2025 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

[Henk_v]

As far as I understand Ford isn't delivering the ICE, that's RBPT ... and RB poached a lot of clever minds for that project (from MB, Fer). Ford at least started off as a electrifying partner, which is gonna be a large part of the power next year.
So as to the ICE I'm not really worried, it's rather the ERS and mapping where they might be on the backfoot to the big OEM's.
But who knows ...

I thought RBR made several poachings from Honda itself, for their RBPT project - both ICE and electrical side. I don't remember the details, but the 'takeaway' from reading news items from a few years ago was that the 'core' of the RBPT is ex-Honda engineers, and the poachings from Mercedes were fill-ins. Subject to correction, of course.

Yeah .. you could be right, as you said it was all a while back and we don't know about movement afterwards the initial startup.
But all in all, it's not a bunch of hobby enthusiasts that's building up the ICE.

Even at the time they signed Ford it was clear Ford was not going to make any fundamental contribution. And Ford might not be too thrilled to develop IP not road relevant. It's likely they will help with some power electronics stuff.

And they might leverage their buying power in their supply chain to get RBPT what they need which is common practice in such cases.

[Bill]

do you guys ever listen or read ,Horner has said ford are also helping with ice because they have so much knowledge an good infrastructure .initially they were supposed to focus on electrical part only.

[venkyhere]

car is awful, what a surprise

Exactly as predicted tbh.

Despite being a lost cause, analyzing :
a. losing 1.5 tenths through T2
b. losing almost nothing through T3-T4
c. losing 3.5 tenths through T5-T6-T7
d. losing only 0.5 tenths through T8-T9-T10-T11
e. losing 5 tenths through T12-T13-T14
f. losing 2 tenth through lower engine mode

The terrible - even without looking at onboards, just looking at track layout, a,c,e show how terrible the understeer in long radius corners is, when high steering angle has to be held for long duration.
The not so terrible - surprised by d, tells me the car isn't suffering when the steering angle has to be lesser.

What is the root cause of all this - whenever the car has to 'grip' for a long duration with reasonable slip angle, the % contribution by mechanical grip is pathetically poor. The car almost entirely relies on aero grip, and that's why it's not so bad in the high speed (>250kph) turns with gentler slip angle requirement.
Even if they manage to magically fix the car overnight, the baked-in-weakness in the fundamental mechanical design cannot get rid of a,c,e - can only reduce the size of the hit taken. In other words, no matter what magic fixes happen, this car won't qualify quicker than 0.7-0.8s off the McLarens, on this track.

Which shouldn't be a surprise. Those of us who have some vague insight into the basic nature of the RB20 & RB21, already know this. This track doesn't have enough high speed corners or straights, to balance out the time deltas a bit and mask the disadvantage, hence 'maximum exposure' of the weakness.

(Edit : they have to reduce rear wing which artificially sharpens the nose indirectly, and pay the price with tyre wear, inorder to provide any kind of 'balance' to the car and qualify in the top 5 positions; and ask the drivers to 'deal with it' when it rains for the race. That seems the only way, without 'balance', all that downforce is useless)

[Wouter]

Preview by Dr. Helmut Marko.
Subtitles are English.

[TNTHead]

Correlation issues still present. That could influence the development of next years car heavily...not good.

https://x.com/dr_obbs/status/1951364689 ... nhQPQ&s=19

[Wouter]

Correlation issues still present. That could influence the development of next years car heavily...not good.

https://x.com/dr_obbs/status/1951364689 ... nhQPQ&s=19

.
How come in Silverstone was nothing wrong? Just one FP and the car was fine.

[TNTHead]

Good question, change of front wing is quite a sensitive part since it massively influences the downward flow. Just my 2 cents.

[pantherxxx]

This car is garbage and only look fast because of Verstappen. No one else would have get poles and podiums with this dog kf a car. Red Bull should sign some new engineers to replace Marshall and Newey, and give them whatever money they ask.

[Valencia2012]

The car looks horrible, how could they screw it up so badly? It just seems that the car gets worse the longer the season goes on. Car seems to be even worse then last years version.

[euv2]

Getiing into Q3 is going to be tricky, what a present for Max on his 200th gp with the team. One of the worst practice weekends in a long time so far.

[Vettel165]

How does Max have 2 wins and 4 pole position with this car, a true legend. Its a shitbox. Also 2024 was a miracle.

[Sergej]

I did expect a bad performance from Red Bull here, but this bad is frankly unacceptable. They also ditched the new front wing, another very bad sign.

[TNTHead]

Lower midfield right now....May be they can get balance back with the old front wing come qualy.

[Waz]

Lol, acting as if the car was so bad for every race and Max is just god, while ignoring that nearly every team, including McLaren have brought upgrades in the last couple of GPs.

Red Bull are dangling their balls in the pool without a clue what to do.

[venkyhere]

I did expect a bad performance from Red Bull here, but this bad is frankly unacceptable. They also ditched the new front wing, another very bad sign.

The older Monaco wing has gone back to the car. The only change is the uppermost element now has a gurney added.