2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

[Vanja #66]

Fan theories contradicting known facts are my absolute favourite

[ScuderiaLeo]

Thoughts?

I can't tell if this is implying it'll be earlier or later than Silverstone...

[dialtone]

Thoughts?

I can't tell if this is implying it'll be earlier or later than Silverstone...

From the writing he seems to just be tempering that Ferrari won’t be 1s/lap faster in silverstone just because of the suspension, and/or that there’s no firm date for it.

[DJ Downforce]

Thoughts?

I can't tell if this is implying it'll be earlier or later than Silverstone...

Are they doing a stream tonight? I assume they'll drop a new article early next week?

[Luscion]

Thoughts?

I can't tell if this is implying it'll be earlier or later than Silverstone...

From the writing he seems to just be tempering that Ferrari won’t be 1s/lap faster in silverstone just because of the suspension, and/or that there’s no firm date for it.

Yea, reading it, it sounds like the same news as before, floor in Canada or Austria, suspension in silverstone but dont expect ferrari to suddenly be at mclaren's level

[ringo]

More likely is that Lewis complained about a loose rear or lack of front grip during an early stint, and the team adjusted his FW in the pit stop. I want Lewis to succeed as much as anyone, but can we accept the adjustment is going to be longer than we all hoped? Unless Fred says they messed up the settings then it's all hearsay. AR reported there were no issues with Charles' or Lewis' car.

I have seen a lot of people say that Lewis' driving style doesn't suit the GE cars. I dunno if this is another one of those "the car is designed around x driver" myths or it might be age catching up, but hopefully with the rules reset next year, he can find a better pace.

Fred himself said there was something wrong.
He wont say what it is. They made changes to relieve something but probably didnt ask how much to change.
I think they assume Lewis doesn't know the car so they know how much clicks to put in anyway so why ask. That didn't work out.
The other issue is possibly floor damage.

I think generally Lewis is outdated in terms of driving technique. I say that as a fan.
The same goes for Alonso and Hulk.
Lewis will do well once the car's rear is planted and be unbeatable. The problem is when the rear is not planted. The younger drivers do not need to drive as much on feeling or feedback. They can push and throw the car more with less hesitation because theyre likely not waiting for a feedback. That's my observation. The stiffer platform and the low profile tyre just requires a technique that Hamilton does not possess by instinct. When you are not driving by instinct you are going to lose some milliseconds per corner.

In the grand scheme Lewis' problem is noticable but very minor given the circumstances.
His points gap to Charles is norrowest teammate gap on the grid second only to Oscar and Lando; both in the same car for over 2 years. I have not checked it, but i suspect Carlos was not this close on points at race 9 either. Even worse when he just joined Ferrari.
Charles was not this close to Vettel at race 9 when he just joined etc.
So Lewis is not doing bad. Doing a decent job. But there is a lot of noise, and he is judged unfairly because of the attention he brings, the media pundits who are envious, and generally fans waiting decades for some kind of downfall or unravelling.
He wont improve in this generation's car. Only if it drives at the limit where the feeling does not fluctuate as much so he doesnt have guess what's going to happen.
I don't know why his 2023 was so good. Or if it was that George was having a bad year.

It’s always curious how the so-called balanced takes start with “I’m a fan, but...” and then go on to describe the driver as outdated, instinctively inferior and basically past it. Sounds less like fandom and more like an excuse to downgrade a 7-time world champion under the cover of objectivity.

If Lewis is truly struggling, it’s in a car not designed around him, with limited input so far and still the gap to Leclerc is minimal. That says more about Hamilton’s level than any theory about instinct or generational driving styles.

Quite the contrary. I did not say he is inferior.
Carlos Sainz drove the ferrari well more or less instinctively. He is now in a Williams and is nit doing that. Nothing to do with an innate defficiency. Hamilton may well get used to the Ferrari cars by next year. But what I see from the onboards is he makes more corrections, and there is a hint of hesitation to lean on the car. That's just what I see. Not saying it's law. It's open to debate or interpretation.
He was driving better in last years Mercedes despite the poorer results. That car was just more unpredictable than the Ferrari, but he knew how it worked and how to manipulate the setup.
And I do agree with your last sentence. But it's not just down to a car not being designed around him. There is a paradigm shift in F1 with driving taking place. The simulation generation is just doing things that much better and different, that works well with these super stiff cars.
If the suspension upgrade gives Hamilton the feeling he wants, he may well smoke Charles like the China sprint, we just don't know. But as it stands Lewis is not operating the car from intincts.
Even in the practice sessions. He doesnt complete as many competitive laps. He spends a lot of time twiddling with the car. Maybe he does a sector here or there, then slows and adjusts, never fully on it from out the gate. And yes that may be down to him not participating in years of development, but it is what I see objectively.

