2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

This forum contains threads to discuss teams themselves. Anything not technical about the cars, including restructuring, performances etc belongs here.
User avatar
ScuderiaLeo
0
Joined: 20 May 2024, 15:29
Location: Mexico

Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post

bluechris wrote:
22 Sep 2025, 21:31
Vasseur needs to stay, no matter how much time will pass to fix the team. We had change so many guys in the past with no obvious results in the end.
Ferrari needs a step back and put everything together right but this needs time, time that noone is willing to accept and we fell in non ending circle many years now.

And for Christ sake, DON'T even think to bring the toxic Horny in the team. I really never liked this guy.
Horner would never work with Ferrari. Nothing against him but they wouldn't be a good fit from what we know about both of them. Also there were multiple reports when this was a bigger discussion that there was a strong internal opposition to Horner potentially coming to the team. Vasseur isn't liked by the fans right now but he is liked by the team and the drivers, that's more important than him being bad at PR.

Jambier wrote:
22 Sep 2025, 20:24
And I may add... that they should chase Verstappen
I think he would have won some races this year with this car.
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: The problem with Ferrari is the drivers, of course

We need some proper news to leak so we have something to discuss, this topic is turning into complete nonsense.

User avatar
Chuckjr
37
Joined: 24 Feb 2012, 08:34
Location: USA

Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post

deadhead wrote:
22 Sep 2025, 16:38
It’s been pretty clear that Vassuer is not fit for this job for a while now but more and more people are slowly realizing the reality of the situation.

The whole thing feels like watching a train wreck in slow motion.
Truth. 100%. =D>
Watching F1 since 1986.

User avatar
AR3-GP
390
Joined: 06 Jul 2021, 01:22

Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post

-----
Last edited by AR3-GP on 24 Sep 2025, 06:24, edited 1 time in total.
It doesn't turn.

User avatar
deadhead
76
Joined: 08 Apr 2022, 20:24

Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post

LEC has been carrying this team for years tho and continues to do so despite his mistakes, which are usually born out of desperation for finding more speed out of a machine that is simply too slow to compete at the top.

Of course it’s his fault for pushing beyond the limits of the car, but really it doesn’t change much.

How many podiums would Ferrari have this season without him behind the wheel?

User avatar
AR3-GP
390
Joined: 06 Jul 2021, 01:22

Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post

-----
Last edited by AR3-GP on 24 Sep 2025, 06:24, edited 1 time in total.
It doesn't turn.

Xyz22
Xyz22
124
Joined: 16 Feb 2022, 20:05

Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post

AR3-GP wrote:
23 Sep 2025, 21:43
deadhead wrote:
23 Sep 2025, 21:18
LEC has been carrying this team for years tho and continues to do so despite his mistakes, which are usually born out of desperation for finding more speed out of a machine that is simply too slow to compete at the top.

Of course it’s his fault for pushing beyond the limits of the car, but really it doesn’t change much.

How many podiums would Ferrari have this season without him behind the wheel?
I'm not suggesting that many would do better than him or that there is anything to be done. Only that the comment from other poster shouldn't be dismissed out of hand. The field is like chess pieces. They are who they are and we can't change that. You can only watch them replay their strengths and weaknesses over and over again with little deviation, if history is anything to go by. We've seen each driver replay their "tropes" this year. Max in Spain. Lando's bottling company. Leclerc's crashes and lack of strategic nous. As I said, immutable chess pieces.

It is only an observation. Ferrari as a team are not where they want to be right now, and everyone has played their part in these unwanted outcomes.
So which races Max would have won with the SF 25?

User avatar
AR3-GP
390
Joined: 06 Jul 2021, 01:22

Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post

----

Leclerc is great. :mrgreen:
Last edited by AR3-GP on 24 Sep 2025, 06:26, edited 2 times in total.
It doesn't turn.

