2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

[DJ Downforce]

EVERY major issue is due to the higher ride height issue. I will die on this hill

Why do you think this is even a Ferrari specific issue? There is still no evidence or even faint indication that they are forced to run more ride height than their competitors.

Can't get tyres in consistent window, lack of downforce at medium speed, bad traction, no turn in. RIDE HEIGHT issues cause all of this. It literally destroys the car, like a rapid decompression on an aircraft. It obliterates any balance you might have. Mercedes Brazil 2023

[Vanja #66]

Why do you think this is even a Ferrari specific issue? There is still no evidence or even faint indication that they are forced to run more ride height than their competitors.

they confirmed they are running higher than what they want to weeks ago

[deadhead]

Vanja how much trust/confidence do you have in the current technical group in general?

This big upgrade sounds impressive but we have to keep in mind that it’s mostly developed by the same people who created the problems in the first place…

[ScuderiaLeo]

I believe that they're bringing something very big for Barcelona and a bit for Imola, that matches up with what AR has said.

But I'm less confident it will give them the performance boost they need. Other teams will bring upgrades too and likely get a bit faster than now. Ferrari are also at a 70+ point deficit already, so they'd need to not only be consistently getting podiums but also consistently winning to have a chance at either title.

I'd love to be proven wrong of course

[catent]

Why do you think this is even a Ferrari specific issue? There is still no evidence or even faint indication that they are forced to run more ride height than their competitors.

they confirmed they are running higher than what they want to weeks ago

Does the Barcelona package aim to solve this problem in a fundamental way, allowing the car to run lower, at its optimal/designed ride height?

Or does it aim to solve the issue by providing greater downforce at the current, higher-than-ideal, ride height?

[catent]

I remain pessimistic because Leclerc said after Miami that they very much know what the issue is (likely ride height), but that they are still waiting for a solution.

If you recall the back-half of the 2024 season, when they encountered the issues with the Barcelona package, Leclerc remained positive and optimistic in the coming weeks despite their struggles because he genuinely knew they had identified their issues and found a solution (just a matter of time before it was implemented, which occurred at Monza). He was speaking to the fact that they understood the car and just needed time to implement the corrective updates.

Leclerc's current vibe/tone (and the words he is using to describe the situation) are a far cry from how he sounded last season leading up to the Monza update/leap in performance.

[venkyhere]

What exactly is the basic one-line-summary for the reason the team is forced to run with increased ride height ?
aero limitation ?
susp stiffness limitation ?

Other than wild speculation, not hearing any reliable info about 'what exactly is the root problem'. Any idea from your sources, Vanja ?

[ScuderiaLeo]

Translation:

Lewis was somewhat annoyed in the internal post-Miami debrief about the amount of time it took for Ferrari to respond to their radios. He didn't say anything too different from what he said to the media. "The team needs to make decisions faster" even though the swap didn't lead to reaching Antonelli. There is no dispute or problems between the drivers, similar to Albon and Sainz, they understand these things happen and had a normal discussion with each other.

[dialtone]

Translation:

Lewis was somewhat annoyed in the internal post-Miami debrief about the amount of time it took for Ferrari to respond to their radios. He didn't say anything too different from what he said to the media. "The team needs to make decisions faster" even though the swap didn't lead to reaching Antonelli. There is no dispute or problems between the drivers, similar to Albon and Sainz, they understand these things happen and had a normal discussion with each other.

Neither LEC nor HAM care about finishing 7th or 8th and IMHO the swap didn’t do anything and was executed in 3 laps total, which is quite quick compared to even the “it’s James” recent past, which also have been fairly messy. Could have been faster but ultimately irrelevant, they could only pass the Williams while on new tires and thanks to the 2nd VSC.

All of the outrage should have died out the moment HAM couldn’t gap LEC, and 3 laps don’t kill your tires, leaving aside Piastri and Norris fights with Max, Max himself went through 2 fights and still pitted after 27 laps with a stable gap from ANT.

Ferrari’s race was disappointing as a result but not because of these events, it’s just everyone being frustrated by a crap car. Hopefully they fix it but most anger is out of place in this sport.

[Xyz22]

I understand why Hamilton asked for the swap. He has been struggling the last few races, he had softer tyres and also helped Leclerc in China.
I totally understand his pov and every driver in his position would have asked for a team order. Having said that it was absolutely clear he didn't have any pace advantage over Leclerc even before the swap. Just check his laptime at the end of the first stint where he was lapping slower than Leclerc on mediums while he was on hards.