[deadhead]

I can't tell if this is implying it'll be earlier or later than Silverstone...

From the writing he seems to just be tempering that Ferrari won’t be 1s/lap faster in silverstone just because of the suspension, and/or that there’s no firm date for it.

Yea, reading it, it sounds like the same news as before, floor in Canada or Austria, suspension in silverstone but dont expect ferrari to suddenly be at mclaren's level

McLaren’s level is simply not attainable this year, but regardless they just need to get the car within a tenth and let the drivers work out the rest, but not sure if they can even do that.

[catent]

More likely is that Lewis complained about a loose rear or lack of front grip during an early stint, and the team adjusted his FW in the pit stop. I want Lewis to succeed as much as anyone, but can we accept the adjustment is going to be longer than we all hoped? Unless Fred says they messed up the settings then it's all hearsay. AR reported there were no issues with Charles' or Lewis' car.

I have seen a lot of people say that Lewis' driving style doesn't suit the GE cars. I dunno if this is another one of those "the car is designed around x driver" myths or it might be age catching up, but hopefully with the rules reset next year, he can find a better pace.

Fred himself said there was something wrong.
He wont say what it is. They made changes to relieve something but probably didnt ask how much to change.
I think they assume Lewis doesn't know the car so they know how much clicks to put in anyway so why ask. That didn't work out.
The other issue is possibly floor damage.

I think generally Lewis is outdated in terms of driving technique. I say that as a fan.
The same goes for Alonso and Hulk.
Lewis will do well once the car's rear is planted and be unbeatable. The problem is when the rear is not planted. The younger drivers do not need to drive as much on feeling or feedback. They can push and throw the car more with less hesitation because theyre likely not waiting for a feedback. That's my observation. The stiffer platform and the low profile tyre just requires a technique that Hamilton does not possess by instinct. When you are not driving by instinct you are going to lose some milliseconds per corner.

In the grand scheme Lewis' problem is noticable but very minor given the circumstances.
His points gap to Charles is norrowest teammate gap on the grid second only to Oscar and Lando; both in the same car for over 2 years. I have not checked it, but i suspect Carlos was not this close on points at race 9 either. Even worse when he just joined Ferrari.
Charles was not this close to Vettel at race 9 when he just joined etc.
So Lewis is not doing bad. Doing a decent job. But there is a lot of noise, and he is judged unfairly because of the attention he brings, the media pundits who are envious, and generally fans waiting decades for some kind of downfall or unravelling.
He wont improve in this generation's car. Only if it drives at the limit where the feeling does not fluctuate as much so he doesnt have guess what's going to happen.
I don't know why his 2023 was so good. Or if it was that George was having a bad year.

It’s always curious how the so-called balanced takes start with “I’m a fan, but...” and then go on to describe the driver as outdated, instinctively inferior and basically past it. Sounds less like fandom and more like an excuse to downgrade a 7-time world champion under the cover of objectivity.

If Lewis is truly struggling, it’s in a car not designed around him, with limited input so far and still the gap to Leclerc is minimal. That says more about Hamilton’s level than any theory about instinct or generational driving styles.

It is breathtaking to see you complain about a perceived lack of objectivity from other posters, after that extremely subjective, baseless post you made a page or two back.

… why aren’t Ferrari putting more focus on him [Hamilton] instead? And I’m not saying Leclerc is a bad driver, he’s fast.. for sure, but if they keep developing the car with his preferences in mind, they’ll just keep getting the same outcome.. no real title shot. If Leclerc is truly as adaptable as people claim then he should be able to adjust.

[Seanspeed]

It’s always curious how the so-called balanced takes start with “I’m a fan, but...” and then go on to describe the driver as outdated, instinctively inferior and basically past it. Sounds less like fandom and more like an excuse to downgrade a 7-time world champion under the cover of objectivity.

If Lewis is truly struggling, it’s in a car not designed around him, with limited input so far and still the gap to Leclerc is minimal. That says more about Hamilton’s level than any theory about instinct or generational driving styles.

Because it's completely inconceivable that somebody could be a fan of somebody while also being objective and acknowledging they are simply not as good as they used to be?

It's wild how so many of y'all confuse being a 'fan' and being a 'fanboy'. It's only when you're a fanboy that you become the type where you've emotionally invested yourself into defending a person/team/thing with absolute reckless abandon, no matter reality, and to your own complete embarrassment quite often. Being a mere 'fan' doesn't involve any of that.

Lewis is clearly struggling, and to blame it on the car not being designed for him is lame. He was already getting beat by Russell last year in a team he'd been with for a VERY long time and with literal unprecedented success and many championships. The gap to Leclerc is also not minimal whatsoever. Actual on-track performance deficit has been pretty big overall. And more time with the car and team isn't improving his situation. Quite the opposite. He's not embarrassing himself, but I dont think it's a hot take to say that Sainz was a small step better than he was versus Leclerc. And it's also very worth noting that Leclerc is, in my opinion at least, probably the 2nd best driver on the grid. So a very hard teammate to be up against and will be exaggerating any decline of Lewis to some degree or another.

