see from this test because we didn't have the ability to be constantly on the driver we want. Except the obvious balance problems and the rear instability from the rear in corner exits, especially in the hands of Hamilton which is fine and he needs time, my only concern is the braking.
I just wonder how much time will they need to optimize that because it's a huge plus in Leclerc driving.

[Luscion]

https://autoracer.it/it/test-bahrain-mc ... es-redbull

AMuS saying "McLaren starts strong but Ferrari is just "immature", not slow"

The "defective" front, especially at lower temperatures, was one of the oldest problems that should have been solved. The Red was born to be more pointed, but this is not linked to the new pull-rod but to the load center moved forward . This creates a positive trend on front-limited circuits but is more problematic to compensate for on opposite tracks such as Bahrain.

Another significant aspect also thinking about Melbourne is the choice of the launch configuration that we will see in the first races. Although each car is born with its own aerodynamic mapping, it can rebalance oversteer or understeer, it should be noted that Ferrari has worked exclusively (and deliberately) with a rather light medium-downforce wing, similar to that of McLaren , but certainly lighter than Red Bull and Mercedes . This has amplified some problems of setup and stability in braking. The engineers must learn to know a car that will work differently from the past, still immature but whose potential does not seem to have been questioned. Leclerc was able to complete his work while Hamilton was stopped earlier by a defective part . The data collected will be analyzed in Maranello starting on Monday to begin work on the simulator towards the first race .

[ringo]

Is there any difference in power when comparing Ferrari and Mercedes engines?

This i like to know the most, engines, all these tech anaylises we get from media and f1 officals mostly aero there so very little about engines.. maybe next year they can expose more about these engines since it won't be same.

Hamilton stopped short of saying the Ferrari was the best engine. He said it was as good as the mercedes or something to that effect. I guess that was the most politically correct answer he could give. He went on to say the vibrations, sounds, and behavior of the PU is very different to what he is used to. My overall impression is the PU is equally or stronger than the merc and possibly on the electrical side.

Wish I remembered the article I read it from to share.

[Emag]

I do believe Ferrari at the very least should have a slight edge on peak power. I don’t doubt Ferrari’s capability of developing a very efficient aero platform, but these last couple of years they have been consistently on the top-end of speed charts, usually even better than lesser-loaded rivals.

[f1316]

Is there any difference in power when comparing Ferrari and Mercedes engines?

This i like to know the most, engines, all these tech anaylises we get from media and f1 officals mostly aero there so very little about engines.. maybe next year they can expose more about these engines since it won't be same.

Hamilton stopped short of saying the Ferrari was the best engine. He said it was as good as the mercedes or something to that effect. I guess that was the most politically correct answer he could give. He went on to say the vibrations, sounds, and behavior of the PU is very different to what he is used to. My overall impression is the PU is equally or stronger than the merc and possibly on the electrical side.

Wish I remembered the article I read it from to share.

The general consensus from what I’ve read is that the Ferrari, Mercedes and Honda are all very close in terms of total power (the Renault is down) but have different characteristics. The Ferrari may have marginally the most peak power and, with the small turbo, is quick out of the corners but sometimes loses out to the Honda at the end of the straight (presumably more to do with electrical power than ice). Mercedes is generally well balanced but possibly slightly behind these two on total power, although it does seem to be slightly more reliable.

I think there honestly isn’t much between the three on overall speed but they are quite different in terms of characteristics and it may be that one suits a driver more than another (I’m not saying this is the case here, just that it’s possible). How close they are already makes me excited about the supposed improvements for 2025 Ferrari has found to squeeze the last drops out of their engine, since it’s so close that a small improvement could mean a lot.

[LM10]

I think I'm being a complete realist here, but you dont want to admit it because I'm saying things you dont want to hear. Which is literally the exact opposite of being a realist.

You might be a complete realist, but not in my world when you say that McLaren “quite clearly” is a “decent chunk” away from Ferrari.
They look the readiest, that’s all in my opinion. Ferrari with the huge change (basically a concept change on the mechanical side at least) just needs more time to understand and get on top of things. You should know very well that even a slightest variable change can make a difference like day and night with these cars. Not to mention in such an early stage.

I am actually with Seanspeed on this.
If day2 to day3 temp changes can ruin the 'balance' of the car, it means the 'working window' is not wide enough.
That said, when the changes are drastic, not having a wide setup window when the car takes to the track for the first time, is normal, isn't it ?
All the 'big four' teams made suspension changes, and all of them struggled for balance going from day2 to day3, just that McLaren 'solved' their balance issues within first half of day3. Kudos to them. However, knee-jerk 'we are doomed' reactions or 'we are Ferrari, show some faith in this religion' etc (both typical of Tifosi crowd) is suited to 'vibes' media like facebook/insta , not suited to a 'technical' focussed forum like this.