Xyz22
Xyz22
124
Joined: 16 Feb 2022, 20:05

Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post

AR3-GP wrote:
23 Sep 2025, 22:53
Xyz22 wrote:
23 Sep 2025, 22:18
AR3-GP wrote:
23 Sep 2025, 21:43


I'm not suggesting that many would do better than him or that there is anything to be done. Only that the comment from other poster shouldn't be dismissed out of hand. The field is like chess pieces. They are who they are and we can't change that. You can only watch them replay their strengths and weaknesses over and over again with little deviation, if history is anything to go by. We've seen each driver replay their "tropes" this year. Max in Spain. Lando's bottling company. Leclerc's crashes and lack of strategic nous. As I said, immutable chess pieces.

It is only an observation. Ferrari as a team are not where they want to be right now, and everyone has played their part in these unwanted outcomes.
So which races Max would have won with the SF 25?
You're wanting to get a trivial answer, but it's a complex question.

The trajectory of the weekend and the setup of the car also depends on the driver. The drivers judge where they think it's worth to compromise and where they want to gain time. Those calculations can be different and lead to different results and different levels of car performance being exploited.

One could speculate that other driver could put a Ferrari on pole in Baku with Mclaren out of the picture. One that is better at handling slippery conditions than others.

One could speculate that Canada looks different. Leclerc destroyed the car at T3 in FP1 and had to miss Friday, then make a mistake on his final run in Q3. It was hard to overtake there even if they had to LICO at the end.

One could speculate about Silverstone where Ferrari was very strong until the drivers made mistakes on the final Q3 run. Unlike RBR, Ferrari had proper wings for the rain. Hamilton is no longer in his prime but still manage to finish P4 while Leclerc is no reference in a wet race.

Maybe other driver gets pole in Monaco. Leclerc felt it was within the car and I don't recall the specifics but he indicated that he had mentally not taken full risk on one of the runs due to some other factor that I don't recall.

You shouldn't confuse winning with having the fastest car. The SF25 has not been clear fastest anywhere but we have seen some drivers can still squeeze out a win without the fastest car.
Do you realize that Leclerc is by far the fastest driver in Monaco?
About Canada, I suggest looking at the final stint though, where he was nowhere in terms of pace. That has nothing to do with the driver. A better result? Maybe, even likely, with a better weekend (same in Baku). Winning? Big nooope.

In the rain every car is around at least 1s slower than the McLarens.

User avatar
AR3-GP
390
Joined: 06 Jul 2021, 01:22

Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post

---- deleted.
It doesn't turn.

User avatar
ScuderiaLeo
0
Joined: 20 May 2024, 15:29
Location: Mexico

Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post

The simple truth is we don't know how any other driver would do in the Ferrari, just like how we don't know if Leclerc would win the WDC in the McLaren even though many people rate him higher than their drivers. It's a completely different car with different characteristics and many drivers, this season especially have shown how difficult it is to adapt to new teams. People can argue for any case then because every driver has had amazing races and bad ones, and both can be used as proof for why they would or wouldn't do well. I can use Spain as the reasoning for why Verstappen would get too frustrated and crash in the Ferrari but that would be silly because Spain isn't Verstappen's baseline performance just like Baku isn't Leclerc's. Verstappen could certainly get the same results as Leclerc in the car, maybe he could even get more podiums, but winning races let alone multiple ones? I think that would also take some better weekend and race management than Ferrari has shown this year.

The one thing I am confident about is that Lec-Ham is a strong driver pairing as a whole and over the entire season if the team is underperforming they are not the primary reason.

Xyz22
Xyz22
124
Joined: 16 Feb 2022, 20:05

Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post

ScuderiaLeo wrote:
24 Sep 2025, 08:14
The simple truth is we don't know how any other driver would do in the Ferrari, just like how we don't know if Leclerc would win the WDC in the McLaren even though many people rate him higher than their drivers. It's a completely different car with different characteristics and many drivers, this season especially have shown how difficult it is to adapt to new teams. People can argue for any case then because every driver has had amazing races and bad ones, and both can be used as proof for why they would or wouldn't do well. I can use Spain as the reasoning for why Verstappen would get too frustrated and crash in the Ferrari but that would be silly because Spain isn't Verstappen's baseline performance just like Baku isn't Leclerc's. Verstappen could certainly get the same results as Leclerc in the car, maybe he could even get more podiums, but winning races let alone multiple ones? I think that would also take some better weekend and race management than Ferrari has shown this year.