[El_KaPpa]

Fred himself said there was something wrong.
He wont say what it is. They made changes to relieve something but probably didnt ask how much to change.
I think they assume Lewis doesn't know the car so they know how much clicks to put in anyway so why ask. That didn't work out.
The other issue is possibly floor damage.

I think generally Lewis is outdated in terms of driving technique. I say that as a fan.
The same goes for Alonso and Hulk.
Lewis will do well once the car's rear is planted and be unbeatable. The problem is when the rear is not planted. The younger drivers do not need to drive as much on feeling or feedback. They can push and throw the car more with less hesitation because theyre likely not waiting for a feedback. That's my observation. The stiffer platform and the low profile tyre just requires a technique that Hamilton does not possess by instinct. When you are not driving by instinct you are going to lose some milliseconds per corner.

In the grand scheme Lewis' problem is noticable but very minor given the circumstances.
His points gap to Charles is norrowest teammate gap on the grid second only to Oscar and Lando; both in the same car for over 2 years. I have not checked it, but i suspect Carlos was not this close on points at race 9 either. Even worse when he just joined Ferrari.
Charles was not this close to Vettel at race 9 when he just joined etc.
So Lewis is not doing bad. Doing a decent job. But there is a lot of noise, and he is judged unfairly because of the attention he brings, the media pundits who are envious, and generally fans waiting decades for some kind of downfall or unravelling.
He wont improve in this generation's car. Only if it drives at the limit where the feeling does not fluctuate as much so he doesnt have guess what's going to happen.
I don't know why his 2023 was so good. Or if it was that George was having a bad year.

It’s always curious how the so-called balanced takes start with “I’m a fan, but...” and then go on to describe the driver as outdated, instinctively inferior and basically past it. Sounds less like fandom and more like an excuse to downgrade a 7-time world champion under the cover of objectivity.

If Lewis is truly struggling, it’s in a car not designed around him, with limited input so far and still the gap to Leclerc is minimal. That says more about Hamilton’s level than any theory about instinct or generational driving styles.

It is breathtaking to see you complain about a perceived lack of objectivity from other posters, after that extremely subjective, baseless post you made a page or two back.

… why aren’t Ferrari putting more focus on him [Hamilton] instead? And I’m not saying Leclerc is a bad driver, he’s fast.. for sure, but if they keep developing the car with his preferences in mind, they’ll just keep getting the same outcome.. no real title shot. If Leclerc is truly as adaptable as people claim then he should be able to adjust.

Fair enough. I’ll leave it at that.

[Farnborough]

The attributes in mechanical setup this chassis is currently "levelled" at will be useful at Canada circuit to likely make a more rounded performance from them.

Staccato track radius generally, shorter corners, less time at peak lateral, curb "acceptance" all should suit this current iteration.

Accepting their acknowledged limitations in mechanical, if observed and built towards, rather than trying to make it do what it really doesn't accept because of those limitations, the way to maximise for both driver performance.

[Space-heat]

The attributes in mechanical setup this chassis is currently "levelled" at will be useful at Canada circuit to likely make a more rounded performance from them.

Staccato track radius generally, shorter corners, less time at peak lateral, curb "acceptance" all should suit this current iteration.

Accepting their acknowledged limitations in mechanical, if observed and built towards, rather than trying to make it do what it really doesn't accept because of those limitations, the way to maximise for both driver performance.

T2 will be the SF25 biggest issue, if they can minimize the time lost to the other top 3, we will go well.


On the Lewis discussion, it would be great if we could all avoid having to take extreme stances on the drivers. We all have a preference, and I assume if the preference is out of the running for whatever reason we'd all support the other. I don't think anyone is doubting Lewis' pedigree and hopeful potential but the numbers are clear that he is lagging behind Charles atm. There is no need to put down one driver to compensate another. The team want Lewis to succeed or why bring him here and pay him a boat load of money. Fred supports Lewis and tries to protect where possible in the media. Charles and Lewis get along and cooperate (see Miami for Charles, and Spain for Lewis) when team orders come in. Hopefully they can push each other once the car is competitive later in the year.

[Luscion]

New suspension at Canadian GP?

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/shou ... /10729495/

Ahead of the Canadian Grand Prix, where Ferrari is planning on introducing a new floor and rear suspension, the team doesn’t want to keep its hopes up. Even in Maranello, the SF-25 is branded a ‘bad car’, and the next updates are expected to improve the situation without actually turning it around.

[Vanja #66]

What a joke of a reporter

[DJ Downforce]

What a joke of a reporter

Shhhh let us have some hope