[basti313]

Why do you think this is even a Ferrari specific issue? There is still no evidence or even faint indication that they are forced to run more ride height than their competitors.

they confirmed they are running higher than what they want to weeks ago

But everyone wants to run lower. Every car would profit from running lower, I still do not see why this should be a different height than others.
It rather sounds they miscalculated on this and the aero simply does not fit the given ride height...still, I do not see if this is really a point you optimize or if it is not just no variable you can tune.

[basti313]

Neither LEC nor HAM care about finishing 7th or 8th and IMHO the swap didn’t do anything and was executed in 3 laps total, which is quite quick compared to even the “it’s James” recent past, which also have been fairly messy. Could have been faster but ultimately irrelevant, they could only pass the Williams while on new tires and thanks to the 2nd VSC.

Well I somehow disagree, but on another point:
Actually they should know how the tires will behave. They should have a calculation how Ham`s strategy unfolds and how the laptimes towards Lec and any other car around will develop depenging on fuel and tire wear. This they should know at the point of the pitstop, not when Ham is crying on the radio behind Lec.
They should also IMMEDIATELY see if Ham is driving over target, grilling his tires, or if this is how he can go to the end and reach the Willi or not. Same by the way goes for Lec, they should see in the data all the time if this is the pace they anticipate to make the strategy work.
So to me it looks like they were poorly set up on the strategy side.

[dialtone]

Neither LEC nor HAM care about finishing 7th or 8th and IMHO the swap didn’t do anything and was executed in 3 laps total, which is quite quick compared to even the “it’s James” recent past, which also have been fairly messy. Could have been faster but ultimately irrelevant, they could only pass the Williams while on new tires and thanks to the 2nd VSC.

Well I somehow disagree, but on another point:
Actually they should know how the tires will behave. They should have a calculation how Ham`s strategy unfolds and how the laptimes towards Lec and any other car around will develop depenging on fuel and tire wear. This they should know at the point of the pitstop, not when Ham is crying on the radio behind Lec.
They should also IMMEDIATELY see if Ham is driving over target, grilling his tires, or if this is how he can go to the end and reach the Willi or not. Same by the way goes for Lec, they should see in the data all the time if this is the pace they anticipate to make the strategy work.
So to me it looks like they were poorly set up on the strategy side.

That’s just not how you want it to work actually.

Hungary ‘22 and for at least 3 years their weakest point was not accounting actual conditions in their strategy models. They finally last year started integrating better live performance data in their strategy and still miss out some times, like needing HAM asking for softs during the sprint instead of mediums, they should have known but they adapted quickly and you want exactly that.

Ferrari strategy team only made a mistake in Australia this year, for the rest they’re above most.

[Vanja #66]

Does the Barcelona package aim to solve this problem in a fundamental way, allowing the car to run lower, at its optimal/designed ride height?

yes, mechanical solution to provide adequate setup windows and ride heights

My guess, pure guess, is aero package updates arrive first in imola as a part of smaller package announced by vasseur

Then these updates are used in monaco where evwryone rides higher because of bumps anyway, would make sense is my guess

But everyone wants to run lower. Every car would profit from running lower, I still do not see why this should be a different height than others.
It rather sounds they miscalculated on this and the aero simply does not fit the given ride height...still, I do not see if this is really a point you optimize or if it is not just no variable you can tune.

others run as low as what they are designed for, ferrari don't, hamilton mentioned 3mm higher which is brutal for these cars

susp stiffness limitation ?

this, but that part is known already, autoracer team confirmed a while ago

[Sphere3758]

I remain pessimistic because Leclerc said after Miami that they very much know what the issue is (likely ride height), but that they are still waiting for a solution.

If you recall the back-half of the 2024 season, when they encountered the issues with the Barcelona package, Leclerc remained positive and optimistic in the coming weeks despite their struggles because he genuinely knew they had identified their issues and found a solution (just a matter of time before it was implemented, which occurred at Monza). He was speaking to the fact that they understood the car and just needed time to implement the corrective updates.

Leclerc's current vibe/tone (and the words he is using to describe the situation) are a far cry from how he sounded last season leading up to the Monza update/leap in performance.

It probably hurts Leclerc more seeing Oscar and Lando in the title fight than Max last year. He knows they are much easier targets for him personally, but he does not have the machinery for it.