The one thing I am confident about is that Lec-Ham is a strong driver pairing as a whole and over the entire season if the team is underperforming they are not the primary reason.
Strangely all the super hyped drivers arrive in Ferrari and they underperform compared to expectations...

User avatar
dans79
267
Joined: 03 Mar 2013, 19:33
Location: USA

Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post

Xyz22 wrote:
24 Sep 2025, 13:04
Strangely all the super hyped drivers arrive in Ferrari and they underperform compared to expectations...
That's because all the drivers have to learn the hard way that the team can't be trusted to do it job properly on a regular basis. Thus they have to take on the extra bourdon of tactical decisions! For example, everyone has heard the Plan A, B, C, D,E, F, etc etc debate going on between the drivers and the pit wall.

Leclerc in Singapore 2019 is a good example!
202 105 104 9 9 7

User avatar
deadhead
76
Joined: 08 Apr 2022, 20:24

Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post

No driver can win a race under normal conditions in the SF25.

Monaco is the only possible track and I don’t think anyone can beat LEC around there so if he couldn’t put it on pole it’s just not happening.

User avatar
ScuderiaLeo
0
Joined: 20 May 2024, 15:29
Location: Mexico

Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post

dans79 wrote:
24 Sep 2025, 13:50

That's because all the drivers have to learn the hard way that the team can't be trusted to do it job properly on a regular basis. Thus they have to take on the extra bourdon of tactical decisions! For example, everyone has heard the Plan A, B, C, D,E, F, etc etc debate going on between the drivers and the pit wall.

Leclerc in Singapore 2019 is a good example!
In all fairness to Ferrari their race strategies aren't terrible most of the time. They've had some brilliant ones like Saudi Arabia this year with Leclerc. Even Hungary, when you think about it, was a good strategy though the outcome was disappointing. Starting pole and finishing P4 is much better than starting P8 and ending P7 or whatever would've happened if they didn't go for that wild set-up.

The problem is when they do a strategy -- good or bad-- they don't explain to the driver why they went with that choice which only makes the driver angry and causes unnecessary tension between them and the team. Then everyone performs worse as a result.

It would take two seconds for Ferrari to say "we see graining on this tire so we can't use it" (or the equivalent in their Plan A, B, C language) but they sometimes don't even do that. The drivers ask for clarification and are met with silence.

Luscion
Luscion
119
Joined: 13 Feb 2023, 01:37

Re: 2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

Post

Not looking good at Ferrari, from Autoracer's Livestream
@matteobobbi discussed in the paddock with engineers from rival teams (notably McLaren) and the word is that the SF-25's problems with plank wear are bullshit. The reality is that it's simply a car that was badly born, a structural failure, and they are running at these ride heights to scrape performance. McLaren could do it too and gain another three-tenths.

Also according to Bobbi, he stated that the atmosphere within the Scuderia is toxic. All they do is hold meetings to say things like "ah, but you must check with this other department," etc. They waste an enormous amount of time and give the impression of doing everything they can to avoid losing their jobs rather than proposing real ideas and moving the team forward.
Speaking about the internal workings at Scuderia Ferrari, @GiulyDuchessa said that in Maranello, some engineers can't even get their ideas released because they are held back by their superiors. It's a shame because there is a lot of talent inside Ferrari. The proof is that every engineer who leaves Ferrari does an excellent job at another team.

Then there is the issue of attracting engineers. It seems no big names are on the horizon. The fact is, engineers are afraid to come because the Team Principal does not inspire confidence due to his managerial and contractual fragility.

According to @matteobobbi, the winter of 2026 will have to be very different. Ferrari will need to start being quiet, working in silence, because you get the feeling that the fans, after more than 18 years of waiting, will not tolerate another winter like the one that produced the SF-25.
The rear suspension has barely provided any gains for the car. The goal was to give the car more stability, especially during braking phases. But the results are clearly below expectations. All that time while the team could have done something more on the aerodynamics...
Summary: https://x.com/FerrariF1FRA/status/19709 ... afpHQ&s=19


Livestream:

https://www.youtube.com/live/ll9PLSjnmw ... tkxX9uUbzJ