If you want to talk technical then perhaps you should start off with acknowledging that the suspension changes the other big teams have made are by no means in the same ballpark as Ferrari’s.

McLaren and RBR both have been using a pull-rod front suspension concept since 2022 and Mercedes have not changed their push-rod concept they introduced last year either. Ferrari, on the other hand, have gone for a concept change by implementing a pull-rod front suspension. Their last experience with that dates back to 2015.

Maybe this explains a bit that it’s not necessarily the end of the world to have some little balance issues on a cold rainy night in Sto… I mean in Sakhir?

[Emag]

I am fairly certain the switch to pullrod doesn't inherently make a car worse or better mechanically by itself, however the big(ger) differences come from the fact that each of the configurations have different aero implications. Basically, the aero platform of a car that is designed with a push rod suspension at the front, will not work optimally on a car that has a pull-rod on the front (and vice-versa). Ferrari choose to go this way because they saw better development potential and a higher performance ceiling than the SF24 concept. A performance ceiling which they're obviously confident they can achieve or at least get very close to, otherwise they wouldn't have gone for this.

So basically, the tricky balance comes from the fact that Ferrari had to alter the aero profile of the car and they haven't found a consistently good configuration yet now that they switched to a pull-rod front. It's not like the pull-rod in itself is "hard to setup". It's still a suspension.

[LM10]

I am fairly certain the switch to pullrod doesn't inherently make a car worse or better mechanically by itself, however the big(ger) differences come from the fact that each of the configurations have different aero implications. Basically, the aero platform of a car that is designed with a push rod suspension at the front, will not work optimally on a car that has a pull-rod on the front (and vice-versa). Ferrari choose to go this way because they saw better development potential and a higher performance ceiling than the SF24 concept. A performance ceiling which they're obviously confident they can achieve or at least get very close to, otherwise they wouldn't have gone for this.

So basically, the tricky balance comes from the fact that Ferrari had to alter the aero profile of the car and they haven't found a consistently good configuration yet now that they switched to a pull-rod front. It's not like the pull-rod in itself is "hard to setup". It's still a suspension.

Their main reason switching to pull-rod surely was the aero benefit it brings to them and no doubt the new aero profile plays a big role in the balance difficulties too. What I meant with concept change on the mechanical side was that even though the aero profile might have changed, I wouldn’t consider this as an aero concept change. The overall idea remained or was re-adapted or even further sharpened from F1-75.

As for the setup part, for all I know and have heard until now a pull-rod suspension actually is harder to set up. Or at the very least it takes more time to do so simply because accessing it is more difficult.

[Xyz22]

I am fairly certain the switch to pullrod doesn't inherently make a car worse or better mechanically by itself, however the big(ger) differences come from the fact that each of the configurations have different aero implications. Basically, the aero platform of a car that is designed with a push rod suspension at the front, will not work optimally on a car that has a pull-rod on the front (and vice-versa). Ferrari choose to go this way because they saw better development potential and a higher performance ceiling than the SF24 concept. A performance ceiling which they're obviously confident they can achieve or at least get very close to, otherwise they wouldn't have gone for this.

So basically, the tricky balance comes from the fact that Ferrari had to alter the aero profile of the car and they haven't found a consistently good configuration yet now that they switched to a pull-rod front. It's not like the pull-rod in itself is "hard to setup". It's still a suspension.

I agree.
I also think that Charles and Lewis run two very different setups in their race sims.
With Charles the SF 25 performed very well in high speed and medium/high speed corners but not so much in low speed (especially when combined braking was required like in turn 10), while with Lewis it was the opposite with a better performance in low speed but absolutely terrible performance in high speed.

It seems they didn't expect this behavior and they didn't find a configuration that maximized the supposed potential of the car.

This is an example of SF 25 (with Charles) and SF 24. The laps should be at least comparable in terms of fuel and track conditions to an extent. You can see the significant improvement in high speed corners, but look at turn 8 and 10 where there is pretty much no gain compared to the SF 24 v1 of 12 months ago.


This is a comp between Leclerc and Hamilton which highlights the difference i was talking about. Even taking a lap from the 2nd day where the track was much better and there was more grip look how Charles has significantly slower apex speed in slow speed corners. The difference is massive and, in my opinion, can't be explained by a different driving style. They probably tried very different setups.